why mormon (LDS) worshipers are not Christians

[rwerdja]

How do you know you are correct and the Morons are wrong?

Did you mean to write morons .. instead of Mormons? I guess I would ask, as would most atheists, "what is the evidence to support your beliefs?"

I had two young men to my home a few weeks ago, from the Mormon Church, and they claimed to believe very strongly in Jesus and God .. and felt that they were as sure of Jesus being the son of God as they were sure of the table in front of them. Of course, they offered no proof or evidence, just a "feeling". I think they both would have called themselves Christians, although we didn't discuss it specifically.

 

[devnull]

All the "holy books" rewrite history....... I dont see how the BOM is any different.

 

[IMST]

alright, i see where you are going.. but to correct you "a few" would be an understatement.

the core concept they are missing- is that the bible is God's final word and and any subsequent book claiming to be holy violates a commandment.

I'm unfamiliar with any such commandment in the bible. If it is in Revelation as someone else said, that's hardly going to be a mainstream Christian objection. Revelation barely made it into the Bible itself and a lot of the more liberal Christians ignore it completely.

The issue is the Mormon concept of "God". I won't go into details..just google search it...but The Mormons beleive that God The Father was once a Man and became a God. This is directly against classic Christian theology. It's a very basic difference .

The Christian god concept changed quite a bit over time too. He's not literally hiding in the firmament anymore for anyone but the flat earthers. Sure they've added on, but most Christians have a serious lack or origin story for their god anyway.

IMST,

Well, it's a Christian-based religion/cult. Almost all religions start out as cults, when they get sufficiently large do they all become religions, or do some still remain cults? I'm not an expert on religion or occult, so I don't know

I think the difference between religion and cult is mainly one of marketing. It's all the same to me.

 

[gph]

I think the difference between religion and cult is mainly one of marketing. It's all the same to me.

The best explanation for the difference between religions and cults I've heard is "roughly 200 years"

 

[IMST]

The best explanation for the difference between religions and cults I've heard is "roughly 200 years"

Heh. I like that too.

 

[Tricky]

Im looking for a discussion about why mormons consider themselves Christians and why the popular consensus is that mormons are Christians?

Because they say they are.

Zackly. Who is the arbiter on what a True Christian is? Even Christians would, if pressed, say that God is the judge. Doesn't stop them from judging anyway though. Some of them are pretty sure that God agrees with them. Like these guys.

 

[Sword_Of_Truth]

If I'm not, what definition of Christian is out there that wouldn't include them?

Definitions conceived by other christian sects that compete for the same converts and donations as the Mormons do.

Don't listen to anyone who says that The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints aren't Christians. They wouldn't be saying it if there wasn't money involved.

 

[Piscivore]

its actually a bitterness I have with Mitt Romney as a politician, the guy is a swindler and will try to sell the public that he is a Christian and a representative of the largest religion in this country.

He would have zero chance as an open hindu/ pastafarian/ kebollah/ polygamist/ Scientology/ jehova witness etc.. i doubt a jew could be elected president.. but apparently Romney is Chrisitian enough!?!?

They used to say the same thing about Catholics and blacks. And wouldn't it be better to be focusing on his issues and opposing him because of those, not what "team" he's on?

 

[fromdownunder]

It says in Revelation somewhere that nothing can be added to the Bible.

But the Bible as we know it did not exist when Revelation was written, so how can the Author of Revelation possibly know what was going to eventually turn up in the Bible. It did not even exist as a book/series of short stories when Revelation was written. My understanding is that Revelation itself was only included, and only made the cut by a very few votes.

Norm

 

[Sword_Of_Truth]

It says in Revelation somewhere that nothing can be added to the Bible.

It says in Revelation that nothing can be added to Revelation. The Bible as we know it, wasn't established until centuries after its component books were written.

EDIT: fromdownunder beat me to it.

 

[Thunder]

It says in Revelation somewhere that nothing can be added to the Bible.

do you know how many books were not included in the NT?

many. these decisions were made by men, not God..or even Jesus.

