Continuation Part 3 - Discussion of the Amanda Knox case

Status
Not open for further replies.
Dan O. said:
http://perugia-shock.blogspot.com/2008/06/happiness-in-hell.html

Anonymous said...
In December 2006 she posted a story on MySpace in which a young woman drugs and rapes another woman. It reads in part: “She fell on the floor, she felt the blood on her mouth and swallowed it. She couldn’t move her jaw and felt as if someone was moving a razor on the left side of her face.”

JUNE 27, 2008 12:43 PM
​
Click to expand...

What is the origin, the earliest post or article anywhere with this quote?
 
SA's story is based on false premises.

As already pointed out, he misunderstood the cellphone data. There is nothing placing Amanda anywhere near Piazza Grimana.
AFAIK the computer data shows there was a media playback initiated around 21:26, not a torrent download. There goes another one.
Amanda had lots of money and no reason to steal from anyone - SA's buying Guede's lies. Lies which have obvious motivation - Guede took the money.

The story SA believes in is very psychologically implausible to me, but more importantly it goes against the evidence. SA probably forgot, but Guede managed to sexually assault the victim, leaving traces in her body and on her underwear. If there was a 4 people fight in that room, why is it that only Guede left footprints, fingerprints and DNA?

See, pilot, it's all nice when SA is allowed to freely fantasize, avoiding the evidence he doesn't like, but as soon as real evidence comes into play, his argument is devastated in no time.

Interestingly there's no trace of fragrant Curatolo in SA's story. No mention of kitchen knife, either...

BTW, pilot, SA displayed such poor judgement of people with that sniffing of Curatolo nonsense and buying Guede's lies that I very much doubt his alleged credentials. Those poorly manipulated photos he tried to push don't raise respect, either.
 
Last edited:
RoseMontague said:
I wonder if we will see this in his book as well?
Click to expand...


If I were John Follain, I'd be asking myself three questions right now:

1) Why did the police/prosecutors feed me such lies and distortions?

2) Why did I not follow proper journalistic processes and double-check (and, wherever possible, double-source) each piece of information before going to print?

3) How embarrassed do I feel right now, and can I possibly do a successful reverse-ferret in my book to present Knox and Sollecito as victims of incompetence, malpractice and injustice?
 
PDiGirolamo said:
I'm very sorry for your loss Randy. He knows you loved him and you were there for him. He loved you unconditionally just like you loved him with all your heart.

Take care.
Click to expand...


And me too. Although this probably counts as "derailing the thread" and we'll all get told off....... :mad:
 
LondonJohn said:
I'm with you: I strongly tend to believe that Follain (and virtually every other journalist covering this case up to the end of the first trial) got nearly all of his "inside information" from police and/or prosecutors. As has been discussed here previously, journos are far, far more likely to cosy up to law enforcement personnel than anyone connected to the defence. It's pretty clear to me that Follain based his reportage articles almost exclusively on the tidbits of juicy information that he was fed by prosecutors/police. The apparent fact that these prosecutors/police misled Follain (and other journos) with deliberately falsified information about Knox and Sollecito - information that was bound to result in negative press for Knox/Sollecito and positive spin for the prosecution case.
Click to expand...

I wonder what the hell they were thinking by making that Follain article the subject of the slander charge? They didn't have to do it that way, as I recall going through it there were more straightforward statements that didn't include a brutally distorted translation like that. Especially old Youtubes I watched on TV. The charge was filed right before the verdict, so why pick a rather innocuous article that includes potential trouble and is almost eighteen months old?

I wonder what John Follain would say about all this now? I wonder why he chose to quote Peggy Ganong after the trial?
 
RoseMontague said:
I wonder if we will see this in his book as well?
Click to expand...

So far I have not been impressed with any of the numerous books written about this case. I doubt I will feel any differently about this book.

The same with journalists. The 24/7 news cycle has replaced accuracy with being the first to report about a specific event. Fact checking and revision can always happen later - if in fact it ever does.
 
christianahannah said:
I have seen an archived article of The Sunday Times dated January 13, 2008 with the same quote but this article is attributed to no author.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/europe/article3159584.ece
Click to expand...

