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Merged Theory links Newtonian/Quantum the amazing Frank Znidarsic

I agree that it is hard to take Bob Lazar seriously. Bob Lazar's story has been thoroughly debunked by ...Stanton Friedman.

If Stanton Friedman is a credible person then his UFO investigations probably have merit. So there is alien technology hidden away ...somewhere, out there.

I can't post links until I have more than 15 posts, thus the mr.green smiley from the other post ;)
 
Just my 2 cents.

First, I want to tell a story.

Back in Antiquity, after the foundation of Alexandria and the famous Library of Alexandria, there was a flourishing new thing: SCIENCE.
Not long ago, Antiquity was disregarded because of an alleged lack of "method". This has recently been proven wrong by physicist and science historian Lucio Russo. (I recommend his book, acclaimed by "Nature" and others, "The Forgotten Revolution")

Since the decoding of the Antikythera Device
(see reconstructions on NewScientists youtube-channel)
there was no doubt about high scientific standards in Antiquity.
As you might know, Eratosthenes measured the circumference of the Earth correctly and with the right experimental method.
It is now clear that the Ptolemaeic Alexandria and other Hellenistic states were leading the way.
Lucretius, the Roman philosopher, sums up the knowledge of Ancient Greece in his science poetry "De Rerum Natura".
In this book, he states some kind of Law of Energy conservation, something like the Planck lenght/time, he described how things must fall at equal acceleration in the vacuum.

Now that is something, huh? He even explains how life evolved through natural selection of animals not adapted for their environment.

WTF!!! That was in the 1st century BC - and it was some kind of compendium, not even a scientific paper!
The scientific papers we have (like the "Palimpsest" of Archimedes, in which he invented calculus) use scientific methods of today.
The problem was: too few people understood science, and the Romans just needed the high-tech, they didn't care for basic research.

We know today, that ancient scientist already HAD a relativistic view.
They KNEW that Heliocentrism describes what really is, but invented epicyles to match the *phenomena*, that is: what is perceivable through observation!
Ptolemy the Astronomer forgot what was already known - thanks to that we went back to Geocentrism...

Now what has that to do with the topic, you might ask.

Well, I read through the whole discussion and could not but palmface all the time. Not about what was actually the topic, but about the behavior of some people here.

MattusMaximus, you are truly the champion of willing misunderstanding here.
As a scientist, you should know that it is still possible, if not likely, that the next "GUT" comes from an outsider.
If Faraday had posted on this forum, he would have been ridiculed. Shame on all of you.

In no way do I want to defend any of the papers that are in question. It's the principles of science that matter.
There are people, who WANT to misunderstand, who refuse to think a whole knew model.
Now think about the Greeks. They had TWO models. Heliocentrism is the most SIMPLE model to EXPLAIN the movement of the planets.
Geocentrism with epicycles is EASIER to calculate, if you want to predict phenomena.

Now think about Frank Znidarsic again. He may be an eletrical engineer and self tought physicist. He sees things like an engineer:
Harmonic motion of an electron can be modeled as a spring.
THERE IS NOTHING WRONG IN DOING THAT.
The math comes out right.

Now, what do we have in Quantum Mechanics? There's a probability map, which rerived out of empirical data.
Plancks constant ist empirical data. So are most measurements of particle masses and so forth.
It is therefore absolutely legitimate to introduce a speed (Vt/ct) that actually represents something REAL and discard Plancks constant. It might seem circular at first, but it is possible to connect all relevant equations and predict things that CANNOT BE PREDICTED USING PLANCKS CONSTANT ALONE or NOT AT ALL.
If Frank can predict radii of atoms or orbitals, you have to look at what the math *means*. You have to imagine a new model.
If you read Lucretius, you will find something like vacuum energy, if you follow HIS terminology. It is the concept that suggests it *means* "our" vacuum energy. And of course, Lucretius is a philosopher and won't deal with maths.

Besides: Logic dictates that if two models (let's say Quantum Mechanics and FZs transitional state theory) are based on the same data (as you implied by saying FZ's "vt" is derived from Planck's Constant) but produce experimental results contrary to either one of the theories, then the mathematically consistent model proves the acquired data wrong.
FZ produces the exact spacing of two nuclei.

The radius of the proton is not known exactly. If FZ produces a value that does not match, what does a real scientist do?

