Apparently Dave Thomas and others debating Gage, Harrit etc on Coast to Coast?

[beachnut]

Only idiots fall for Gages moronic lies, and Gage is compiling a list of idiots dumb enough to sign up for his fraud. How much money has bill smith sent Gage so Gage can travel and spread idiotic lies?

 

[Sword_Of_Truth]

then let's say that 1199-plus degreed and licenced architects are demanding a new and independent 9/11 enquiry from a congress that is studiously and obviously ignoring them and their degrees. For how long will that be a tenable situation though ?

2,000,000 - 1,199 = 1,998,801

 

[Sword_Of_Truth]

More than 170,000 fresh engineers are graduated from colleges, universities and tech schools across the US and Canada in a single year.

These are added to an existing base of nearly two million engineers.

That's going to leave a mark!

It would, except that I screwed it up.

That 170,000 isn't just one year. I misread the US Dept of Labor stats on engineers, it's actually the increase over a ten year period.

So the number of newly minted engineers in a year is only fourteen times bigger than Gages entire fan club rather than 140.

My bad.

 

[DaveThomasNMSR]

Now if we could just get them all to go to Richard Gage's presentations we would find more than 90% of them supporting the controlled demolition theory. That is the normal result at the end of the lectures and has been from pretty well the beginning.

Most engineers have never even thought past the government story as parrotted by the media and as a result they have not examined the specifics for themselves. But just one short lecture from Richard is usually enough for a 100% about-face.

My experience, at my first debate with Gage, was basically that after Gage spoke, the truthers still agreed with him, and he swayed a few undecideds. After I spoke, the truthers were still truthers, but the formerly undecideds switched back. So basically, a wash.

Gage's account is here, and mine here.

Gage's first report badly misrepresented ("lied about", if you prefer) the actual vote:

A twenty-minute question and answer period followed my talk. As the meeting was adjourned and everyone was poised to leave, I asked for one more show of hands. This time, the results were almost the same as when the afternoon began: “Fires brought down buildings” (sixteen hands), “Unsure” (eight), and “Explosive controlled demolition” (six).

A few days after the talks, Gage posted only the first two votes on his Web site, misreporting the second vote severely (making his 56–44 percent margin of victory into an 86–14 percent landslide). After I protested, Gage corrected his numbers and even included the third vote, while dismissing it as “useless” because of the brevity of the presentations and the fact that some audience members arrived late.

Gage makes every effort to make these "presentations" one-sided. Look at the AE911 presentations page, and see how all the other talks went, then look again at all the weasel-wording about the Socorro debate.

I only had a few days to prepare for that debate. Now I've had months, and have my own physics models for the collapses, lateral ejections of beams, dynamic impacts, etc.

If I tied Gage with very little preparation, how will I do with lots of preparation? And the help of JREFers on this forum?

Being a geologist/seismologist for my day job, I'm heading to the remote field for a couple of weeks. I'll return a few days before the big Debate. On July 31 at 10 PM MDT, I'll do some live blogging here so folks can comment on the debate as it progresses.

See you then! Meanwhile, have fun waiting for BS to come up with evidence-based reasons to believe his claims.

Cheers, Dave

 

[tsig]

Again, why do they have to see a physical presentation by Gage in order to be so convinced? Why isn't their material available online good enough? Does he have a super sexy voice in real life?

The magic can only be passed on personally.

 

[Grizzly Bear]

This is horse ****! There were about 74 attendees at the presentation DGM and I attended. I believe there was 1 licensed Engineer in attendance and he disagreed with Gage. Most of the people that attend his **** Show are truthers.

Edited by LashL: 

Edited to properly mask profanity. Please see Rule 10 and don't change spelling and use symbols etc. to avoid the auto-censor.

From time to time I see banners for these kinds of groups on my University campus, but it's quite rare, and the few people that have seen the conspiracy docs have pretty much told they were total BS. I haven't seen any of the specifically 9/11 truther related stuff but I've seen banners for zeitgeist and alex Jone's Obama thing, but whatever movement there is at my school barely makes any of its presence felt. In the school of Architecture they've been nearly non-existent since I started there in 2005, save for maybe one single person who had an infowars banner on her laptop. I haven't seen her since hanging around. So there's thes types of people there, but certainly not prevalent.

 

[tsig]

Well most of them certainly seem to be by the time they leave anyway. Not that most of them do anything about it but I bet they sure aren't happy either and the time will come sure as eggs is eggs...
Most people prefer to believe their leaders are just and fair even in the face of evidence to the contrary, because once a citizen acknowledges that the government under which they live is lying and corrupt, the citizen has to choose what he or she will do about it. To take action in the face of a corrupt government entails risks of harm to life and loved ones. To choose to do nothing is to surrender one’s self-image of standing for principles. Most people do not have the courage to face that choice. Hence, most propaganda is not designed to fool the critical thinker but only to give moral cowards an excuse not to think at all.

Remember this ? It applies 100% to this sitiation...

"In the beginning of a change, the Patriot is a scarce man, brave, hated and scorned. When his cause succeeds, however, the timid join him, for then it costs nothing to be a Patriot."

--Mark Twain

With time eggs become chickens...or rotten. I don't see any chicks

 

[DGM]

It would, except that I screwed it up.

That 170,000 isn't just one year. I misread the US Dept of Labor stats on engineers, it's actually the increase over a ten year period.

So the number of newly minted engineers in a year is only fourteen times bigger than Gages entire fan club rather than 140.

My bad.

I thought the numbers appeared a bit high. I was getting visions of being over-run by engineers.

