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Amanda Knox guilty - all because of a cartwheel

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You don't compensate the family by making money off the back of their daughter you murdered. What's wrong with you???

You get way ahead of yourself by always starting with the presumption that Amanda committed the murder. What are you doing here, anyway? If you so strongly believe the verdict was correct, then what's your beef?
 
Well, he claims the coverage was balanced, but he's writing the article because he believes the verdict was fair, so his opinion is hardly unbiased.

Why quote him as a source if your going to say you don't believe him then?

Most of the programs he's talking about are online, so you can see them for yourself. So are most of the Italian newspapers which often quote the defence arguments as well as statements from family and defence lawyers. Moreover, Italian publications such as Oggi and Panorama have printed many an article defending Amanda and Raffaele and journalist Mio Ponte has been very outspoken in their favour. I see no foul here. Perhaps you can demonstrate it?
 
You get way ahead of yourself by always starting with the presumption that Amanda committed the murder. What are you doing here, anyway? If you so strongly believe the verdict was correct, then what's your beef?

I don't need to presume. A court found her guilty. My beef is the lies and drivel coming out from the propaganda campaign and those who are making Meredith Kercher and her family victims all over again. Is that okay with you?
 
Who does Ghirga work for?

Pisa got it wrong. It will be corrected.

Ghirga works for Amanda in Italy. Ghirga doesn't work for Chris Mellas or David Marriott. He is an Officer of the Court, not a PR mouthpiece.

By corrected we know exactly what you mean. *rolls eyes*


Ghirga is trying to protect Amanda's criminal/legal interests. What are Amanda's "supporters" doing? Shouldn't you all be out there telling Mellas to shut up and let Ghirga and della Vedova get on with it? It looks for all the world that her family in happy to spike her chances for....what, exactly? Why aren't her friends trying to stop the idiot?
 
Why quote him as a source if your going to say you don't believe him then?

Most of the programs he's talking about are online, so you can see them for yourself. So are most of the Italian newspapers which often quote the defence arguments as well as statements from family and defence lawyers. Moreover, Italian publications such as Oggi and Panorama have printed many an article defending Amanda and Raffaele and journalist Mio Ponte has been very outspoken in their favour. I see no foul here. Perhaps you can demonstrate it?

I do believe him when he says most Italians believe the verdict was correct because of the widepsread coverage by the press. The very fact that he says it, though, reflects that most of the coverage favored the prosecution.

Some Italian papers may have defended Amanda and Raffaele and printed the arguments by the defense, but have any opined about the possibility that Amanda and Raffaele were interrogated for no reason, or arrested because of forced confessions, or that many non-Italian scientists have cast doubts on the work of the forensics lab?
 
I don't need to presume. A court found her guilty. My beef is the lies and drivel coming out from the propaganda campaign and those who are making Meredith Kercher and her family victims all over again. Is that okay with you?

Well, it's puzzling. What effect do the "lies and drivel" coming out of the propanganda campaign have on anyone?

Who is making Meredith and her family victims again, and how are they doing it? Are you sure ths is something that is really happening, or do you just believe it is happening?
 
Isn't it odd to you that EVERYBODY (or so it has been claimed) in Italy thinks Amanda is guilty but NOT everybody in the rest of the world thinks she is? I guess it could be that the Italians have MORE information than the rest of us, but if so, wouldn't they have shared it by now?

That's very funny, Mary.

You tell us how only the convicted's versions of things were reported in the US. How truth out of Italy has been deleted by AK's friends everywhere they could.
 
I do believe him when he says most Italians believe the verdict was correct because of the widepsread coverage by the press. The very fact that he says it, though, reflects that most of the coverage favored the prosecution.

Some Italian papers may have defended Amanda and Raffaele and printed the arguments by the defense, but have any opined about the possibility that Amanda and Raffaele were interrogated for no reason, or arrested because of forced confessions, or that many non-Italian scientists have cast doubts on the work of the forensics lab?

He is simply stating that Italians have been well informed of the case due to accurate reporting and have not been subjected to the ethnocentric rubbish and misleading reporting that the American public has.

It is however, a leap to assert that because many Italians believe Amanda was guilty the reporting has been biased. It has not. And I for one have learned all the facts of the case and believe her to be guilty. It's not the reporting that's shown her to be guilty, but the facts and the evidence.

Why should the Italian media opine about FOA talking points that are clearly drivel what isn't true?
 
Well, it's puzzling. What effect do the "lies and drivel" coming out of the propanganda campaign have on anyone?

Who is making Meredith and her family victims again, and how are they doing it? Are you sure ths is something that is really happening, or do you just believe it is happening?

For as start, don't you think it has a rather large effect on Meredith's family and friends?

Who is making them victims again? Amanda, Raffaele, Rudy...and people like you dear.
 
A small note on libel/slander/defamation:

First, the term "libel" generally refers to written/published statements, while "slander" refers to spoken statements. Second, in order to successfully pursue a libel/slander claim, the plaintiff would have to demonstrate that not only is the statement false, but that it is also injurious to his/her reputation. The second part is often overlooked.

