Census Answers to Race

[Uncayimmy]

Edited by Tricky: 

Edited for response to modded post.

 

[Puppycow]

Yes. I can quantify the chemical makeup, shape, and dimensions. I'd call that scientific. How about you?

Well, some companies sell something they call "thin spaghetti" that has the same chemical makeup, shape, and dimensions as something sold by another company under the name "vermicelli." I think you could say it is a social construct if you wanted.

 

[Uncayimmy]

Well, some companies sell something they call "thin spaghetti" that has the same chemical makeup, shape, and dimensions as something sold by another company under the name "vermicelli." I think you could say it is a social construct if you wanted.

Actually, spaghettini is thin spaghetti. Vermicelli is, well, vermicelli. It's thinner than thin spaghetti. But, yes, language is most certainly a social construct. Thanks for pointing that out.

You gonna answer my questions about race?

 

[Puppycow]

You gonna answer my questions about race?

Maybe later, but not now as real life is calling me.

 

[quixotecoyote]

Yes. I can quantify the chemical makeup, shape, and dimensions. I'd call that scientific. How about you?


So blind people know not of race? How empty their lives must be.

You might want to read this.
http://www.biologyreference.com/Ar-Bi/Biology-of-Race.html

If a Caucasoid and a Mongoloid (if you can find a "pure" one of each) have a baby, what it is? If that child grows up to mate with a Negroid, what is the child? When that child grows up and mates with an Australoid, what is that child? And when that child grows up to have a baby with a Capoid, what is it? I guess I should just look at the kid and say, "Gee, it looks like a Negroid, what with the nappy hair and dark skin! But wait...look at that epicanthic fold. Surely this is a Mongoloid. Then again, that nose is definitely that of a Caucasoid."

You're a bit behind the times. Do try to catch up.

This might be a good starting point
http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/...on_of_Race_and_Ethnicity_in_the_United_States

This groundbreaking collection of classic and cutting edge sociological research gives special attention to the social construction of race and ethnicity in the United States. It offers an in-depth and eye-opening analysis of (a) the power of racial classification to shape our understanding of race and race relations, (b) the way in which the system came into being and remains, and (c) the real consequences this system has on life chances. The readings deal with five major themes: the personal experience of classification schemes; classifying people by race; ethnic classification; the persistence, functions, and consequences of social classification; and a new paradigm: transcending categories. For individuals who want to gain a fuller understanding of the impact the ideas of race has on a society that is consumed by it.

 

[Cavemonster]

Uncayimmy,
Really?
You think the statement that racial categories are socially and culturally determined implies that race is a scientific concept?

How on FSM's green earth do you get there? That's an utterly contradictory position you're taking. If the categories of race are social, what is left of "race" to be otherwise, the whole concept of race is a concept of categories.

As for addressing you thinking it "stupid" I could only assume you thought it stupid based on the single reason you presented, otherwise you're chastising me for failing to address a position you have not really presented. Is there another reason you think the question is stupid besides the erroneous notion that it presents race as other than a social/political construction?

 

[slingblade]

Anecdotally, in every Internet article, forum post, or blog I've read so far on this tedious subject, without exception, the people who say they've answered "human" or "American" identify themselves as white.

Also, this poll is flawed. There is no option for "the race both I and the Feds would consider me to be." Seriously, there is no way one could look at me and presume I'm anything but white. Why isn't that a poll option?

 

[Professor Yaffle]

I have no idea why so many people want to mess with the goverments statistics of the ethnic make-up of their country.

 

[slingblade]

I have no idea why so many people want to mess with the goverments statistics of the ethnic make-up of their country.

From what I've read, most of them think asking the question is, itself, a racist act. That asking people to self-identify themselves oppresses them and unfairly discriminates against them.

Oddly, they demand to know why the question is asked, but apparently this is rhetorical; they don't expect anyone to have any answers for them. When answers are presented, they either refuse to read them, or else respond with some form of "that's not a good/real reason, though." Why it's not a good reason seems, however, to elude them.

They seem to think it discriminatory and invasive for a nation to know the racial/ethnic make-up of its own citizenry. As if no useful information--nothing that could help improve civil rights or equality, for example--could be gleaned from knowing how the citizens self-identify. That race-based programs are racist, or perpetuate racism, by attempting to address race-based discrepancies or inequities.

I can only guess they believe that ignoring race and racism will make it magically go away.

