Evidence for why we know the New Testament writers told the truth.

[DOC]

DOC, just a reminder about the thread title. Unless you believe that Dr. King, President Obama and Stephen Hawking were around 1900 years ago, they are off topic.

It's not off topic to prove you really believe what you are saying?

 

[RoboTimbo]

Give a specific post that I made and then explain specifically why you think it has a fallacy, and then I will respond to your specific explanation.

As others have noted, you've converted the other one to a Red Herring Fallacy. Here's another one: (I have dozens of these.)

And I guess the writer's also tailored the words of Christ. So these liars and deceivers (as you imply) were able to create the most moral and sublime teachings (at least according to Thomas Jefferson) the world has ever known.

DOC, do you agree or disagree that this is an example of the Fallacy of Argument from Authority?

Why did you ask me to explain if you weren't going to discuss it?

 

[carlitos]

It's not off topic to prove you really believe what you are saying?

No?

 

[DOC]

Deep down, I don't believe there was a jesus.

Then who created the 900 verses Thomas Jefferson cut out of the bible and said were the most moral and sublime teaching ever preached to humanity -- liars and charlatans?

 

[joobz]

Are you saying that because you are Jewish (like Christ was), and the Jews spent 400 years in slavery in Egypt and Babylon?

I'm not jewish. Why do you think I am?

ETA:
1.) This is the second time you stated your belief that I am jewish. If I was, does this diminish your opinion of my posts?
2.) Why do you think referencing prominent black leaders is relevant in a discussion of Jesus condoning the beating of slaves?

 

[carlitos]

Then who created the 900 verses Thomas Jefferson cut out of the bible and said were the most moral and sublime teaching ever preached to humanity -- liars and charlatans?

I'll take "false dichotomy" for $200, Alex.

Can someone PM me a bingo card?

ETA - with a side of argument from authority.

 

[Paulhoff]

Are you saying that because you are Jewish (like Christ was), and the Jews spent 400 years in slavery in Egypt and Babylon?

You do know that the Jewish People did not build the Great Pyramids.

Paul

 

[joobz]

Then who created the 900 verses Thomas Jefferson cut out of the bible and said were the most moral and sublime teaching ever preached to humanity -- liars and charlatans?

Story tellers.

 

[Lothian]

Then who created the 900 verses Thomas Jefferson cut out of the bible and said were the most moral and sublime teaching ever preached to humanity -- liars and charlatans?

A whole load of people in a massive game of Chinese whispers that ended so badly that a committee was needed to decide which bits would sell best. These are the same people who also created the 7000+ verses Jefferson thought was bollocks.

Why is this relevant? How is Thomas Jefferson's belief evidence?

 

[Belz...]

Are you saying that because you are Jewish (like Christ was), and the Jews spent 400 years in slavery in Egypt and Babylon?

That's... odd.

Then who created the 900 verses Thomas Jefferson cut out of the bible and said were the most moral and sublime teaching ever preached to humanity -- liars and charlatans?

I'll buy that false dichotomy for a dollar.

You do know that people can be simply wrong, right ?

 

[Lothian]

I have to believe that deep down you don't really believe Jesus condoned slavery. Because if you really did you would have no problem saying Rev.Martin Luther King, the Rev. Jesse Jackson and Barack Obama are wrong to embrace something that condoned slavery.

I think Rev. Martin Luther King, the Rev. Jesse Jackson and Barack Obama are wrong to embrace Christianity because there is no evidence that the NT writers told the truth.

That Jesus condoned slavery is a fact. Christianity is a take it or leave it religion, which splits every time society leads it in a different direction, which has given us the 1,000s of different Christan cults we see today. 200 years ago Rev. Martin Luther King, the Rev. Jesse Jackson and Barack Obama would have been slaves who would have been dragged to a Christan Church every Sunday to be told that God wanted them to be good slaves, obedient to their white masters.

History is littered with church leaders forced by public opinion to suddenly have a divine revelation. Of course the Churches of Rev Martin Luther King, Rev. Jesse Jackson & Barack Obama do not condone slavery, neither does the 'current' Jesus. But, stop pretending that Jesus's past is not violent and racist.

Jesus's opinion of what is right and wrong has over the generations been transformed. The morals taught in the original fable are nothing like what we perceive as righteous today.

 

[carlitos]

You do know that the Jewish People did not build the Great Pyramids.

The first Jews in Egypt were at the Elephantine garrison, from around 650 BC.
The great pyramid was built around 2500BC.

According to Brian Dunning at least (podcast link), some of the Elephantine papyri indicate that some Jews owned Egyptian slaves. Wow.

 

[zooterkin]

I'm not jewish. Why do you think I am?

But, your username sounds like 'jew', so you must be one, surely?

 

[kmortis]

History is littered with church leaders forced by public opinion to suddenly have a divine revelation. Of course the Churches of Rev Martin Luther King, Rev. Jesse Jackson & Barack Obama do not condone slavery, neither does the 'current' Jesus. But, stop pretending that Jesus's past is not violent and racist.

And his "father" was even worse. Let's face it, there's been a general trend to making the Judaeo-Christian divinty more and more gentle as time goes on. Papa YHVH smote fifteen villages before his morning coffee back in the day; Jesus of the NT flipped off the money lenders and the modern day Jesus is the guy that everyone is "just alright" with.

Of course, none of this has to do with if the NT authors told the truth. But then again, nothing else in this thread has lent credence to that idea, so why start now?

 

[kmortis]

But, your username sounds like 'jew', so you must be one, surely?

WAIT! He's a Jewish bee.

Jew-bzzzzzzzz

 

[joobz]

WAIT! He's a Jewish bee.

Jew-bzzzzzzzz

I was once asked if my handle was a compound word standing for "jewish boobs"

 

[kmortis]

I was once asked if my handle was a compound word standing for "jewish boobs"

Are those the circumcised ones?

 

[Gandalfs Beard]

Been away for months. I can't believe anyone still wastes time with Doc . How long is this thread again? Over 300 pages and Doc still can't come up with any evidence that the NT is THE Truth.

Doc, give it up. Religion is about having FAITH in something you can't prove.

Likewise, Atheists, give it up. Sure you can prove that much of the NT is undeniably false. But you can never prove a Negative, namely that God (or Gods or some form of Universal Sentience) doesn't exist.

Agnosticism is the only intellectually credible position to take on the subject.

But by all means, if you simply enjoy knocking down Doc's ridiculous attempts to prove the unprovable, have at it.

I'll stop by again in a few months to see how it goes.

GB

 

[paximperium]

Agnosticism is the only intellectually credible position to take on the subject.

In what way is agnosticsm or atheism mutually exclusive?

 

[Gandalfs Beard]

Agnosticism is not exclusive to Atheism or Theism. It simply takes the position that neither is provable.

GB