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"Black face" skit on Australian variety show

I'm torn between enjoying the Aussie chauvinism (of certain posters) and the over-reaction in the media (O'Reilly? Really?).

A dumb comedy sketch by people who should've thought it through a little better. Truly. As someone mentioned, it ain't so much the racism but the fact that it's not funny that offends me. It doesn't strike me as blatantly aggressively nastily racist - just absent minded matter-of-fact inconsiderate racist.

So - who's up for the only good Harry Connick joke, ever?



What's the difference between Harry Connick's band and a moose?

On a moose the horns are in front and the ***hole is in the rear.
 
Compared to Kyle's last "performance" where he asked a 14 year old about her sexual experiences and when she admitted she had been raped asked her if that was her only sexual experience, saying that Magda would have lost more weight in a concentration camp is really not that shock worthy.

I take your point but deciding which was Kyle's worst performance is like deciding whether Genghis Khan or Vlad the Imapler would make a worse housemate. The certainty that he is bound to say something worse sooner rather than later also doesn't help.

As for the other comedians, there was a lot of outrage in certain circles but unfortunately there are a lot of motorist who think it is perfectly acceptable to make comments about running over cyclists.

I think they got carried away and didn't think about whether they were crossing the line or not.
 
As an American living in Australia I've encountered a lot of things I would consider racially insensitive, and some that I find downright offensive.
For example, the N-word isn't really as shockingly taboo as it is back home. My husband's brother-in-law, when I told him about the murder rate back in Oakland, where I used to live, asked if it was mostly a "[n-word] problem." It was like someone had knocked the wind out of me. I can't even say that word unless I'm being ironic, quoting, or reciting rap lyrics and even then it makes me very uncomfortable to say it.
Also, I see these golliwog dolls in quaint gift shops and toy stores and I just have to shake my head and cringe. There is no way you'd see that in America, except maybe at a crafts faire at a white racist church in the South, and even then they'd be made by a woman in her 80's who didn't know better.
I grew up in California, where political correctness arose out of an environment of social activism in the 60's. My dad, who is white, used to volunteer for the Black Panthers and personally knew Huey P. Newton. He wasn't perfect, though. He used to read to me from a copy of "Little Black Sambo" that he had as a child growing up in the South. Still, it's from that upbringing that I was raised to be aware of racism and aware of societal context, especially that things haven't always been the way they are.

I think Harry Connick Jr.'s reaction was perfectly reasonable. Considering the historical context of racism in the U.S. (slavery, black suffrage, Jim Crow, race riots, KKK, MLK, etc.) we have a much lower threshold for stereotypes.

As for the comparison to "White Chicks" and other examples of African America performers playing white? Well, let's just say I'm not as quick to jump on the bandwagon of calling that racist. White people didn't get bought and sold for four hundred years, then deliberately insulted and denigrated on every occasion, and have the only white faces seen in any popular media portrayed as grotesque caricatures. I think, frankly a little joke at our expense isn't so bad, considering how easy we've had it.

As for the comparison to Robert Downey Jr. in "Tropic Thunder," did anyone miss the irony that his character was an Australian who didn't seem to understand how racist it was that he was playing a black man? Or that the actual African American character in the movie is himself playing up to a stereotype in order to conceal his homosexuality while simultaneously calling out Robert Downey Jr.'s character for being a racist stereotype and taking away a role from an actual African American actor? There were layers upon layers of satire going on in that film, not just poking fun at method acting.
It is way different from a bunch of dentists or whatever putting on afro wigs and singing a Jackson 5 song.
The sketch was just bad taste. It's stupid, not clever and was rightfully gonged and put in its place. The intent wasn't necessarily racist, at least not by Australian standards, but it is something that I, as an American, would never want to be associated with and find absolutely unacceptable.
 
Tell me that racism is not about the acceptance of other people's culture? Australia's culture is inclusive of jokes that may be offensive to people who's sensitivities are turned up to the highest volume, like Harry Connick's. What he needs to realise, is that what is racist to his stupid head, may not be racist to the majority of Australians, and he needs to respect that if he's to maintain any form of dignity in the storm he's brewing in a teacup.

...

Please, someone please respond to this: agree or disagree, I don't care. I will passionately defend this post.

Alex.

Al. You are a hundred percent correct in everything but this: you just don't realize what black face means in the United States. It's been unacceptable in all media since about 1959. Jaws drop whenever there is even a hint of it in a contemporary show/movie/song/whatever. It's as powerful a symbol as, say, a white robe or a burning cross.

As I was watching this on YouTube, I kept thinking to myself "Oh man, if they showed up in America looking like that...! Oh my Lord, if this was in the United States...!".

It would make news for weeks and weeks if anyone on TV dared do that (well, it wouldn't be approved in a million years in the first place) and would spark enough controversy to be recalled in the press for years. Connick said exactly what I was thinking.

He didn't make a scene. He said it was offensive, explained it is considered very racist in America and said he didn't know it would be on and felt he had to protest. And the host graciously apologized. And that was that.

He actually didn't at all make a big deal of it. His reaction was tame.
 
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But then there's another problem, EMM.

This was not the US. He's in Australia, on an Australian TV show. To insinuate, which he undeniably did, that America is too proper, too politically correct, to let something like this go to air, made the segment's name an allonym: Red Faces.

And secondly, there is no place for a statement like that anyway. He did make a scene and was furthermore made a scene out of something that was not a scene.

Alex.
 
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He said nothing of the kind. He pointed out that in America, this wouldn't be on air without the show being instantly cancelled.

This is completely true. He wasn't "insinuating" anything.

If this had been a show in America, I assure you that every single judge would either be stunned silent or walk off the stage in a huff and immediately issue statements through their publicists distancing themselves from the "act", viewers at home would be stunned silent and the audience would either boo, hiss or walk out. The show would cut to commercials, complaints would pour in, ads would be pulled and the President would be asked for an opinion the next morning.
 
