Moderated Obama birth certificate CT / SSN CT / Birther discussion

[kookbreaker]

Where have they said and/or admitted these things? I've already asked you about the CNN/White House claim.

I think Randman is grossly misunderstanding this article:

http://www.cnn.com/2011/POLITICS/04/25/birthers.obama.hawaii/index.html

Obama could file a Freedom of Information Act request to view his original birth certificate and make copies. But at this point, the White House maintains, nothing will satisfy the doubters.

Note that it does not say 'The White House says it could file a FOIA request.' It just points out why it isn't bothering to pander to cranks. Earlier in the article it also notes the original form isn't good for anything.

 

[kookbreaker]

I've got it!

These birthers are always bitching about Obama's birth certificate, how about we ask the birthers to show their birth certificates?

Where have *you* been?!

 

[9/11 Chewy Defense]

Where have *you* been?!

Let's just say I got suspended for a week (for nothing), then came back and took almost another week off for Easter.

 

[Athyrio]

Well, it's all a moot point now. Trump says he has been told that the BC is "missing" or never existed.

"I've been told that it's not there or it doesn't exist. And if that's the case it's a big problem."

So, if one does show up now, it will be dismissed as a forgery, and if it really is not there at all, then there is nothing to see.

 

[A Laughing Baby]

You know, this whole thing about Obama's birth certificate is really geting out of hand, seriously!

It's written in the U.S. Constitution that every American (including the President) has the right to privacy:

http://topics.law.cornell.edu/constitution/billofrights#amendmenti



How would some of you feel if questions were being raised about where you came from on National & International TV? Answer: You wouldn't like it if your private info got out.

Little off topic, but most traditional interpretations of a constitutional right to privacy have come from the 14th amendment, not the 4th.

 

[9/11 Chewy Defense]

Little off topic, but most traditional interpretations of a constitutional right to privacy have come from the 14th amendment, not the 4th.

Either way, those Birthers have no reason to bitch about Obamas birth.

 

[Anders Lindman]

Barack Obama press conference:

Reporter: Rumors have it that you were not born in the United States. What do you say to that?

BO: Today I'm proud to announce that I was born in Indonesia.

R: Why?

BO: I don't know why. Ask my parents.

R: But I mean how is that possible?

BO: My parents had sex with each other. Next question.

R: We know all that. I mean how can you be president and still be born in Indonesia?

BO: Because I have been selected.

R: You mean elected, sir?

BO: That too. The secret powers selected me to become the next president.

R: Ok. Will you be able to run as a presidential candidate for the 2012 election?

BO: Of course. And so will Arnold.

R: Arnold?

BO: Yeah, you know, Arnold the Terminator guy.

R: But he was not born in the United States.

BO: So?

 

[332nd]

LOL! So …

Just as I maintained earlier and which many of you denied, the State of Hawaii can make a copy of the long form and give it to Obama, if he requests. It's not against the law unlike what so many of you claimed. Remember?

beren in post #2494 - "The president is not above the law, you know"

KDLarsen in post #2496 - "BAC would be screaming bloody murder that Obama broke the law"

ANTPogo in post #2497 - "I like how you ignore every single statement in that article from Hawaii officials about how the "long form" simply cannot be released. … snip … So, you want President Obama to completely disregard Hawaii state law"

headscratcher4 in post #2504 - "NO one, not the president of the United States, Not Donald Trump, has legal access to the so-called original. No request of the president to the state to violate its own law can or should be honored"

Redtail in post #2551 - "So… Bac, when will you be posting the slightest amount of evidence that Obama could release his long form/original/what ever birth certificate if he wanted to?"

CptColumbo in post #2564 - "You want the President and the Governor to ignore the law" and in post #2636 - "Neither one can compell the DoH to release a document that is cannot legally release."

Taarkin in post #2603 - "Better get Jack Bauer on the case; he doesn't let pantywaist liberal ideas like "laws" get in the way of his investigation"

Arus809 in post #2605 - "To get Hawaii to relase anything more, the GOVERNOR and the House and Senate of Hawaii will have to draft a law/bill that would make vital records more open" and in post #2772 "[Obama] cannot however, get a copy of it (via photocopy, xerox or digital scan). He can only receive what he already has."

Sabrina in post #2617 - "So no, you have NOT made ANYTHING about your insistence on seeing the original document clear AT ALL. Your personal incredulity, nor anyone else's, is not a valid reason to force the State of Hawai'i to violate its own laws to show a document that has EXACTLY the same information (with the addition of minor details that are not important in a legal sense) as the COLB already released."

fullflavormenthol in post #2782 - "The COLB, you know the computer generated one, it is a certified copy under the laws of Hawaii. It is all that they are required to give"

Newtons_Bit in post #2789 - "The Department of Health is not required by law to give anything other than a copy of the data."

kookbreaker in post #2799 - "So if all that is accurate, why don't some birther folks in Hawaii provide their own copies of the Long-Form. Sounds like it should be easy to get. What's the problem? Anything else is just words and some bozo blogger's opinion."