He looks for something *in the theory that predicted the "wrong" value*.
Something that could be the CAUSE why the empirically obtained data does not match. For instance, if the measurement method directly affects the radius of the proton. Or if the measurement tool can't measure it. Remember - only a sieve fine enough will give away the finest sand.

As for Cold Fusion, you might have heard about this one:

At least this time it seems actual scientists of the University of Bologna made reports on the device that allegedly produces 12 KW out of 400W input.
See article on physorg.

Please for the sake of truth, for which you all shall strive:

MattusMaximus, as a professor you should not look down upon laymen or students. Do not disregard those who QUESTION, for those who question are the natural selection of the evolution of science.
If they are wrong, tell them where they are wrong.
All YOU did was saying: "It does not accord to the Standard Model we have today, therefore it must be wrong."
You have to prove HIM wrong. His math is valid. You have to USE HIS equations to fill in the gaps of QM and find out what does not comply and WHY. Present your findings in an orderly scientific discussion. If you ridicule those people, they will never publish peer reviewed papers.

Lord Kelvin said around 1900: "There is nothing new in physics. All we have to do is measure correctly." Or words to that effect.
Boy, was he wrong.
 
First, I want to tell a story.

Back in Antiquity, after the foundation of Alexandria and the famous Library of Alexandria, there was a flourishing new thing: SCIENCE.
Not long ago, Antiquity was disregarded because of an alleged lack of "method". This has recently been proven wrong by physicist and science historian Lucio Russo. (I recommend his book, acclaimed by "Nature" and others, "The Forgotten Revolution")

Since the decoding of the Antikythera Device
(see reconstructions on NewScientists youtube-channel)
there was no doubt about high scientific standards in Antiquity.
As you might know, Eratosthenes measured the circumference of the Earth correctly and with the right experimental method.
It is now clear that the Ptolemaeic Alexandria and other Hellenistic states were leading the way.
Lucretius, the Roman philosopher, sums up the knowledge of Ancient Greece in his science poetry "De Rerum Natura".
In this book, he states some kind of Law of Energy conservation, something like the Planck lenght/time, he described how things must fall at equal acceleration in the vacuum.

Now that is something, huh? He even explains how life evolved through natural selection of animals not adapted for their environment.

WTF!!! That was in the 1st century BC - and it was some kind of compendium, not even a scientific paper!
The scientific papers we have (like the "Palimpsest" of Archimedes, in which he invented calculus) use scientific methods of today.
The problem was: too few people understood science, and the Romans just needed the high-tech, they didn't care for basic research.

We know today, that ancient scientist already HAD a relativistic view.
They KNEW that Heliocentrism describes what really is, but invented epicyles to match the *phenomena*, that is: what is perceivable through observation!
Ptolemy the Astronomer forgot what was already known - thanks to that we went back to Geocentrism...

Now what has that to do with the topic, you might ask.

Well, I read through the whole discussion and could not but palmface all the time. Not about what was actually the topic, but about the behavior of some people here.

MattusMaximus, you are truly the champion of willing misunderstanding here.
As a scientist, you should know that it is still possible, if not likely, that the next "GUT" comes from an outsider.
If Faraday had posted on this forum, he would have been ridiculed. Shame on all of you.

In no way do I want to defend any of the papers that are in question. It's the principles of science that matter.
There are people, who WANT to misunderstand, who refuse to think a whole knew model.
Now think about the Greeks. They had TWO models. Heliocentrism is the most SIMPLE model to EXPLAIN the movement of the planets.
Geocentrism with epicycles is EASIER to calculate, if you want to predict phenomena.

Now think about Frank Znidarsic again. He may be an eletrical engineer and self tought physicist. He sees things like an engineer:
Harmonic motion of an electron can be modeled as a spring.
THERE IS NOTHING WRONG IN DOING THAT.
The math comes out right.

Now, what do we have in Quantum Mechanics? There's a probability map, which rerived out of empirical data.
Plancks constant ist empirical data. So are most measurements of particle masses and so forth.
It is therefore absolutely legitimate to introduce a speed (Vt/ct) that actually represents something REAL and discard Plancks constant. It might seem circular at first, but it is possible to connect all relevant equations and predict things that CANNOT BE PREDICTED USING PLANCKS CONSTANT ALONE or NOT AT ALL.
If Frank can predict radii of atoms or orbitals, you have to look at what the math *means*. You have to imagine a new model.
If you read Lucretius, you will find something like vacuum energy, if you follow HIS terminology. It is the concept that suggests it *means* "our" vacuum energy. And of course, Lucretius is a philosopher and won't deal with maths.