Here are some examples of how important the second part is: I remember in the early 1990s some newspapers in the UK published a story of how Princess Diana had personally rescued a homeless man from a lake in a London park in the middle of the night. This story was almost certainly fallacious, and the newspapers that printed it almost certainly knew it to be fallacious. However, they could be confident that they wouldn't come up against any libel issues, since even if Princess Diana HAD wanted to sue, she clearly wouldn't have been able to show that the articles were defamatory to her.

And it's not only about "positive" lies/distortions: if a person's reputation has already been damaged by proven allegations in a given area, then this opens the door for further allegations of a similar nature to be published, regardless of their actual veracity. This is why media outlets are comfortable publishing questionably-accurate stories about (for example) convicted child killers - they are secure in the knowledge that the subjects won't be able to claim that these stories damage their reputation, even if they can be proven to be false.

One final point: in the case of libel, the entity that publishes the statements in question can be held jointly and equally liable, regardless of whether the statements are attributable to the byline author or are direct/indirect quotes from another person. This has been tested in various courts. It's why media outlets and websites usually take such extreme care to legally check all content and to explicitly provide balance. In an interesting example of this, a top UK snooker player (apologies for those who don't know what the sport of snooker is - it's like pool but better ;) ) was recently entrapped by a UK Sunday tabloid paper discussing the potential rigging of matches for money. It was a headline story across the UK media - this was before the General Election! Whenever other media outlets like the BBC reported the story, they consistently issued a disclaimer along the lines of "It must be stated that these are only allegations at this point, and there's no suggestion that he (the snooker player) has ever engaged in this sort of behaviour". The reason that the BBC and others were so careful in this regard is exactly because they would have laid themselves open to potential libel action otherwise - even though they were only "re-reporting" allegations that were originally made by another media outlet.

Hmm, I must go on a "concise writing" course............
 
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PS: Regarding my post above concerning publishers' liability: I believe that a general opt-out to this rule has been allowed for online forums and "readers' comments" sections, regardless of the level of moderation. This is because it's been established that publishers cannot be expected to police these sorts of real-time areas with the same amount of rigour, and that the right to allow comment and discussion outweighs the risk of printing libellous statements as a result. However, authors can still of course be pursued for libel, which is why all comments must be traceable. So the JREF staff can sleep soundly at night :D
 
I still see nothing wrong with the family taking advantage of the situation they're in to pay their debts. Amanda is innocent, but even if she were guilty, think how many people would pay (and have paid) to read her story. I think it's an ideal way to pay the settlements and bills that directly resulted from her arrest and conviction.

Well, if we're lucky that will have to wait till Amanda is released from jail (26 years from now). That is when Amanda and her family can take 'advantage' of the situation again.

In the meantime the Knox family will have to find other ways to raise cash. Ways that don't involve Amanda personally.
 
Well, if we're lucky that will have to wait till Amanda is released from jail (26 years from now). That is when Amanda and her family can take 'advantage' of the situation again.

In the meantime the Knox family will have to find other ways to raise cash. Ways that don't involve Amanda personally.

Maybe Edda Mellas could do a racy calendar. On second thoughts......
 
PS to everyone: Go easy on the personal attacks from ALL fronts, PLEASE! Can we stick to debating opinions and facts, rather than engaging in back-and-forth name-calling.

I hope I don't sound too high-handed or pompous in saying that. I truly don't intend to give that impression. It's just that I enjoy the to-and-fro of good debate, and I hope that the moderators don't finally lose patience and close down this otherwise excellent resource. Please let's ALL take insults, jibes and character assassinations out of the equation - unless they are clearly meant as well-intentioned jokes and recognised by both the targets and by third parties as such.
 
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I thought under the Italian system, the defendant is considered innocent until the result of the final appeal. Besides, it's not Amanda who would be getting paid, it's her family. They should be entitled to generate income.

Yes, why not exhibit her to the highest bidder. I'm sure if it was my daughter I'd be jobbing her around looking for cash.
 
PS to everyone: Go easy on the personal attacks from ALL fronts, PLEASE! Can we stick to debating opinions and facts, rather than engaging in back-and-forth name-calling.

I hope I don't sound too high-handed or pompous in saying that. I truly don't intend to give that impression. It's just that I enjoy the to-and-fro of good debate, and I hope that the moderators don't finally lose patience and close down this otherwise excellent resource. Please let's ALL take insults, jibes and character assassinations out of the equation - unless they are clearly meant as well-intentioned jokes and recognised by both the targets and by third parties as such.

I second this sentiment completely.
 
PS to everyone: Go easy on the personal attacks from ALL fronts, PLEASE! Can we stick to debating opinions and facts, rather than engaging in back-and-forth name-calling.

I hope I don't sound too high-handed or pompous in saying that. I truly don't intend to give that impression. It's just that I enjoy the to-and-fro of good debate, and I hope that the moderators don't finally lose patience and close down this otherwise excellent resource. Please let's ALL take insults, jibes and character assassinations out of the equation - unless they are clearly meant as well-intentioned jokes and recognised by both the targets and by third parties as such.

You sound like an arse. How dare you after you made that remark about Edda. Please delete it.
 
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