Vaccine/autism CT discussion

[000063]

Yeah sure. But it's okay to require the less healthy children to get the vaccine.

Isn't likely that the less healthy 60% of the children would be more susceptible to negative reactions when given vaccines?

Shouldn't the threshold of requiring vaccines be that they are at least as healthy as the study group?


Maybe the less healthy 60% of the children are more prone to be stricken with autism.

What is that, some sort of upside down control group policy? We're not allowing 60% of the children participate
in the study because it make the results worse?
Would allowing only the healthiest 50% participate in the survey make the results worse?
Would allowing only the healthiest 60% participate in the survey make the results worse?
Would allowing only the healthiest 70% participate in the survey make the results worse?
Would allowing only the healthiest 80% participate in the survey make the results worse?
Would allowing only the healthiest 90% participate in the survey make the results worse?

I wonder at which threshold the instances of negative responses might begin spiking?

I wonder if parents are ever informed that their children, when getting a vaccine, are not healthy enough to participate in a vaccine study?

Speculation.

 

[excaza]

You mean parents are stupid if they noticed that their child had a negative reaction to a vaccination and spoke up/out about it?

They didn't have a negative reaction to the vaccine.

And you're saying millions of children world wide, at age of 1 or 2, are genetically disposed to become autistic no matter their lineage?

Ignoring the fact that genetics and lineage are the exact same thing, yes.

 

[Clayton Moore]

First you cherry pick by ignoring the Sweden and Danish studies (both larger than Wakefield, and the latter by several orders of magnitude), then you cherry pick that quote.

Two can play at that game:

small small small

See?

Or, put another way, a study of 500,000 trumps a study involving 12.

Maybe he didn't have sufficient funding to a large study. But he did have access to autistic children who became autistic after a recent vaccine dose.

 

[kookbreaker]

That's what you said. You said nothing about vaccines for children.

But you were complaining about vaccines causing Autism in children, and 'poisoning our children'. I went on the assumption that most reasonable would make: that I was referring to vaccines made for children, not cancer vaccines, h1n1 vaccines, influenza vaccines that are meant for adults.

I'm sorry your attempt at pwnage fell flat but don't try to salvage it with a batch of micro-pedantic nitpicking.

 

[excaza]

Maybe he didn't have sufficient funding to a large study.

Or maybe he picked exactly the sample he needed to get the results he was looking for?

But he did have access to autistic children who became autistic after a recent vaccine dose.

Children become autistic after being born, should we start banning births?

 

[aggle-rithm]

Children become autistic after being born, should we start banning births?

In fact, being alive results invariably in death. We should stamp it out ASAP.

 

[Clayton Moore]

They didn't have a negative reaction to the vaccine.


Ignoring the fact that genetics and lineage are the exact same thing, yes.

You're exactly correct.

ge·net·ics (j-ntks)
n.
1. (used with a sing. verb) The branch of biology that deals with heredity, especially the mechanisms of hereditary transmission and the variation of inherited characteristics among similar or related organisms.
2. (used with a pl. verb) The genetic constitution of an individual, group, or class.

lin·e·age 1 (ln-j)
n.
1.
a. Direct descent from a particular ancestor; ancestry.
b. Derivation.
2. The descendants of a common ancestor considered to be the founder of the line.
[Middle English linage, lineage, from Old French lignage, from ligne, line; see line1.]

 

[Clayton Moore]

But you were complaining about vaccines causing Autism in children, and 'poisoning our children'. I went on the assumption that most reasonable would make: that I was referring to vaccines made for children, not cancer vaccines, h1n1 vaccines, influenza vaccines that are meant for adults.

I'm sorry your attempt at pwnage fell flat but don't try to salvage it with a batch of micro-pedantic nitpicking.

http://www.cdc.gov/flu/protect/children.htm

 

[excaza]

Does it make you feel good to nitpick semantics even though the rest of your arguments completely fall flat?

You're exactly correct.

ge·net·ics (j-ntks)
n.
1. (used with a sing. verb) The branch of biology that deals with heredity, especially the mechanisms of hereditary transmission and the variation of inherited characteristics among similar or related organisms.
2. (used with a pl. verb) The genetic constitution of an individual, group, or class.

lin·e·age 1 (ln-j)
n.
1.
a. Direct descent from a particular ancestor; ancestry.
b. Derivation.
2. The descendants of a common ancestor considered to be the founder of the line.
[Middle English linage, lineage, from Old French lignage, from ligne, line; see line1.]

Ok, now explain the biological difference.

 

[kookbreaker]

http://www.cdc.gov/flu/protect/children.htm

 

[Clayton Moore]

But you were complaining about vaccines causing Autism in children, and 'poisoning our children'. I went on the assumption that most reasonable would make: that I was referring to vaccines made for children, not cancer vaccines, h1n1 vaccines, influenza vaccines that are meant for adults.

I'm sorry your attempt at pwnage fell flat but don't try to salvage it with a batch of micro-pedantic nitpicking.

http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7171530&postcount=63

It was about vaccines and profits, not vaccines for children and profits.

 

[kookbreaker]

http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7171530&postcount=63

It was about vaccines and profits, not vaccines for children and profits.

Then why has the MMR jab and Wakefield been such a center of your attention. I haven't heard you bemoaning the HPV virus. All you do is mash all vaccine makers into a pile to make them seem somehow obscenely profitable when the vaccines you are actually talking about are nowhere near as profitable. You're quite transparent and this attempt at salvage is pathetic - but maybe you've managed to convince yourself - probably not though.