Besides: Logic dictates that if two models (let's say Quantum Mechanics and FZs transitional state theory) are based on the same data (as you implied by saying FZ's "vt" is derived from Planck's Constant) but produce experimental results contrary to either one of the theories, then the mathematically consistent model proves the acquired data wrong.
FZ produces the exact spacing of two nuclei.

The radius of the proton is not known exactly. If FZ produces a value that does not match, what does a real scientist do?

He looks for something *in the theory that predicted the "wrong" value*.
Something that could be the CAUSE why the empirically obtained data does not match. For instance, if the measurement method directly affects the radius of the proton. Or if the measurement tool can't measure it. Remember - only a sieve fine enough will give away the finest sand.

As for Cold Fusion, you might have heard about this one:

At least this time it seems actual scientists of the University of Bologna made reports on the device that allegedly produces 12 KW out of 400W input.
See article on physorg.

Please for the sake of truth, for which you all shall strive:

MattusMaximus, as a professor you should not look down upon laymen or students. Do not disregard those who QUESTION, for those who question are the natural selection of the evolution of science.
If they are wrong, tell them where they are wrong.
All YOU did was saying: "It does not accord to the Standard Model we have today, therefore it must be wrong."
You have to prove HIM wrong. His math is valid. You have to USE HIS equations to fill in the gaps of QM and find out what does not comply and WHY. Present your findings in an orderly scientific discussion. If you ridicule those people, they will never publish peer reviewed papers.

Lord Kelvin said around 1900: "There is nothing new in physics. All we have to do is measure correctly." Or words to that effect.
Boy, was he wrong.

I'm disappointed by the lack of "THEY LAUGHED AT GALILEO" in this post.
 
Now think about Frank Znidarsic again. He may be an eletrical engineer and self tought physicist. He sees things like an engineer:
Harmonic motion of an electron can be modeled as a spring.
THERE IS NOTHING WRONG IN DOING THAT.
The math comes out right.

There is something wrong with that: it's not actually a model of the world we live in. It's just math gibberish.

Besides: Logic dictates that if two models (let's say Quantum Mechanics and FZs transitional state theory) are based on the same data (as you implied by saying FZ's "vt" is derived from Planck's Constant) but produce experimental results contrary to either one of the theories, then the mathematically consistent model proves the acquired data wrong.

That sentence is unintelligible. Please rephrase. But it sounds a lot like you're trying to say "my model is unfalsifiable". Also: quantum mechanics is mathematically consistent, haven't you heard?

FZ produces the exact spacing of two nuclei.

No it doesn't.

The radius of the proton is not known exactly. If FZ produces a value that does not match, what does a real scientist do?

He looks for something *in the theory that predicted the "wrong" value*.
Something that could be the CAUSE why the empirically obtained data does not match. For instance, if the measurement method directly affects the radius of the proton. Or if the measurement tool can't measure it. Remember - only a sieve fine enough will give away the finest sand.

Hoo boy. FZ knows, one hopes, that there are measurements of (say) the deuterium charge radius via the Balmer spectral lines, and via the angular distribution of scattered electrons at 10-100 MeV. As a theorist, it's his job to calculate something measurable. If he has some theory saying that there's one radius A that's relevant to Balmer line measurements, and another radius B relevant to nothing at all, why the heck would you calculate B first?

(Here's a thought. Suppose you were a bad theorist, haphazardly throwing together numbers from a bad theory. You pop out B and call it the "radius". Later you learn that it's "wrong". So you pretend to have an excuse---to make it sound like science, you cite some detail of the experiments and claim that this detail makes all the difference between A and B. Although to be honest you have no idea whether A=B or what. This is called "failing at science".)

For example: If a particle theorist announces "My theory says that the Higgs mass is 140 GeV", they do NOT mean "... as measured by Plato himself using tachyonic unicorn scales". They mean " ... so it will produce a bump at 140 GeV in the data at the LHC". They also mean that "if you see a bump at 130 GeV, my theory must be wrong."