 

[Doubt]

its actually a bitterness I have with Mitt Romney as a politician, the guy is a swindler and will try to sell the public that he is a Christian and a representative of the largest religion in this country.

He would have zero chance as an open hindu/ pastafarian/ kebollah/ polygamist/ Scientology/ jehova witness etc.. i doubt a jew could be elected president.. but apparently Romney is Chrisitian enough!?!?

Mitt's father was governor of Michigan. He is regarded as having been a good one. The Mormons are not much of a presence here.

 

[hgc]

alright, i see where you are going.. but to correct you "a few" would be an understatement.

the core concept they are missing- is that the bible is God's final word and and any subsequent book claiming to be holy violates a commandment.

In Matthew, Jesus says...

And when you pray, you must not be like the hypocrites. For they love to stand and pray in the synagogues and at the street corners, that they may be seen by others. Truly, I say to you, they have received their reward. But when you pray, go into your room and shut the door and pray to your Father who is in secret. And your Father who sees in secret will reward you.

As far as I'm concerned, anyone praying in public is not a Christian.

 

[Vic Vega]

As absurd as I think Mormonism is, it has nothing to do with why I wouldn't vote for Mitt Romney. I wouldn't vote for Mitt Romney because I live in Massachusetts and he was a lousy governor.


As far as Mormons not being Christians? Nonsense. If you believe in the divinity of Jesus, you're a Christian whether you or anyone else considers you one or not.

 

[aggle-rithm]

It says in Revelation somewhere that nothing can be added to the Bible. It's not a commandment as such, not one of the Big Ten, but it is in there. My understanding of the anti-Mormon position is that something written in the 1830s would be considered an addition, and therefore heretical. Thus, Mormons are heretics.

Disclaimer: I am not a priest, minister, or holy man of any stripe.

There wasn't a Bible yet when Revelations was written.

 

[samanthakayee]

As an X-mormon there is a lot of wacky stuff they think and do. But they do follow the bible/jesus christ/ and god.

I did get pushed more into the cult cloud by people making such statements as the OP.

 

[Foster Zygote]

Why do Baptists get to say they are true Christians? Catholics? Anglicans?

In the first few centuries of the history of Christianity the definition of orthodox Christianity was far more complicated than most modern Christians realize. Why do people who believe that Jesus is divine get to call themselves Christians? Why do people who think that Jesus and the Christ were the same being get to call themselves Christian? Why do people who think that Jesus actually died on the cross get to call themselves Christians?

It seems very likely that the actual Jeshua ben Joseph would have been appalled by the blasphemy that he was God (not to mention incensed that this blasphemous religion bearing his name would eventually become the official religion of the Roman Empire).

 

[MG1962]

There wasn't a Bible yet when Revelations was written.

Well it was half written

 

[Kopji]

Revelations? Aw heck...

Ye shall not add unto the word which I command you, neither shall ye diminish [ought] from it, that ye may keep the commandments of the LORD your God which I command you.

Deuteronomy 4:2

 

[Halfcentaur]

I don't think you understand how many adjustments and modifications have been made to what you consider the "original" bible, or the modern tenants of the modern Christian. Christ was not even considered divine by early Christian sects like the Gnostics. This was an issue of intense debate in early Christianity. You seem to be arguing from the position of a Christian, arguing about Scotsmen. There are no true Scotsmen, sir or madame. Yeshua was most probably a Jewish holy man who claimed to be the Messiah, a prophet, and never claimed to be divine in the first place. It was not until several decades later we begin to see this claim of divinity at all. I don't think you're prepared to even consider this.

The only difference between what you consider "real" and the mormons, is how recent the revisions have been made.

Furthermore, the Mormons you claim are hiding under tax exemption, at least the majority of them, actually believe what they were raised and told was true. Just as you probably believe what you were indoctrinated within was true, as do the Hindus of India and the Buddhists of India, and Asia, and the Muslims of Afghanistan, and the followers of Thor and Odin of ancient Norway. It's disturbing to see you so ready to write people off as pretending to believe just because you are aware of holes in their reasoning.