 

[bill smith]

My experience, at my first debate with Gage, was basically that after Gage spoke, the truthers still agreed with him, and he swayed a few undecideds. After I spoke, the truthers were still truthers, but the formerly undecideds switched back. So basically, a wash.

Gage's account is here, and mine here.

Gage's first report badly misrepresented ("lied about", if you prefer) the actual vote:


Gage makes every effort to make these "presentations" one-sided. Look at the AE911 presentations page, and see how all the other talks went, then look again at all the weasel-wording about the Socorro debate.

I only had a few days to prepare for that debate. Now I've had months, and have my own physics models for the collapses, lateral ejections of beams, dynamic impacts, etc.

If I tied Gage with very little preparation, how will I do with lots of preparation? And the help of JREFers on this forum?

Being a geologist/seismologist for my day job, I'm heading to the remote field for a couple of weeks. I'll return a few days before the big Debate. On July 31 at 10 PM MDT, I'll do some live blogging here so folks can comment on the debate as it progresses.

See you then! Meanwhile, have fun waiting for BS to come up with evidence-based reasons to believe his claims.

Cheers, Dave

Well you can only do your best.See you in a few weeks then.

 

[bill smith]

2,000,000 - 1,199 = 1,998,801

Even if your figures had been accurate it cannot be assumed that they support the government OCT. In fact virtually none of the two million engineers have been asked to go on the record with their opinion. ae911truth.org has 1200-plus degreed/licenced architects and engineers who have literally put their careers on the line after lengthy study in their area of professional expertise told them that the Twin Towers had been professionally demolished.

I doubt that the governmant can come up with 100 engineering names in total who agree in writing that the Towers collapsed because of fire, terrorists and planes.

 

[DGM]

ae911truth.org has 1200-plus degreed/licenced architects and engineers who have literally put their careers on the line after lengthy study in their area of professional expertise told them that the Twin Towers had been professionally demolished.

And how do you know this? Have you asked them or are you taking Gage's word?

 

[DGM]

I doubt that the governmant can come up with 100 engineering names in total who agree in writing that the Towers collapsed because of fire, terrorists and planes.

There are more then one hundred listed in the NIST reports. You really don't research anything do you?

 

[bill smith]

There are more then one hundred listed in the NIST reports. You really don't research anything do you?

The scientists who were contracted by NIST carried out compartmentalised studies on this or that particular sublect. The heads of NIST drew the disparate threads together into the woven lies of 9/11.

 

[DGM]

The scientists who were contracted by NIST carried out compartmentalised studies on this or that particular sublect. The heads of NIST drew the disparate threads together into the woven lies of 9/11.

So that's how they did it!

 

[bill smith]

So that's how they did it!

That's how NIST did it yes. It's really not that complicated. The guys at the top are the only ones with the full picture. They can play it how they like. It was ever thus though hopefully this time we will corner them.

 

[DGM]

That's how NIST did it yes. It's really not that complicated. The guys at the top are the only ones with the full picture. They can play it how they like. It was ever thus though hopefully this time we will corner them.

I don't feel I need to add anything to this.

 

[Edx]

That's how NIST did it yes. It's really not that complicated. The guys at the top are the only ones with the full picture. They can play it how they like. It was ever thus though hopefully this time we will corner them.

And yet because of NISTs investigation all kinds of important building codes have been revised around the world affecting hundreds of thousands of actual working engineers every day. Why don't they question it Bill? Are they just too stupid and believe everything they hear and only Gage's gaggle understand the truth?

Truthers act like the NIST reports were just some kind of irrelevant government report that had no affect on the industry.

 

[bill smith]

And yet because of NISTs investigation all kinds of important building codes have been revised around the world affecting hundreds of thousands of actual working engineers every day. Why don't they question it Bill? Are they just too stupid and believe everything they hear and only Gage's gaggle understand the truth?

Truthers act like the NIST reports were just some kind of irrelevant government report that had no affect on the industry.

I am not aware of a single building code that has been changed im Europe in response to the NIST reports. I doubt that Russia or China would have changed anything either. So I would be obliged if you would provide links to information on especially European building code changes in response to the NIST 9/11 reports.

 

[Dog Town]

ae911truth.org has 1200-plus degreed/licenced architects and engineers.

Ummm...no they don't!
Unless you can show a list of deg/licenced eng/architects that totals 1200+, cause Box Boys won't make it.It is only another lie! I already know the answer, do you?

 

[Edx]

I am not aware of a single building code that has been changed im Europe in response to the NIST reports. I doubt that Russia or China would have changed anything either. So I would be obliged if you would provide links to information on especially European building code changes in response to the NIST 9/11 reports.

http://911-engineers.blogspot.com/

If you scroll down you can see organisations affected, also see from the top of the next page .

Seems to be rather a lot, don't you agree?

So, see my previous question... Why don't they question it Bill? Are they just too stupid and believe everything they hear and only Gage's gaggle understand the truth?

EDIT:

Also found an interesting quote:

"The World Trade Center could not have been built in the United Kingdom," insists Ed Galea director of the Fire Safety Engineering Group at the University of Greenwich in London. "The number of the staircases would have been insufficient. The nature of those staircases would not have met our requirements. We would have required concrete. You would have also needed lobbies on each floor to protect staircases from smoke. Also, the connections between the floor joists and upright columns would've been much more robust. It's all part of the U.K. building code." It's unlikely that the WTC could have been constructed in Japan either. "Buildings one hundred meters or higher are framed in reinforced concrete rather than steel," Tokyo structural engineer Masahiko Fukasawa says.

http://www.skyscrapersafety.org/html/article_20040309.html