My, my, my … just look at all the liars we've uncovered on this thread in just the last few seconds.

The bolded portions in the Fukino and Tuchman interviews also put the lie to similiar recent claims by a number of public officials and liberal media personalities. All in all, it looks like the wall of lies is starting to come down. Lies are always hard to maintain … especially if the media won't cooperate and Anderson definitely didn't cooperate this time.



Garbage. That is just as big a lie as the original one. The law clearly requires that the state supply a "certified" copy of "any" document in which a "registrant" has a "direct and tangible interest", if the registrant requests. And Fukino previously issued a statement saying the original birth certificate is no different than any other document. In fact, Governor Abercrombie has stated that what is preventing him from releasing a certified copy of Obama's original birth certificate is that Obama hasn't given permission (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/41203925/ns/politics-white_house/ ). Obama is the problem here, folks. Not the law. So what does he fear that is in that document? Or is he just promoting a devisive controversy that he thinks will aid him politically? Neither looks good, IMO.

And as for what *birthers* will do if Obama does make the request and Hawaii publishes a copy of the long form … let's see. Don't hide behind the claim that "birthers" won't accept it. Because that's what you folks are still doing … HIDING.

Bac... Can you post the slightest shred of evidence that proves your claims? Stop running & post the evidence.

What are you afraid of?

 

[BeAChooser]

No, the state of HAWAII cannot provide the copy.

LIAR. Fukino and Tuchman just admitted that the state of Hawaii CAN provide a copy. Obama merely needs to ask. This stands in direct contradiction to your earlier claim that doing so would "violate it's own laws".

According to Arus' post, President Obama could file a FOIA request to view the document, and could then subsequently make a copy himself

LIAR. Arus' post quotes Tuchman saying "A person could file for an FOIA request to see and get copies of the long form" and "it will take weeks to get those copies". Neither Fukino or Tuchman said the registrant had to make their own copy.

Have you no shame, Sabrina? Or do you think noone will catch your lies?

 

[Newtons Bit]

LIAR. Fukino and Tuchman just admitted that the state of Hawaii CAN provide a copy. Obama merely needs to ask. This stands in direct contradiction to your earlier claim that doing so would "violate it's own laws".

I've already posted an analysis on what Hawaii is required to give and what it is allowed to choose not to give.

A FOIA request is in a different realm. He could (maybe) get the document, but it won't be certified, it won't have the raised stamp of Hawaii on it, etc. At which point the conspiracy theorists (that's you) will claim that the document was a forgery because it's not certified.

Why would Obama even want to do that? 40% of Republicans believe that he wasn't born in the country. The more time Republican politicians are having to address the insanity from within their own ranks the more time Obama gets a free pass on many of his trouble policies, hypocritical campaign statements, etc. This is a giant gift to him. He's not going to give it away.

 

[A'isha]

LIAR. Fukino and Tuchman just admitted that the state of Hawaii CAN provide a copy. Obama merely needs to ask. This stands in direct contradiction to your earlier claim that doing so would "violate it's own laws".

No, he doesn't merely need to ask. He has to file a FOIA request. And what he'll get back will be a useless, un-certified document.

Have you no shame, Sabrina? Or do you think noone will catch your lies?

If, as you keep claiming ad nauseam, Hawaii's laws allow Obama to get a certified copy of the long form, then why does none of the information revealed in that CNN report actually support that?

 

[Ladewig]

http://nation.foxnews.com/birther-d...ii-senator-questions-obamas-true-birth-father

Is it worth millions not to show it?

Fascinating.

A previous poster provided a simple, easy-to-understand post in which it was explained that the name of the father is irrelevant to President Obama's eligibility, and you then provide a link to a story in which the central concern is the name of the father on the birth certificate. President Obama has already indicated that his father was a Muslim and a foreign national. What possible characteristic could his "real" father have that is so shocking that President Obama made up a story in which his "alibi" father was a Muslim and a foreign national who abandoned his family.

Furthermore, it has been explained several times that he has not spent millions of dollars to hide it and yet you repeat the assertion that millions have been spent to hide it.

The thread has a certain surrealness to it.

 

[BeAChooser]

As explicitly stated in the transcript, not a certified copy, no.

That's not what the law says. The law clearly states the registrant is entitled to a "certified copy" of "any" "vital record", and the original long form birth certificate is a vital record that Fukino, herself, indicated should be treated the same as any other vital record.

Anything Obama obtains from the Hawaii Department of Health that is not the certificate he's already released will be totally useless for any official purpose

Who said anything about "official purpose"? We just want to know what is on the long form, given that Obama is willing to spend millions of dollars hiding it, ruin the lives of soldiers who ask to see it, and allow 40% of the populace to continue harboring doubts about his legitmacy?

