Why civilization itself is unsustainable

[TFian]

Yeah? When? How many people? Evidence (apart from your wizard mentor)?

Who knows? http://dieoff.org/synopsis.htm

 

[Joey McGee]

No

No What? No that is not the modern view? No that is not reality? No you don't like it because it is against the cult?

If I'm part of a cult, who's my leader?

Whenever you attack groupthinkers as being cult-like you will hear this rebuttal. You know exactly what sense I'm using the word "cult" in. Religions are just really big cults and this is a belief system that you have. You cannot refute that, because you cannot show us any evidence!

Well, the book has plenty of solid evidence *in it*...

No it doesn't a book can only reference evidence! It would be referencing studies and facts about reality that exist online. Admit it you're just lazy. We asked you for evidence and you showed us a freakin' book that we have to buy to understand. Pile up the evidence here, we're desperate for the information in case you're correct about your doomsday scenarios.

 

[TFian]

No What? No that is not the modern view? No that is not reality? No you don't like it because it is against the cult?

That your solutions suck since they've been tried and failed.

Whenever you attack groupthinkers as being cult-like you will hear this rebuttal. You know exactly what sense I'm using the word "cult" in. Religions are just really big cults and this is a belief system that you have. You cannot refute that, because you cannot show us any evidence!

So then, you're not using the word "cult" correctly. Kay

No it doesn't a book can only reference evidence! It would be referencing studies and facts about reality that exist online. Admit it you're just lazy. We asked you for evidence and you showed us a freakin' book that we have to buy to understand. Pile up the evidence here, we're desperate for the information in case you're correct about your doomsday scenarios.

Here's a start. http://www.fcnp.com/commentary/national/7980-the-peak-oil-crisis-the-future-of-government.html

 

[lionking]

Who knows? http://dieoff.org/synopsis.htm

Thank you. You have no idea and rely on cartoon websites.

 

[Joey McGee]

That your solutions suck since they've been tried and failed.

That's your opinion, a conversation worth having. That's the only thing that has ever worked. You're simply abandoning reason to go along with your cult beliefs because that's giving a huge reward to your brain. Which can be the only logical appraisal of your system because there is absolutely zero evidence for it.

So then, you're not using the word "cult" correctly. Kay

"The word cult pejoratively refers to a group whose beliefs or practices are considered abnormal or bizarre" You simply aren't familiar with the common usage, probably because you don't spend a lot of time working with cults. Blathering about how I'm wrong (I'm not) in the way I use a word doesn't dispute that you're an antihumanist and a group thinker.

Here's a start. http://www.fcnp.com/commentary/national/7980-the-peak-oil-crisis-the-future-of-government.html

That's a blog. Did you make another mistake with your copy and paste? Oh I get it, you're too lazy or cowardly to make your own case/rant here using references to actual data and empirical facts. Have fun courting an audience in the future.

 

[Ziggurat]

Who knows? http://dieoff.org/synopsis.htm

Wow. You managed to refute yourself with your own link. Quite the hat trick there.

Seriously, look at those graphs. They're old now. What has happened since the time they were made? Well, lots of things, but none of what those graphs predicted has come to pass. I particularly liked "2005 - THE END OF OIL EXPLORATION IN THE USA". Not so much, as it turns out.

 

[TFian]

Thank you. You have no idea and rely on cartoon websites.

It's a coin toss really, I have no ability to predict the future. My guess is something like a die off happening in the third world when the food subsidies they depend on are rescinded by first world nations, and a break down of social order when they try to come pouring in the civilized world, resulting in things like militarization of the border and trying to stop the barbarian hordes.

 

[TFian]

Wow. You managed to refute yourself with your own link. Quite the hat trick there.

Seriously, look at those graphs. They're old now. What has happened since the time they were made? Well, lots of things, but none of what those graphs predicted has come to pass. I particularly liked "2005 - THE END OF OIL EXPLORATION IN THE USA". Not so much, as it turns out.

Oil peaked in the continental USA long before 2005...

 

[TFian]

That's your opinion, a conversation worth having.

Ok.

You're simply abandoning reason to go along with your cult beliefs because that's giving a huge reward to your brain. Which can be the only logical appraisal of your system because there is absolutely zero evidence for it.

What reward is that?

"The word cult pejoratively refers to a group whose beliefs or practices are considered abnormal or bizarre"

Source? What group am I part of?

You simply aren't familiar with the common usage, probably because you don't spend a lot of time working with cults.

That's true, I avoid them whenever possible.

Blathering about how I'm wrong (I'm not) in the way I use a word doesn't dispute that you're an antihumanist and a group thinker.

I never said I wasn't anti human.

That's a blog. Did you make another mistake with your copy and paste? Oh I get it, you're too lazy or cowardly to make your own case/rant here using references to actual data and empirical facts. Have fun courting an audience in the future.

That's funny, because when I ask for evidence, I just get crap like "longbet" that has no empirical evidence whatsoever...

Or in other words, what exactly are you looking for? Be more specific.

 

[Joey McGee]

What reward is that?

You know, the brain state you get when you reach a conclusion, when you think you have reality dialed, we're biased towards conclusions that fit our beliefs. You're an antihumanist, so you support the idea that we're going to all die and poison the world and nothing can change that.

Source?

Do you not have access to a dictionary or wikipedia?

What group am I part of?

