Merged Israel Attacks Palestinian Aid Flotilla, According To Reports

[Pardalis]

Originally Posted by Pardalis http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/helloworld2/buttons/viewpost.gif
Is anyone serious when they think a secular democratic state that governs two of the most belligerent nations in the world,

actually, no...you did not.
please learn to read your own posts more carefully.

What exactly is your problem?

The two nations I am talking about are the Israelis and the Palestinians.

Do you honestly believe those two nations can live peacefully under the same secular government, after 60 years of mutual hatred?

 

[WildCat]

Oh, they were only beaten, and I don't see any evidence that the journalists were blocking any access to anything. If they beat back then they get shot. Journalists had their notes and equipment taken. What happened to freedom of speech. This is the neccessary result of apartheid.

Re-definition of words as part of the propaganda war against Israel Example #? hell I've lost count.

 

[fallout]

Stupid actions like sailing a flotilla of ships into a blockade, knowing they'd be intercepted, and then attacking the soldiers who do so?

Yeah, it is pretty amazing how far people will go to defend stupid actions like that.

It's not stupid, it's a defying act on an arrogant , immoral and roguish blockade based on the delusion that this will keep the terrorists (read turkey, former Israel ally prior to this crime) from smuggling military supply to Hamas. Do you think Turkey support terrorists? Do you readly believe the kooky story that the only way of keeping Hamas in check is this one brutal blockade?

What about lifting the siege and bringing the problem to UN to solve? Do you think it's impossible to implement a policy of searching all the humanitarian ships to gaza, let alone scouting all the ships so the evil terrorists can't smuggle deadly weapons while the ships are on it's way?

I just gave one of the many solutions to the problem, which is surprisingly difficult for the people who seemed to buy all the bull from Israel regarding this, and why not all the bull that is yet to come, to realize.

 

[Thunder]

Do you honestly believe those two nations can live peacefully under the same secular government, after 60 years of mutual hatred?

Who cares. A secular bi-national state= marching the Jews into the Sea. Right?

And a two-state solution ALSO= marching the Jews into the Sea.

Could you do us all a favor and let us know, what scenario other than total control from the Sea to the River, does NOT equal "marching the Jews into the Sea"?

 

[Pardalis]

Do you think Turkey support terrorists?

The IHH does.

 

[Darth Rotor]

To put this in perspective this freaking idiot ought to be dead.

http://www.caller.com/news/2010/jun/02/israel-deports-corpus-christi-man-flotilla/

Retired Corpus Christi accountant Joe Meadors arrived at Corpus Christi International Airport on Tuesday after Israel deported him following an incident Sunday that killed at least nine of his fellow activists and injured several Israeli soldiers.

He was shot in the stomach with a paint ball, which apparently accounts for his injury during his desire to go looking for trouble.

Had the Israelis not shown the (IMO overly measured) restraint, he'd instead have been shot in the stomach with a pistol or shotgun, and likely be dead ... or a martyr for his favorite cause. Their restraint was demonstrated by fast roping with paint guns, not the usual machine pistols, shotguns, and such. The people on that ship are beneficiaries of remarkable restraint, though obviously, when things got rough, the lead flew. So it goes when you attack soldiers. Their comrades shoot at you. Clue the hell up, people.

The people on that sixth ship went there looking for trouble.
They found it.

What are they whinging about? What are so many of you whinging about?

As to a few of the arse clowns who fancy yourselves sea lawyers, the Israelis basically need to intercept the ship before it hits Gaza/Hamas territorial waters. If they don't, their legal situation is worse. Just because you claim the blockade is illegal doesn't make it so.

Since they have a declared an active blockade(embargo?? quarantine?), they are obliged to enforce it. So they do. You can spend all day arguing whether or not the blockade is legit, and I can find actual intelligent discourse on that elsewhere. This thread is a bust. It, the legitimacy of embargo/blockade, is a question of interest and of merit. But I think the Israelis bring some cards to the legal table on that one, as do those opposed to them.

Since they have had a blockade in fact, linked to the acts of belligerency, and co belligerency, between Isr and the Pals in Hamas, Dec 2008 and so on, they are probably on solid enough legal grounds to assert the blockade is legit.

Anyone who served in MISO and MIO ops in the Adriatic or Red Sea can tell you more.

DR

 

[Thunder]

Apparently, 23 pages is too much reading material.

got that page for me yet? I'll read it if you tell me which one to read.

 

[quixotecoyote]

It's not stupid, it's a defying act on an arrogant , immoral and roguish blockade

It's rougish now too?

based on the delusion that this will keep the terrorists (read turkey, former Israel ally prior to this crime) from smuggling military supply to Hamas. Do you think Turkey support terrorists?

The blockade is on all maritime trade, not just from Turkey.

Do you readly believe the kooky story that the only way of keeping Hamas in check is this one brutal blockade?

Let's see how it stacks up to your solutions:

What about lifting the siege and bringing the problem to UN to solve?

Please show the UN's record that would make this plausible.

Do you think it's impossible to implement a policy of searching all the humanitarian ships to gaza, let alone scouting all the ships so the evil terrorists can't smuggle deadly weapons while the ships are on it's way?

That's what the blockade does right now.