 

[Fnord]

My brother didn't want to fill it out so I decided to put him down as "gay" for race.

Of course there are many options such as purple, redneck, terran, Romulan, Vulcan, Borg, White and Nerdy, PinkSkin, Golden Graham Brown, Eurasian Afroamerican, etc.

.
How about "NASCAR"?

No, wait ... that's a collection of races.

 

[Ladewig]

Why did you leave "blank" off of your poll choices? I expect that that was the first choice for people who objected to the race question.

 

[ZirconBlue]

Also, this poll is flawed. There is no option for "the race both I and the Feds would consider me to be." Seriously, there is no way one could look at me and presume I'm anything but white. Why isn't that a poll option?

I chose the first option, on the basis that it doesn't actually exclude the option that I might agree with the government.

Personally, while I feel that "race" is basically a bogus cultural construct, it has real implications in society. Racism exists, even if it's basis is irrational, and it's difficult to study the societal implications without data.

 

[bluesjnr]

I have no idea why so many people want to mess with the goverments statistics of the ethnic make-up of their country.

It's probably because they are fairly insignificant in real life. It's the only way they can "mess with the man" without actually, messing with the man. They are the masters of pointless activism.

Perpetrators seem to live in a morass of didactical pedantry.

Of course that is just a gross generalisation based on my own personal observations and in no way should be taken to mean any particular poster on this thread. Or, on the other hand, it could be an accurate description. I don't know but I'm sure someone will keep me right.

 

[slingblade]

I chose the first option, on the basis that it doesn't actually exclude the option that I might agree with the government.

As it's not specified in the same way the other choices are, I find it conspicuous by its absence.

Personally, while I feel that "race" is basically a bogus cultural construct, it has real implications in society. Racism exists, even if it's basis is irrational, and it's difficult to study the societal implications without data.

That's the way I think of it as well. I know that the concept of race is a construct, but the effects of that concept are demonstrable.

 

[Vorticity]

From the poll:

The race the Fed would consider me to be

Does the Fed "consider" people to be various races?

 

[Skeptical Greg]

So, when I was filling out the Community Survey thing for the census, they wanted to know all about the races in my family. I checked other and wrote in human. Anybody else?

We have had 3 or 4 threads about this in the past few months, did you by chance join any of those discussions?

Why would you expect The U.S. guv'mnt to actually understand the concept of ' race ' ?

Imagine the uproar if the question was " What is the color of your skin ? " ...

Meanwhile, here we go again with what does race and gender, have to do with the re-distribution of confiscated wealth ...

 

[Richard Masters]

I have no idea why so many people want to mess with the goverments statistics of the ethnic make-up of their country.

Normally I do because they make certain ethnicities and races mutually exclusive. For example I consider myself White and Hispanic, and sometimes that option does not exist.

Even in the last census, they grouped Mexican Americans, Chicanos, and Mexicans in the same ethnicity. I consider myself Mexican by descent and culture, but not Chicano, and rarely Mexican American.

In the last census they were quite better educated about race and ethnicity, but I don't understand why they want to group Chicanos, Mexicans and Mexican Americans; or keep White separate from Hispanic.

Fortunately, you can write whatever you want on the last census, so I don't feel compelled to mess with the statistics.

 

[Lucian]

Anecdotally, in every Internet article, forum post, or blog I've read so far on this tedious subject, without exception, the people who say they've answered "human" or "American" identify themselves as white.

Also, this poll is flawed. There is no option for "the race both I and the Feds would consider me to be." Seriously, there is no way one could look at me and presume I'm anything but white. Why isn't that a poll option?

This is the post that I was going to make. Get out of my head (really, it's dark and scary in there). Or take the MDC.

I would add, though, that the "Feds" are perfectly happy to consider you to be whatever race you consider yourself to be. For instance, census takers are not encouraged to respond "Oh, you are not" when someone identifies his or her race. "Really?" and "Yes, and what else?" are also frowned upon. Admittedly, the Census Bureau would prefer respondents provide an answer that is in some way vaguely useful.

 

[Uncayimmy]

Does the Fed "consider" people to be various races?

Yes. Look at the requirements for being a minority owned business.

 

[Uncayimmy]

We have had 3 or 4 threads about this in the past few months, did you by chance join any of those discussions?

This thread is a poll asking what people filled out on the census forms. Some people, it would seem, don't like that I even asked the question, so it's become something else entirely. That's not my fault.