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Amanda Knox guilty - all because of a cartwheel

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halides1 said:
With respect to the knife DNA profile, I strongly suspect contamination. With respect to the bra clasp, tampering, contamination, and secondary or tertiary transfer of DNA prior to its being taken into evidence are all worthy of serious consideration, IMO.
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Where did the primary transfer occur? And why was it not found by the forensics team if it was in a large enough concentration to be transferred a minimum of 2 more times and still not require LCN techniques to achieve a full profile?
 
halides1 said:
With respect to the knife DNA profile, I strongly suspect contamination. With respect to the bra clasp, tampering, contamination, and secondary or tertiary transfer of DNA prior to its being taken into evidence are all worthy of serious consideration, IMO.
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We know Halides1 that you think that both the knife and the bra clasp are suspect. You have given evidence that in other cases contamination did occur,

What you haven't done is to provide evidence of this contamination in THIS particular case. Or since you will most like claim that the precise source of contamination cannot be know, provide us with a theory that shows us that contamination is more likely then not in this particular case.
 
Fulcanelli said:
This is all covered in the Massei Report.
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Then you should have no problem giving us the page number of the Massei Report where audits and accreditation of the Rome crime lab is discussed. A bit of quoted text would also help prove your claim.
 
Kestrel said:
Then you should have no problem giving us the page number of the Massei Report where audits and accreditation of the Rome crime lab is discussed. A bit of quoted text would also help prove your claim.
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You'll see it once it's published...won't you?
 
Kestrel said:
Then you should have no problem giving us the page number of the Massei Report where audits and accreditation of the Rome crime lab is discussed. A bit of quoted text would also help prove your claim.
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Do you have a copy of the report? Bruce probably has one too and Mary H most certainly should as she expects to defend AK's innocence. Who here doesn't have a copy?
 
Fulcanelli said:
Yes, but their's is in Italian ;)
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You mean they don't have any translated document? What are they waiting for? How can the family not have paid for an authentic translation when they have the appeal coming up? Why hasn't the defense fund paid for a proper translation? isn't this a crucial piece of the puzzle for any serious discussion of the Knox defense?
 
43degreesNorth said:
You mean they don't have any translated document? What are they waiting for? How can the family not have paid for an authentic translation when they have the appeal coming up? Why hasn't the defense fund paid for a proper translation? isn't this a crucial piece of the puzzle for any serious discussion of the Knox defense?
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From some of the discussion here I have come to wonder whether there is an issue with information they have, or an issue with information they are willing to make more public.

There is a difference between a discussion of the Knox defense and a discussion of the Knox case. Knox defenders may be understandably reluctant to spotlight info which doesn't reflect well on that defense. They struggle enough with what is generally accessible.
 
A question about psychology/psychiatry and Italian courts.

I'm not aware of any expert appraisal having been made of the mental health/state of any of the accused. Such reports are routine in murder trials in many Western countries.

Detailed psychiatric reports by (independent) clinical experts could and probably WOULD be very illuminating indeed. Particularly of Rudy Guede, although realistically that’s now out of the question.

If I was Knox's and Sollicito's attorneys, I would ask their clients to submit to them, and request that the reports be admitted into testimony.

Is this ever done in Italian trials? Are they even admissible where a defendent isn't manifestly unhinged, or is psychology/psychiatry regarded as "untried" and unreliable?

That would be very strange (absurd, actually) when at the same time so much latitude is given to the extraordinary "intuition" of personality, character and motivation by the likes of Mignini, Giobbi, Commodi, Massei et al (not to mention the report from a ‘graphologist’ commissioned by Mignini who, incredibly, wasn't even required to appear in court).
 
Is there any reason why Guede might feel constrained from now telling the whole unvarnished truth about what happened? I.e. are there charges that he could still face if he now changed his story in some way?
 
Supernaut said:
I'm not aware of any expert appraisal having been made of the mental health/state of any of the accused. Such reports are routine in murder trials in many Western countries.

Detailed psychiatric reports by (independent) clinical experts could and probably WOULD be very illuminating indeed. Particularly of Rudy Guede, although realistically that’s now out of the question.

If I was Knox's and Sollicito's attorneys, I would ask their clients to submit to them, and request that the reports be admitted into testimony.

Is this ever done in Italian trials? Are they even admissible where a defendent isn't manifestly unhinged, or is psychology/psychiatry regarded as "untried" and unreliable?

That would be very strange (absurd, actually) when at the same time so much latitude is given to the extraordinary "intuition" of personality, character and motivation by the likes of Mignini, Giobbi, Commodi, Massei et al (not to mention the report from a ‘graphologist’ commissioned by Mignini who, incredibly, wasn't even required to appear in court).
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I thought Amanda had been interviewed by a psychologist while in jail and testimony of the psychologist's impressions/appraisal was later admitted at trial. I do not know if the psychologist was independent, a defense witness, or someone affiliated with the jail/police. Also, the report/analysis may have been narrowly focused.
 
Matthew Best said:
Is there any reason why Guede might feel constrained from now telling the whole unvarnished truth about what happened? I.e. are there charges that he could still face if he now changed his story in some way?
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I have some ideas but, as certain posters are fond of saying;

The conspiracy forum is that-a-way ------------->
 
Supernaut said:
I'm not aware of any expert appraisal having been made of the mental health/state of any of the accused. Such reports are routine in murder trials in many Western countries.
<snip>
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I'm curious about this. Do you have some sort of support for that statement? My impression is that unless one of the parties involved (usually the defense) chooses to make it an issue relevant to the case then it normally is not done.
 
christianahannah said:
I thought Amanda had been interviewed by a psychologist while in jail and testimony of the psychologist's impressions/appraisal was later admitted at trial. I do not know if the psychologist was independent, a defense witness, or someone affiliated with the jail/police. Also, the report/analysis may have been narrowly focused.
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I'm sure it's standard prodedure when trying someone for murder in Italy (as esle where) to ascertain that there are no obvious signs of certifiable insanity.

But a meaningful pyschiatric evaluation (i.e. to ascertain psychopathy) can require hours of interviews (with the subject, family members and others) and detailed research into the person's past.

Given the, er, unhurried manner in which trials proceed in Itlay, time can hardly be an issue.
 
quadraginta said:
I'm curious about this. Do you have some sort of support for that statement? My impression is that unless one of the parties involved (usually the defense) chooses to make it an issue relevant to the case then it normally is not done.
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I shouldn't have used the word "routine", which might be taken to mean 'mandatory'.

But psych evaluations of suspects are very common in murder trials in the UK and the US, and it seems to me that they are even more urgently needed in Italy, where the prosecution (the State, in effect) is completely unrestrained when it comes to "speculating" about (to reiterate) personality, character and motivation.
 
Supernaut said:
I'm sure it's standard prodedure when trying someone for murder in Italy (as esle where) to ascertain that there are no obvious signs of certifiable insanity.

But a meaningful pyschiatric evaluation (i.e. to ascertain psychopathy) can require hours of interviews (with the subject, family members and others) and detailed research into the person's past.

Given the, er, unhurried manner in which trials proceed in Itlay, time can hardly be an issue.
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Actually, one needn't even be looking for signs of pyscopathy, but simply latent (unexpressed) anger/rage, resentment, etc' etc'.

Which, from what I can gather, are singulary absent in both Knox and Sollicito.

I would like to see this confirmed by a qualified psych, and presented in court.
 
christianahannah said:
There is nothing wrong with having the motivations in Italian - that is the language in which it was composed.
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This is true...if one is conversant in Italian. However, it's been shown a few times that nearly everyone here is dependent on Google translations - which are horribly inaccurate.
 
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