Based on the timeline, the blatant errors seem rather consistent.
1. 7pm: Meredith Kercher watches a DVD at the home of her friend Sophie Purton

2. 8.40pm: Amanda Knox is seen leaving Raffaele Sollecito’s home by a Polish student

3. 8.43pm: CCTV shows Knox walking towards the cottage that she lived in with Kercher
Click to expand...
 
christianahannah said:
So far I have not been impressed with any of the numerous books written about this case. I doubt I will feel any differently about this book.

The same with journalists. The 24/7 news cycle has replaced accuracy with being the first to report about a specific event. Fact checking and revision can always happen later - if in fact it ever does.
Click to expand...

I am thinking about a book just covering the media, blogs, and forum discussions.
 
RoseMontague said:
I am thinking about a book just covering the media, blogs, and forum discussions.
Click to expand...

That thought has entered my mind quite often. I don't want to know the people personally who post on forums (some are quite strange), however, the sub-story involving this case and the personalities involved (and why they are involved) would make for interesting reading.
 
LondonJohn said:
* Even though some (including SA) say that Massei contains an error in linking this particular base station to Sollecito's apartment, the same "error" is actually repeated explicitly three times in the report (my bolding):


(Massei, p323, English trans)


Is it really a repeated error, or does the base station at Via dell’Aquila 5-Torre dell’Acquedotto sector 3 actually provide signal to Sollecito's apartment?
Click to expand...

It really and truly does. On Nov. 2, 2007, Amanda made a series of phone calls between 12:07 and 12:20. All went through the Aquila sector 3 cell except the first, which went through the Aquila sector 9 cell. Amanda says she was at Raffaele's apartment when she made these calls, and computer records substantiate this claim. Here is how Frank summarized the expert testimony of September 26, 2009:

What did Amanda Knox tell us? That after finding that strange situation at home, after the shower taken with Meredith dead in the house, she went back to Raffaele's place, where he was having a breakfast?

And indeed at around noon, Raffaele's computer does have some activity: someone goes online. I guess today is the day for speaking about this, since a computer session, at the trial, revealed similar, interesting details. Even more interesting than this, actually.

We'll talk about them, but now let's see this one. Let's see who was surfing the web that day.

At 12:20 someone opens Gmail and sends 1 or 2 mails. Can it be Amanda?

To clarify our doubts let's see next action.

At 12:22:16 someone opens the website facebook.com/david.johnsrud. I'm not sure it was Raffaele. Probably it was Amanda, still in touch with her ex-boyfriend DJ, who was in that moment spending his year abroad in China.
 
Last edited:
6 years is a long time...

Hi PDiGirolamo, LondonJohn and others.
Thanks for the condolences, I sincerely appreciate it. We are kinda like a family here, even if some of us people are strange, as an old Doors song mentions. I know that I am.:)

To get my mind away from my dog Tang's death, I went out and had a few goblets of sangria and a couple of handfulls of dollar tacos at Don Antonio's in West L.A. It helped...

Now why do I bring this up, you might ask? Well, a buncha young bucks and chicks that surf joined me for dinner. Being a wise old surfer, with much experience under my belt, I busted out a few photo's from a surftrip back in 2005 that I found this afternoon while looking for some pix of my dog Tang. When I showed the crew the surfpix, we discussed the technical aspects of my surfing, for I am tryin' to help these young dudes and chicks surf better and rip. And something dawned on me.

These photographs, as hot as they were, are 6 years old. That's a looong time ago. 6 years of pumping swells, hot summers, and good times have come and gone since that surftrip I took back in the fall of 2005 to the North Shore of Hawaii.

Can you recall something significent from 2005 also? From 6 years ago?

Rudy Guede was convicted of murder in the case we discuss. He was origianlly sentenced to 30 years in prison, I believe.

Then for some reason, of which I don't have the details in front of me right now and do not feel like digging them up, Rudy Guede got a 6 years reduction in his prison sentence. If I was the father of Meredith Kercher I would have been livid! What does that scumbag deserve 6 years off for? Strangly, the prosecution, IIRC, did not even contest this reduction!

So the guy is gonna get outta jail 6 years earlier. 6 years, which is a lot of time reduced from his sentence. And then he also got the, what is it the fast track trial break, so lets cut off 8 years too. This completely sucks!. His sentence has been basically cut in half, even though he did leave his DNA, well you know where...