It will, at most (and after a full-on FOIA filing, not just a simple "request") be a plain-paper photocopy with absolutely zero probative or even evidentiary value.

LOL! democrats never had any concerns previously about "probative" or "evidentiary" value of the material they used to smear republicans. Take the assertions by Dan Rather, for example. You're HIDING.

You completely doubt the state-certified official document, BAC

LIAR. Not true. I simply want to see what else is on the long form.

As shown by the highlighted statements you make above, you don't even understand what was said in the Anderson Cooper report!

LOL! I wasn't talking about Anderson's report. I was clearly addressing what the LAW says. The law you already demonstrated you didn't know when to claimed "I like how you ignore every single statement in that article from Hawaii officials about how the "long form" simply cannot be released. … snip … So, you want President Obama to completely disregard Hawaii state law".

 

[BeAChooser]

It's written in the U.S. Constitution that every American (including the President) has the right to privacy:

I have a one word response: FILEGATE.

 

[BeAChooser]

You just don't want to admit the facts and so hold the absurd view that even the president of the United States cannot request and obtain a copy of his original birth certificate. You've been shown where others have. You've been shown where the hospitals and the governor of Hawaii have said they would release whatever Obama requests. You've been shown the WH admitting it.

Now, you say, well, it wouldn't be certified but state law says you can request it be certified.

They've just taken two steps back and don't even see it through the cloud of lies they've promoted and continue to promote.

 

[A'isha]

That's not what the law says. The law clearly states the registrant is entitled to a "certified copy" of "any" "vital record", and the original long form birth certificate is a vital record that Fukino, herself, indicated should be treated the same as any other vital record.

No, it's not. And I've already pointed out in this thread that Dr. Fukino was responding to the accusations that Governor Lingle had ordered Obama's records to be sealed when she made that statement, and has nothing to do with your continued misreading of Hawaii law.

Who said anything about "official purpose"? We just want to know what is on the long form, given that Obama is willing to spend millions of dollars hiding it, ruin the lives of soldiers who ask to see it, and allow 40% of the populace to continue harboring doubts about his legitmacy?

Well, for one thing, you'd never accept an uncertified, easily-forgeable photocopy, especially if it was provided by Obama himself.

Second of all, there is no additional information on the "long form" that would affect Obama's legitimacy. Zero. Zip. Nada. Zilch. None.

Every bit of information describing and confirming Obama's legitimacy is already on the certified "short form".

LOL! I wasn't talking about Anderson's report. I was clearly addressing what the LAW says. The law you already demonstrated you didn't know when to claimed "I like how you ignore every single statement in that article from Hawaii officials about how the "long form" simply cannot be released. … snip … So, you want President Obama to completely disregard Hawaii state law".

You say that the law allows Obama to get a certified copy of his "long form". I tell you that under the law Obama cannot get a certified copy of his "long form", and numerous Hawaiian officials have repeatedly stated the same thing.

If you're right, and I'm wrong, how come nobody born in Hawaii has obtained a certified copy of their "long form" since at least 2001 (when short-form-only went into effect)? Why can't Miki Booth get certified copies of her husband's and son's "long form" certificates?

 

[kookbreaker]

I have a one word response: FILEGATE.

OK, so FILEGATE makes invasions of privacy OK? Is that what you are saying?

 

[BeAChooser]

I've already posted an analysis on what Hawaii is required to give and what it is allowed to choose not to give.

And I've already shown your analysis isn't worth the {virtual} paper it's printed on. You're hiding, NB.

This is a giant gift to him. He's not going to give it away.

But at least you are honest enough to admit that Obama is doing this purely for political gain. He is willing to ruin the lives of otherwise fine American soldiers and let 40% of the country doubt his legitimacy ... just to win an election. And if he'll do that, what else would he be willing to do to win an election? Perhaps accept illegal campaign contributions like Clinton did?

 

[BeAChooser]

no, he doesn't merely need to ask. He has to file a foia request.

LOL! You're H ... I ... D ... I ... N ... G

 

[Newtons Bit]

And I've already shown your analysis isn't worth the {virtual} paper it's printed on. You're hiding, NB.

You replied and I destroyed you and your terrible sources, BaC. You never responded. Remember? How about your claim that Hawaii was giving out long-forms until Obama came to power? You haven't come clean on that lie yet.

I'm not the one who is hiding.

But at least you are honest enough to admit that Obama is doing this purely for political gain.

Sure, he's not going to spend any more time on it and it helps him.

He is willing to ruin the lives of otherwise fine American soldiers and let 40% of the country doubt his legitimacy ... just to win an election.

It's not Obama's fault those people are so incredibly stupid, gullible and/or otherwise ignorant. The CoLB that Obama has released is all that is necessary for the law, and curiosity, to be satisfied.