The doomday antihumanists? People who fearmonger about oil and hate humanity because of the imaginary apocolypse we're about to bring on ourselves? In general the Gaia cult?

That's funny, because when I ask for evidence, I just get crap like "longbet" that has no empirical evidence whatsoever...

Not in our conversation. You mentioned this to score imaginary points

Or in other words, what exactly are you looking for? Be more specific.

How about some studies? How about some projections that use evidence? How about some historical context (as in more studies and charts not a worded history lesson)? You know, real science.

 

[JadeStonesFromSaturn]

A link to a book doesn't constitute evidence. And from the description of the book, it seems to be nothing more than a pompous version of this:
[qimg]http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/turtles.png[/qimg]

I don't get it....

 

[TFian]

You know, the brain state you get when you reach a conclusion, when you think you have reality dialed, we're biased towards conclusions that fit our beliefs. You're an antihumanist, so you support the idea that we're going to all die and poison the world and nothing can change that.

Huh? I get no reward for that though.

Do you not have access to a dictionary or wikipedia?

Yes, and they don't conform to your definition.

In general the Gaia cult?

Where is this "Gaia cult"? I want to check it out

You mentioned this to score imaginary points

No.

How about some studies? How about some projections that use evidence? How about some historical context (as in more studies and charts not a worded history lesson)? You know, real science.

Oh well, you could have just asked...

http://www.netl.doe.gov/publications/others/pdf/oil_peaking_netl.pdf

 

[bikerdruid]

You belong to a cult that uses nature worship and anti-humanism as a dopamine fueled escape from the difficult work of improving quality of life on earth, which I find disgusting and pathological.

wow....
what is this cult?
who is the leader?

 

[TFian]

wow....
what is this cult?
who is the leader?

It's the ones in his head...

 

[Roboramma]

Oil peaked in the continental USA long before 2005...

Which has absolutely nothing to do with "the end of oil exploration". Do you accept that oil exploration in the continental USA has not ended, or not?

 

[Joey McGee]

Huh? I get no reward for that though.

I'm talking about our reward circuitry shaped by evolution. When you get a thought that you think accurately describes reality you get a reward. Your personal psychology is bent towards antihumanism. See Robert Burton: On Being Certain for research.

Yes, and they don't conform to your definition.

I got that quote from wikipedia, the first sentence. I have the oxford dictionary on CD-ROM, so just, have fun in your own little world where you get to invent definitions of words.

Where is this "Gaia cult"? I want to check it out

You're not the first person to pull this semantics act. Just google "Gaia cult" There are many interpretations of what those two words mean together. Here's one

Oh well, you could have just asked...

http://www.netl.doe.gov/publications/others/pdf/oil_peaking_netl.pdf
Great, now all you have to do is make a specific claim about the future, and point to the figures and facts, what page figure numbers etc, that back up those specific claims. That report doesn't make a single claim it talks about a lot of different things.

 

[Joey McGee]

wow....
what is this cult?
who is the leader?

Every cult-like group that doesn't have a specific leader has learned to make this argument. If you prefer I shall declare you pseudoscientific group thinkers with a pathological element.

 

[bikerdruid]

Every cult-like group that doesn't have a specific leader has learned to make this argument. If you prefer I shall declare you pseudoscientific group thinkers with a pathological element.

 

[TFian]

Which has absolutely nothing to do with "the end of oil exploration". Do you accept that oil exploration in the continental USA has not ended, or not?

Depends on how you define "exploration".

 

[TFian]

Your personal psychology is bent towards antihumanism. See Robert Burton: On Being Certain for research.

Ok, sure.

I got that quote from wikipedia, the first sentence. I have the oxford dictionary on CD-ROM, so just, have fun in your own little world where you get to invent definitions of words.

I got dictionary dot com to boot.

"1.
a particular system of religious worship, especially with reference to its rites and ceremonies.
2.
an instance of great veneration of a person, ideal, or thing, especially as manifested by a body of admirers: the physical fitness cult.
3.
the object of such devotion. "

Let's see, I don't have 1.) as I don't partake in any religious worship, or have any rites or ceremonies.

2.) Nope...can't think of anyone.

3.) Nope, none I can think of there either.

Maybe you can fill me in where I fit the criteria?

You're not the first person to pull this semantics act. Just google "Gaia cult" There are many interpretations of what those two words mean together. Here's one

Ah, so some obscure conspiracy theorist website? Oh look, he/she (they?) think Global Warming is a manufactured enemy to trick the populace into Gaia worship. Reminds me of Texe Marrs....

Oh, look at the other site they link towards

"THE ‘ONE WORLD’ GOVERNMENT IS ALMOST HERE!

Many readers will have heard or read about this prophesied event
with very serious results for everyone in the world, soon!
The following notes are based on The N.I.V.
translation of the Bible, and are offered as a basis for your own study,
in these serious ‘Last Days’ we are now living in."

And you really consider *that* an authoritative source??

http://www.netl.doe.gov/publications/others/pdf/oil_peaking_netl.pdf
Great, now all you have to do is make a specific claim about the future, and point to the figures and facts, what page figure numbers etc, that back up those specific claims. That report doesn't make a single claim it talks about a lot of different things.

Well, my point is that it's simply too late to transition as the way things are off the oil, as the Hirsch report concurs. We had to do this 30 years ago..it's too late now.