You have to prove HIM wrong. His math is valid.

The speed of light is c = 3e8. The radius of an atom is r = 1 angstrom. Therefore we derive a fundamental time, r/c = 3 x 10^-19. This must be the lifetime of the electron. My math is valid in that I didn't make an arithmetic error. You have to prove me wrong, right?

An infinite number of different maths are "valid"---Newton's, Ptolemy's, Einstein's, etc.---in the sense of not having algebra errors. That doesn't mean that they correctly describe the Universe we live in. That is the difference between math and physics. The laws of physics have to have the correct math AND it has to correctly describe all experiments. (Not just the experiments that the theorist finds convenient.)
 
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There is something wrong with that: it's not actually a model of the world we live in. It's just math gibberish.
Ok, so QM describes the world as we can see it, and predict probabilities. But it doesn't explain why. That is the criticism.

That sentence is unintelligible. Please rephrase. But it sounds a lot like you're trying to say "my model is unfalsifiable". Also: quantum mechanics is mathematically consistent, haven't you heard?

I didn't say that. But some measurements are not certain. Just as an analogy: if you measure the space between two metal balls with a magnetic ruler, you won't end up with the right value.
Does measurement not affect the result in QM?



No it doesn't.
Obviously it does, I watched the videos, and there it is.
Please specify and indicate which step is wrong.

Hoo boy. FZ knows, one hopes, that there are measurements of (say) the deuterium charge radius via the Balmer spectral lines, and via the angular distribution of scattered electrons at 10-100 MeV. As a theorist, it's his job to calculate something measurable. If he has some theory saying that there's one radius A that's relevant to Balmer line measurements, and another radius B relevant to nothing at all, why the heck would you calculate B first?
If you measure the movement of planets, it perfectly fits the Geocentric model. You have to accept the Heliocentric model to recalculate the movements from the POV other than the earth.
For example: If a particle theorist announces "My theory says that the Higgs mass is 140 GeV", they do NOT mean "... as measured by Plato himself using tachyonic unicorn scales". They mean " ... so it will produce a bump at 140 GeV in the data at the LHC". They also mean that "if you see a bump at 130 GeV, my theory must be wrong."

These are all virtual particles to calculate the forces etc.
They do not necessarily represent "reality".

An infinite number of different maths are "valid"---Newton's, Ptolemy's, Einstein's, etc.---in the sense of not having algebra errors. That doesn't mean that they correctly describe the Universe we live in. That is the difference between math and physics. The laws of physics have to have the correct math AND it has to correctly describe all experiments. (Not just the experiments that the theorist finds convenient.)

After all, as JCM demanded, we have yet to see where exactly FZ's model is wrong. Of course FZ has to provide us with some more predictions.
 
I didn't say that. But some measurements are not certain. Just as an analogy: if you measure the space between two metal balls with a magnetic ruler, you won't end up with the right value.
Does measurement not affect the result in QM?
No, measurement is limited by HUP, you are muddled.
....

If you measure the movement of planets, it perfectly fits the Geocentric model. You have to accept the Heliocentric model to recalculate the movements from the POV other than the earth.
This statement I have seen before, it is also wrong. The Ptolomeic model gives a rough approximation. Kepler's orbits allow you to navigate through celestial time fixes.
These are all virtual particles to calculate the forces etc.
They do not necessarily represent "reality".

This is gibberish and rhetorical spin.
After all, as JCM demanded, we have yet to see where exactly FZ's model is wrong. Of course FZ has to provide us with some more predictions.

The all he has is a model , and nothing substantial.
 
Welcome to the forums Chronopolitan, may your stay be pleasant and educating :)
 
No, measurement is limited by HUP, you are muddled.
See? Without a Heisenberg Compensator(tm) You won't get the whole thing. :)
I'm curious about how FZ explains why measurement is limited by HUP. (oh wait, didn't he actually do that in one paper?)

This statement I have seen before, it is also wrong. The Ptolomeic model gives a rough approximation. Kepler's orbits allow you to navigate through celestial time fixes.
I wasn't talking about the Ptolemeic model. I was talking about the geocentric model as a POV. Ptolemy even had the circumference of the earth wrong despite the fact that it has been measured correctly b Eratosthenes hundreds of years earlier.
If you look at the Antikythera Device, you will see that the constructor found mathematical ways to accurately translate the irregularities into the gearwork.