I still can not get over the 6 year uncontested discount, as you might be able to see. For surely the prosecution knew Rudy Guede would also get that fast track trial discount also, and still did not contest that 6 year discount. :boggled:

Goodnight,
RW



PS - I shed many a tear today, in private and in the company of my brother and sister, though you might not know it by reading my postings today. Didn't do so in front of the friends I was with tonight though, just kept kinda jokin' around, though I let them know that my lil doggie Tang had died.
I guess we all have different ways of publicly dealing with our grief. Sound familiar?

Thanks again everyone! :)
RW
 
Last edited:
Charlie Wilkes said:
It really and truly does. On Nov. 2, 2007, Amanda made a series of phone calls between 12:07 and 12:20. All went through the Aquila sector 3 cell except the first, which went through the Aquila sector 9 cell. Amanda says she was at Raffaele's apartment when she made these calls, and computer records substantiate this claim.
Click to expand...


Have we ever gotten a good map of cell coverage in Perugia? If someone is in that town with a GPS equipped smart phone, I can point them to a site running a mapping project.

Sectors 3 and 9 of a cell may cover the same geographic area. A cell tower is at a corner of a hexagonal grid with separate antennas covering the 3 adjacent hexagonal cells. To handle more traffic they will add more sectors to the tower covering the same cells but using different frequencies. Sectors 3, 6 and 9 would then all overlap on the same cell
 
christianahannah said:
I have seen an archived article of The Sunday Times dated January 13, 2008 with the same quote but this article is attributed to no author.
Click to expand...

Thanks Christiana! I've not seen this one in long time.

Follain 1/88 Times said:
Eyewitnesses and CCTV recorded Knox walking to the cottage at 8.40pm before Kercher arrived home.

8.43pm: CCTV shows Knox walking towards the cottage that she lived in with Kercher.
Click to expand...


It seems to me in Italy, or at least Perugia, they can find themselves a 'witness' to just about anything. There was a 'witness' that said Patrick's bar was closed the night of the murder, here's a 'witness' seeing Amanda around the cottage roughly the time of the CCTV capture and conflicting with Joanna Popovic.

Follain 1/88 Times said:
Precisely who among the four suspects originated, perpetrated or participated in the murder of Kercher remains unclear. Police believe a confession will finally crack the conflicting denials. In the meantime, Amanda Knox appears to have reverted to wholesome, confused all-American girl.
Click to expand...

Almost ten weeks after the murder and they're still pretending they had 'clear cut' video evidence of her at the scene. They musta known they needed a real confession bad. In April the Supreme Court threw out the worthless statements she signed. I wonder if Follain even read them? This kind of suggests he didn't. They don't really contradict each other as much as complement, giving a more complete picture of what she meant, especially the parts the cops didn't really want in the official ones she signed.

Follain 1/88 Times said:
There is no doubt that Knox has something to hide about the night that Meredith Kercher was murdered. She has contradicted herself repeatedly in the various versions of her story she has given to investigators.
Click to expand...

Francesca Bene knew what it meant, she said something like that it meant she was trying to help police, and later on she ended up getting slapped with a 'endangering the peace' charge for the 'Fifth Man' article. They should have been available on November 9th or so, when Matteini's ridiculous report was released.


Follain 1/88 Times said:
Assuming this is not simply adolescent grandstanding, on her Facebook page she reveals her interests are “men”. Her entry for “About Me” reads: “A lot of my friends say I’m a hippy, but I am thinking I am just weird. I don’t get embarrassed and therefore have very few social inhibitions… The bigger and scarier the roller coaster the better.” More prosaically, she loves the Beatles, the Harry Potter books and Monty Python movies.
Click to expand...

He was apparently aware of her Facebook page, would he have gotten this information online, or had it been taken down by January of '88? Perhaps a tabloid source? I recall reading somewhere her interests were 'boys' which sounds more like what a college girl would put down as opposed to 'men.' Could it have come from police? It sounds like the sort of thing they might release with some creative 'translating' like it appears they might have done with other items. The diary 'excerpts' seem to have undergone the same treatment as the ones Barbara Nadeau referred to, although he is a little less extravagant in describing them. Police creative 'translation' for both?