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But then there's another problem, EMM.

This was not the US. He's in Australia, on an Australian TV show. To insinuate, which he undeniably did, that America is too proper, too politically correct, to let something like this go to air, made the segment's name an allonym: Red Faces.

And secondly, there is no place for a statement like that anyway. He did make a scene and was furthermore made a scene out of something that was not a scene.

Alex.

Let's review what was actually said, again:
I just wanted to say on behalf of my country, I know it was done humorously, but we’ve spent so much time trying to not make black people look like buffoons, that when we see something like that, we take it really to heart. ... and if I knew that was going to be part of the show, I probably—I definitely wouldn’t have done it.
I don't see any such insinuation. What he said was factually correct. It's that simple. He clearly understood that they may not have intended it that way, but plainly, it was not acceptable to him.

There was not a hint of this holier-than-thou attitude you inferred. It was not an indictment of Australian culture, as you suggest, but an explanation of the culture clash of which, evidently, the performers were not aware.
 
Let's review what was actually said, again:
I don't see any such insinuation. What he said was factually correct. It's that simple. He clearly understood that they may not have intended it that way, but plainly, it was not acceptable to him.

There was not a hint of this holier-than-thou attitude you inferred. It was not an indictment of Australian culture, as you suggest, but an explanation of the culture clash of which, evidently, the performers were not aware.

What she said.

Plus, he was gracious enough to say that he loves Aussieland and feels very at home there and all the other stuff he said. He was clearly saying "Hey, I like you all and know you didn't mean to be offensive BUT-".
 
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If this had been a show in America, I assure you that every single judge would either be stunned silent or walk off the stage in a huff and immediately issue statements through their publicists distancing themselves from the "act", viewers at home would be stunned silent and the audience would either boo, hiss or walk out. The show would cut to commercials, complaints would pour in, ads would be pulled and the President would be asked for an opinion the next morning.

Right. In America everyone knows or should know of the implications of black face skits in American history and would be aware that it is a taboo even if they have never seen one. The problem is that in Australia very few people in the audience would have seen a black face skit or known of the taboo around those skits. Assuming that they ought to know of the history of the skits in America and the taboo that grew up around them and where therefore deliberately violating those taboos is wrong.

Funnily enough, the Black to the Future sketch from Family Guy was repeated on another channel last night. In that the supposed black cousin of the white father is shown portraying a stereotypical black 'funk' style character. The animation of the 'cousin' is simply the animation of the father but with brown skin and an afro. I doubt many ordinary Australians would be able to explain why that sketch was acceptable but the Michael Jackson was not.
 
Yes I am saddened and ashamed that Aussie TV is capable of producing such shockingly stupid and offensive "entertainment" in 2009. I hope that the producers of this show are never let lose anywhere near a control room or studio ever again.

Having said that, we are talking here about Channel Nein (not a typo). Look up the name Sam Newman or AFL Footy Show to see more examples of this unfortunately all too common type of pig-headed boorishness.

There is an undercurrent of racism here in Australia which I abhor, but I am not going to leave anytime soon, so I just do my best to point it out and denounce it when I see it.

The cartoon reference to Kamahl was the icing on the fruitcake.

Seriously, after all the problems Amanda Duthie had at the ABC after The Chaser's ill considered "Dieing Kids" sketch, I hope the clowns responsible for Hey Hey's re-animation are demoted to carpark toilet attendants at the Frankston Bowl-a-rama.

Just too sad.
 
Kamahl is not too happy about it either.

http://www.news.com.au/entertainment/story/0,28383,26185061-5013560,00.html

FORMER Hey, Hey It's Saturday regular Kamahl has threatened legal action after he was literally drawn into the Red Faces skit which offended visiting singer Harry Connick Jr and sparked a world racism debate.
Kamahl told The Daily Telegraph he had endured years of racist remarks at his expense on the show but had enough after again being the butt of a joke during the now condemned Jackson Jive sketch.
 
Elitist much? :D

Last night after I first saw this thing on the net I suggested that the producers should be made to spend the rest of their careers working at SBS. After thinking about it, I decided that that was a bit too harsh, so I opted for toilet attendant instead.
 
Excellent thread, lk. I hope you're as impressed with the overall quality of the responses as I am. I'm almost tempted to post my Adam Lindsay Gordon quote again.
 
Question not, but live and labour
Till yon goal be won;
Helping every feeble neighbour,
Seeking help from none.


Life is mainly Froth and Bubble
Two things stand like stone-
Kindness in another's trouble.
Courage in your own.


- Adam Lindsay Gordon​
 
Let's review what was actually said, again:
I don't see any such insinuation. What he said was factually correct. It's that simple. He clearly understood that they may not have intended it that way, but plainly, it was not acceptable to him.

There was not a hint of this holier-than-thou attitude you inferred. It was not an indictment of Australian culture, as you suggest, but an explanation of the culture clash of which, evidently, the performers were not aware.

That is called being selective. He also said: "if they came onto the show looking like that in America it would be Hey Hey There's No More Show". Not only that but the quote you pointed out is actually enough to deduce that insinuation anyway. It first implies the skit was morally wrong and that "where [he] comes from" it would never go to air (backed up by your own words and what Harry expressed in the earlier quote I mentioned) and therefore America is more morally correct.

I purposely convoluted all of that, it is otherwise a very simple premise.

Apologies for any spelling or grammar errors as I'm using my brother's iPod Touch.

Alex.
 
It's funny because I was going to make this thread in Forum Community as soon as I could but I ran a search for it just in case. Very glad others are as interested as I am in this all.

Ditto the post script from my previous post.

Alex.
 

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