This is gibberish and rhetorical spin.

Well, as I said: one should explain why so people can learn during a discussion.

The all he has is a model , and nothing substantial.

Ok, so there IS a model. I really want to know what people knowing physics make of it.
So what I expect is that able people thoroughly read what FZ wrote (all of it) and dismantle it to find the errors.
Or - if the model is mathematically valid - use it to try to replicate results that have been calculated by accepted models or measurements.

I am still waiting to see that. I can't do it, I'm a Humanities guy, I only know arts.
 
After all, as JCM demanded, we have yet to see where exactly FZ's model is wrong.

OK, I'll get started.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/25456609/Frank-Znidarsic-Control-of-Natural-Forces-leading-to-Cold-Fusion-and-Anti-Gravity said:
Planck’s constant describes the energy of an emitted photon. Vt describes the velocity of the emitting
structure. Two additional classical parameters are required in order to describe quantum phenomena in
terms of the emitting structure. They will be briefly presented. The radius rp is that of the maximum
extent of the proton. The strength of the electrical force equals the strength of the strong nuclear force at
this radius. The classical radius of the electron exists at 2rp. The coulombic force produced between two
electrical charges compressed to within 2rp equals 29.05 Newtons. The force produced by an amount of
energy equal to the rest mass of the electron confined to within 2rp is also 29.05 Newtons. This
confinement force Fmax was qualified in equation (1).

There is no radius where "the strength of the electrical force equals the strength of the strong nuclear force"; these forces act on totally different objects. It's like saying "this is the radius where the force of wind resistance is equal to the force of neutrinos". Uh, force on what? The strong force between two red quarks is different than the force between a red and an antired (but the EM force is the same.) The strong force between two up quarks is the same as between two down quarks (but the EM force is different). The strong force between two electrons is zero but the EM force is not. The strong force between two gluons is large but the EM force is zero. All of these "forces" are energy-dependent. There is no standard conversion between strong-charge and EM charge, so unless you have a specific pair of particles in mind the comparison is apples-to-oranges.

The "classical radius" statement is a tautology. The classical radius of the electron was defined to be a radius such that the EM potential energy is equal to the rest mass. It's like saying "The mass-energy in one kilogram is exactly the same as the energy in a carbon-12 atom, times Avogadro's Number, times 1000/12."
 
Ok, so QM describes the world as we can see it, and predict probabilities. But it doesn't explain why. That is the criticism.
It can explains why to a far more precise degree than, say, the physics of a falling apple.

If you measure the movement of planets, it perfectly fits the Geocentric model. You have to accept the Heliocentric model to recalculate the movements from the POV other than the earth.
That's because the laws of physics don't really care what reference frame you choose. It's not scientifically wrong to accept a heliocentric model. It's just not practical.

These are all virtual particles to calculate the forces etc.
They do not necessarily represent "reality".
?? Real photons have been observed. Real gluons have been observed. Real W and Z bosons have been observed. Real Higgs bosons will probably be observed.
 
?? Real photons have been observed. Real gluons have been observed. Real W and Z bosons have been observed. Real Higgs bosons will probably be observed.

It more seems to me like predicting how the waves on a lake's surface will move not knowing exactly where the stone will fall. Something like that.
 
Phonons

I have found something by Hagelstein (MIT) mentioning "phonons".

"Inclusion of phonon exchange in a nuclear matrix element" (2007)

You can find this on arXiv...
 
I found another forum that discusses FZs work and other interesting stuff.
Those people are actually *reading* the stuff. And they try to use it.
Look at quantumtransition dot com.
This is something I want to see here too. People like most of you want to destroy everything that doesn't accord to the Mainstream. This has always been a bad idea.
But might not be the only phenomenon here, I would guess.
Even if Newtonian physics hit you right in the face as in the WTC7 case, you would probably find a way out and claim something - and here all what you had learned in QM magically disappears - completely improbable that even contradicts empirical data (no steel frame high-rise building has ever collapsed due to fire - there have been fires burning for 48h straight with much higher temperatures without reducing the whole building to a pile of rubble neatly arranged between adjacent buildings).

I hope I'm right so I can rant a little more ;-)
 

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