Here's where he lists his police and judicial sources, let us see if we can guess who they might be. I'll make mine invisible as not to unconsciously prejudice anyone else's speculations:

Follain Excerpts 1/88 Times said:
One man she may or may not have brought home is the Ivorian immigrant Guede, who, according to a senior investigator, “was crazy about Knox, he had a morbid interest in her. He was always seeking out white women and perhaps Knox attracted him because she was typically American”.
Click to expand...

Okayyyy....this is creepy. Someone convinced Guede was infatuated with Amanda. Napoleoni?

Follain Excerpts 1/88 Times said:
A senior Italian investigator, meeting her for the first time after the killing, says he was impressed by Knox’s “virgin-like beauty”. But in the same breath, he added that he was struck even more by the way she played with the truth. “Knox is very calculating. She lies shamelessly,” he said.
Click to expand...

Male...Giobbi? He was SCO from Rome, would he have been interviewed for this piece?

Follain Excerpts 1/88 Times said:
Perplexingly, according to a police source, Knox never spoke of Guede at all, “as if he didn’t exist”, yet they called each other on their mobile phones both before and after the murder.
Click to expand...

Ficarra? Wasn't she the one who pressed Amanda about Rudy?



Follain Excerpts 1/88 Times said:
From the very start, investigators suspected a woman had been involved in the murder. Meredith Kercher, naked save for a sweater pulled up above her chest, was almost completely covered by a quilt. A forensic expert confided that covering a corpse was a gesture of pity, more typical of a woman than a man.
Click to expand...

Dammit, who said this again, I forget. Giobbi?


Follain Excerpts 1/88 Times said:
That day, Knox’s face betrayed no sign of anguish or sorrow when police took her to the cottage to help them search it. Inside the cottage, when investigators asked her about the way Kercher may have died, Knox made the same gesture again and again: “She’d press her hands to her temples and shake her head, as if she was trying to empty her brain of something she’d been through,” a judicial source said, adding that she may well have succeeded in erasing “the most dramatic parts” of the night’s events.

“Knox was shouting one minute, and hugging a policeman for comfort the next. She kept making the same head-shaking gesture she’d made when police escorted her through the cottage, with her hands pressed to her forehead,” the judicial source said.
Click to expand...

Mignini

Follain Excerpts 1/88 Times said:
Giuliano Mignini, the prosecutor, has argued that blood on a tap in the bathroom was Knox’s and proved she was there on the night of the murder. Detectives believe Knox accused Lumumba to cover up for Guede, whose bloody fingerprints were on Kercher’s pillow. DNA samples on her body show he had sex with her. He has admitted to being in the cottage at the time she died, while denying he is guilty of her murder.
Click to expand...

Obviously.


Follain Excerpts 1/88 Times said:
The prosecution remains convinced that Knox was involved in both sexually abusing and murdering Kercher. One senior investigator said: “Knox is the only one of the suspects who had the keys to the cottage, which means not only that she was there but that she may well have organised their meeting at the house.” He speculated that Knox may be covering for Guede because he was supplying her with drugs, or because they were having a relationship.
Click to expand...


Follain Excerpts 1/88 Times said:
Kercher may have refused to play along with the others from the very start. Things probably degenerated, and Kercher perhaps threatened to denounce her attackers; perhaps she accused Knox of letting the others in with her keys, the detective said.
Click to expand...



Marco whatever his last name is?
 
christianahannah said:
That thought has entered my mind quite often. I don't want to know the people personally who post on forums (some are quite strange), however, the sub-story involving this case and the personalities involved (and why they are involved) would make for interesting reading.
Click to expand...
Speaking of strange, have a read at the link below.
Bruce F. is straight out calling Peter Q. a liar and practically beggin' the guy to file a defamation lawsuit against him:
http://www.allvoices.com/contribute...-peter-quennell-caught-in-his-own-web-of-lies

It just get stranger every day you read more about this case and the personalities involved on the sidelines...
 
While I can understand the anger at the sentence, I then realise that had he been convicted here, he'd have only gotten 12-15 anyway, perhaps 18 at an outside chance due to the sexual nature of the killing.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Back
Top Bottom