 

[Clayton Moore]

Does it make you feel good to nitpick semantics even though the rest of your arguments completely fall flat?



Ok, now explain the biological difference.

Hmmm one is about biology and the other is about ancestry.

Maybe you should see if there are .com sites for them.

Some game grabbed lineage so you can try mylineage or ancestry.

 

[excaza]

Hmmm one is about biology and the other is about ancestry.

Maybe you should see if there are .com sites for them.

Some game grabbed lineage so you can try mylineage or ancestry.

You are the one that brought lineage into the discussion about vaccines.

And you're saying millions of children world wide, at age of 1 or 2, are genetically disposed to become autistic no matter their lineage?

Biologically, lineage and genetics are the same thing. You get your genes from your ancestors. Unless you think aliens are growing us in test tubes?

Interesting how you latch onto pointless semantic waffling instead of addressing the counters to the woo garbage you keep posting.

 

[Clayton Moore]

Then why has the MMR jab and Wakefield been such a center of your attention. I haven't heard you bemoaning the HPV virus. All you do is mash all vaccine makers into a pile to make them seem somehow obscenely profitable when the vaccines you are actually talking about are nowhere near as profitable. You're quite transparent and this attempt at salvage is pathetic - but maybe you've managed to convince yourself - probably not though.

It's called a tangent of the discussion.

Do you know how many vaccines children get plus boosters before elementary school age? Do you know how many times a child goes to the doctor before elementary school age?

Multiply that by 4,331,999. That's the projected number babies that will be born in the US in 2011.

10 vaccines $20 each $866,399,800

 

[Clayton Moore]

Clayton

Quote:
And you're saying millions of children world wide, at age of 1 or 2, are genetically disposed to become autistic no matter their lineage?

excaza

Ignoring the fact that genetics and lineage are the exact same thing, yes.

Does it make you feel good to nitpick semantics even though the rest of your arguments completely fall flat?



Ok, now explain the biological difference.

excaza

Interesting how you latch onto pointless semantic waffling instead of addressing the counters to the woo garbage you keep posting.

So I'm nitpicking semantics?



A. And you're saying millions of children world wide, at age of 1 or 2, are genetically disposed to become autistic no matter their lineage?

B. And you're saying millions of children world wide, at age of 1 or 2, are genetically disposed to become autistic no matter their genetics?

C. And you're saying millions of children world wide, at age of 1 or 2, are disposed by lineage to become autistic no matter their lineage?

D. And you're saying millions of children world wide, at age of 1 or 2, are disposed by lineage to become autistic no matter their genetics?

 

[excaza]

So I'm nitpicking semantics?

Yes.

A. And you're saying millions of children world wide, at age of 1 or 2, are genetically disposed to become autistic no matter their lineage?

Makes no sense.

B. And you're saying millions of children world wide, at age of 1 or 2, are genetically disposed to become autistic no matter their genetics?

Makes no sense.

C. And you're saying millions of children world wide, at age of 1 or 2, are disposed by lineage to become autistic no matter their lineage?

Makes no sense.

D. And you're saying millions of children world wide, at age of 1 or 2, are disposed by lineage to become autistic no matter their genetics?

Makes no sense.

Millions of children world wide, are genetically disposed to become autistic. This makes sense.

Symptoms of autism typically begin showing at ages 1 or 2, around the same time the MMR vaccine is administrated. Idiots are now convinced that the vaccine causes autism, despite the fact that there is no evidence that agrees with them.

 

[kookbreaker]

It's called a tangent of the discussion.

Do you know how many vaccines children get plus boosters before elementary school age? Do you know how many times a child goes to the doctor before elementary school age?

Multiply that by 4,331,999. That's the projected number babies that will be born in the US in 2011.

10 vaccines $20 each $866,399,800

I can sell things at cost and make a whole lot of gross profits too. I can sell $1,000,000 worth of stuff tomorrow but if it cost me $999,990 to make and ship I will have barely enough for 2 cups of coffee.

You seem to have no clue about the definitions of 'profit' are.

I'm not saying they don't make money - they should. It encourages them to stay in business, expand and research into other areas. But to say they are making serious money compared to the cash cows things like Viagra and Cholestrerol medications is a joke.

The ability to make profits on other drugs vs the low margins from vaccines is why there are so few companies making children's vaccines.

If you had any idea of what you are talking about instead of repeating hysterical nonsense you would understand that.

 

[excaza]

It's called a tangent of the discussion.

Do you know how many vaccines children get plus boosters before elementary school age? Do you know how many times a child goes to the doctor before elementary school age?

Multiply that by 4,331,999. That's the projected number babies that will be born in the US in 2011.

10 vaccines $20 each $866,399,800

Revenue is not the same as profit. Even if it was pure profit, so what?

 

[Walter Ego]

Clayton is just telling us what he believes in. And he's quite the conspiracy believer. He's a Holocaust denier, a 9/11 'truther,' and now (apparently) an anti-vaxxer. (I eagerly await his dissertations on Pearl Harbor, the JFK assassination, and the Apollo moon landings. He's already got one trifecta going; I see no reason for him to not go for another!)

We've also learned the masked man is old enough to be a grandfather.

Originally Posted by Clayton Moore

I see you are 32. If you have young children or intend to have them I hope you ignore your faith in vaccines and space them, one at a time, as far apart as possible.

That's what my son and his wife have done for their little girl who will be 3 this summer. Both are special ed teachers

I had him pegged at 17 or 18 at the oldest and thought there might be hope for him when he "grows up." I guess not, though.