I just gave one of the many solutions to the problem, which is surprisingly difficult for the people who seemed to buy all the bull from Israel regarding this, and why not all the bull that is yet to come, to realize.

Your solution was "Do nothing and hope the UN does something."

Color me unimpressed.

 

[WildCat]

r u suggesting Israel should sink the next ship that dares to defy the Chosen Blockade? One is supposed to show up late Friday. Onboard, is an Irish Nobel Laureate.

shall I get you the number for the Israeli Navy?

I don't suggest anything, I say exactly what I mean. That's what we Midwesterners do.

I don't interpret strawman to English though, so forgive me if I don't respond to any of your posts except to mock them.

 

[Pardalis]

The people on that sixth ship went there looking for trouble.
They found it.

And there are plenty more to come. Apparently they plan on sending more armadas flotillas.

 

[Thunder]

Have fun with your strawmen there, you guys want to be alone?

I was not aware that you support the two-state solution, whereby Israel gives back around 95% of the West Bank and some sections of East Jerusalem. Glad to have you aboard.

 

[fallout]

be aware, that many Jews in the USA and Europe, are very much against this illegal blockade, and against this attack upon the aid flotilla.

Israel represents the worst amoung our people. But it does NOT represent our people.

Parky are you saying you're jewish? That's what it seems from your statement. If so, well I am very aware of many jews being completely enraged about it. All the rational ones should be, only the zionist fanactics have room and nerve to endorse the crime. Even haaretz took the position of being blunt on the criticism on the operation and the way it backfires to Israel. And also , people like Noam chomsky, Finkelstein, Vanunu and many many other reasonably high-profile jewish people are coming out and condemning it. So you can safely be sure that I know that.

It's astounding how the israeli government which can be called "bibi regime" is getting away with it. It's at the very least shameful and embarassing for the UN and U.S. And it teaches the lesson for anyone knowing to know how far one can go in gruesome acts of violation of international law. It's dangerous stuff.

 

[Thunder]

And there are plenty more to come. Apparently they plan on sending more armadas flotillas.

I expect Israel to respond to the next ship, due to arrive on Friday eve, with the same tact, sensitivity, and grace that they did with the ones last weekend.

Or maybe they will just do what the right-wing extremists want...and blow them out of the water as the "terrorist-Nazis" that they are.

 

[WildCat]

a good 30 years before the Ottomans lost control of Palestine. The First Aliyah did indeed take place during Muslim rule. I wonder why sooo many Jews would immigrate to a land that was soooo discriminatory towards Jews?

"The First Aliyah (also The Farmers' Aliyah) was the first modern widespread wave of Zionistaliyah. Jews who migrated to Palestine in this wave came mostly from Eastern Europe and from Yemen. This wave of aliyah began in 1881–82 and lasted until 1903.[1][2] An estimated 25,000[3]–35,000[4] Jews immigrated to Ottoman Syria during the First Aliyah. "

Oh look, tens of thousands MORE Jews immigrated to Muslim-ruled Palestine. How strange of all these Jews huh?

I can't imagine why Jews would have left eastern Europe during that time. They were getting so much love there!

The Ottomans must have been super-loving. Or at least not killing them and seizing their property.

 

[Pardalis]

I was not aware that you support the two-state solution, whereby Israel gives back around 95% of the West Bank and some sections of East Jerusalem. Glad to have you aboard.

I was on board all along. The one-state solution on the other hand... clearly ridiculous.

 

[quixotecoyote]

I was on board all along. The one-state solution on the other hand... clearly ridiculous.

wow....yet ANOTHER person proclaims the nation of palestine. With all you Israel bots apparently believing its already happened how come its impossible to achieve?

How many threads have we done to death on Israel's Camp David offer and how it blows the "neither side (*cough Israel cough*)will make meaningful concessions" claim out of the water? How many times have we pointed to that as a reasonable solution that we would support? And how long will the fool play his silly game of having a spaz attack every time someone refers to Palestine as a nation?

 

[Pardalis]

wow....yet ANOTHER person proclaims the nation of palestine.

When did I say otherwise?

how come its impossible to achieve?

Hamas.

 

[The Fool]

I was on board all along. The one-state solution on the other hand... clearly ridiculous.

hear a lot of you are on board....but.....whats the reason that it can't happen? seems There is always a reason that you think it should happen but just not now...

 

[Thunder]

I can't imagine why Jews would have left eastern Europe during that time. They were getting so much love there!

I don't recall condemning Jews for moving to Palestine during the late 1800s and the early 1900s. They could have easily moved to the USA, but instead chose a much rougher and ideologically driven life in Muslim-ruled Palestine.

The point was, (as I am SURE you are aware) that if Muslim-ruled Palestine was soooo very hard on Jews, they would not have gone there. The Muslims allowed the Jews to build many settlements and set the groundwork for the new Jewish state.

God love those Muslim Turks. We couldn't have done it without them...huh?

 

[WildCat]

Most of the items in that picture look innocent to me. Tools are normal things to find aboard a ship and the knives look like they could be found in any kitchen, so unless they were in people's hands at the time of boarding I wouldn't make anyting of them. That one knife there looks like a decorative piece found in many collectible magazines.

It's hard to imagine any used for the clubs except planned violence. They look like they've been cut from useful tools for the purpose of making clubs. They may not be the most deadly thing there, but they look the most damning to me.

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