Merged Derren Brown - predicting lottery numbers

[shuttlt]

Also, if the lottery is subject to the 90 second delay then surely so would Derren's show be.

But what he was showing on screen matched almost exactly what was coming from the BBC.

That depends. He'd presumably have to have cooperation from the BBC and Camelot to pull it off, in which case the delay could have been stretched further. Also, the delay seems to be a convenience rather than a technical necessity.

 

[Marduk]

Key word in that first sentence, was 'usually'. With the lottery, it doesn't apply.. Might be mistaken, but I believe they have to, legally, show the draw without any form of delay.

ETA: And the National Lottery program started at the same time as the Derren brown program started. They had to do the thunderball draw, and show the dream number draw first. Derren started showing the footage just after the dream number draw finished.

they legally have to have subtitles for all BBC programs or they are discriminating against deaf viewers, they dont need that for ceefax this is what it means by "usually",
the time delay allows stenographers to add the titles,
the censorship rule has been in effect since the Russian school massacre thing and is purely so that they can tell viewers some scenes may offend so that the viewer has time to turn off or leave the room. If they didn't do that and someone was traumatised they could be sued.
Al derren would need would be someone at the BBC phoning through the balls as they came out and hed have up to 90 seconds to improvise. the lottery as you may know is filmed in front of a live studio audience

this isn't real psychic powers, its just technology

 

[shuttlt]

I hadn't considered a man with a phone in the lottery audience.

 

[Ashles]

The only thing I have against that as a solution is that it's inelegant. He certainly could have done it that way, I'll just be disappointed is all.

Why is that less 'elegant' than any other method?

 

[Humphreys]

Being in the US, I didn't get to watch this show.

Can anyone give a brief rundown of how this played out?

Sounds more interesting than I first thought it would be, anyway, but only because he didn't really announce them before the draw.

 

[Marduk]

I hadn't considered a man with a phone in the lottery audience.

I think its ever so slightly more likely than that the BBC and Camelot are conspiring to increase a channel 4 programs ratings

 

[Kiosk]

Thats pretty much the only way he could've done it... I don't see why it will take him a whole hour to explain that though.

Well, I think it's fair to say that whatever explanation he gives will be completely and utterly made up.

Dawned on me recently, I think I've reached the sweet spot when it comes to my understanding of magic. I'm a total dilettante, but I know enough to make educated guesses about what sort of trick I'm watching (i.e. which other tricks might use the same technique), and sometimes spot one a mile off - but not enough to end up thinking "ah yes, that's an ingenious presentation of One Up The Hooter" or whatever, after every single trick. This allows a nice mixture of technical appreciation and genuine mystification.

Somewhat refined from when I was 6, and got thrown out of a school Christmas show for shouting "it's on a string!" at the grimacing, top-hatted turn.

 

[Marduk]

Being in the US, I didn't get to watch this show.

Can anyone give a brief rundown of how this played out?
.

it was crap, a real demonstration of his woo powers would be the announcement in tomorrows headlines that he had won the lottery,

 

[Ashles]

That depends. He'd presumably have to have cooperation from the BBC and Camelot to pull it off, in which case the delay could have been stretched further. Also, the delay seems to be a convenience rather than a technical necessity.

It seems extremely unlikely that the BBC will be involved. They would not deliberately delay the lottery coverage just so Channel Four could show a trick.

They take ther lottery coverage pretty seriously and wouldnt jeapordise losing it over a stunt.

I think the delay explanation is not the answer.

There is no reason for Derren to simply not have had the numbers facing the screen from the start, so it must be that he somehow got the numbers on the balls after they were announced.

 

[Ashles]

it was crap, a real demonstration of his woo powers would be the announcement in tomorrows headlines that he had won the lottery,

He never claims any 'woo powers'. It's a trick and Derren never pretends to be anything other than an illusionist.

 

[shuttlt]

I think its ever so slightly more likely than that the BBC and Camelot are conspiring to increase a channel 4 programs ratings

True, I need to think more and post less. What appeared to me to be a plausible thought was that they might view this as publicity for the lottery, or have done some deal or other. However, I accept that isn't very likely.

 

[Nigelwyn]

I've worked quite a bit in live TV situations and in the UK at least there is no 90 second delay. All production galleries and trucks will have a monitor showing an off air picture and I have never seen a delay of more than about 2 seconds.
Phone in radio programmes may have a 7 second delay built in so that offensive calls can be edited out.

 

[shuttlt]

It seems extremely unlikely that the BBC will be involved. They would not deliberately delay the lottery coverage just so Channel Four could show a trick.

They take ther lottery coverage pretty seriously and wouldnt jeapordise losing it over a stunt.

I think the delay explanation is not the answer.

There is no reason for Derren to simply not have had the numbers facing the screen from the start, so it must be that he somehow got the numbers on the balls after they were announced.

But if there's no trick with the delay, why was the show so rushed? One or other, or both, must have been misdirection.

 

[dbalsdon]

the lottery as you may know is filmed in front of a live studio audience

From The Daily Mail article about it:

The BBC also insists that its midweek draw is shown without a time delay. The only sleight of hand involved is the use of recorded applause.

 

[Humphreys]

it was crap, a real demonstration of his woo powers would be the announcement in tomorrows headlines that he had won the lottery,

I meant like:

1) Derren announces that he will NOT be allowed to announce the numbers before the draw, for legal reasons
2) He has a rack set up with the chosen balls facing away from the audience
3) After the draw, he turns the rack around and all 6 correct numbers are on there?

Is that about it?

 

[Ashles]

I oticed that when Derren turned the tray round to reveal the numbers, they all seemed tilted quite high up on the balls which also makes me wonder if a projection device/laser was above, out of shot (and further away) aimed on the balls.

 

[Pup]

I'm also in the US so didn't get to see it. Am I understanding correctly that he recorded his prediction before the drawing by using numbered balls which were in plain view but without the numbers showing, and revealed them after the lottery was announced?

From my post earlier in this thread:

I hope this won't be the standard magician's way of "predicting" things, by writing down the prediction in such a way it couldn't possibly be tampered with (ahem), and then revealing it after the event occurs--and after there's been time to tamper with the written prediction.

 

[Ashles]

But if there's no trick with the delay, why was the show so rushed?

I don't really understand - this show was only going to be Derren revealing the trick, and his timings were dependent on the BBCs show so it would have had to be slightly reactive and off the cuff.

 

[shuttlt]

Being in the US, I didn't get to watch this show.

Can anyone give a brief rundown of how this played out?

Sounds more interesting than I first thought it would be, anyway, but only because he didn't really announce them before the draw.

Empty studio. 6 white ping pong balls on a clear stand. TV screen to one side. Derren explains he can only show a brief bit of BBC footage "for legal reasons". He also claims that he can't show his prediction in advance of the draw "for legal reasons". He turns the TV on and the draw begins. He stands by the TV (the balls on the stand are visible the whole time) holding a pen and a large white card as the draw is announced. After the draw he writes the numbers down and turns the TV off. He then walks behind the stand and turns it around revealing the correct numbers on the reverse of the balls. At no time does he appear to handle the balls. The whole broadcast appears very rushed.

 

[Humphreys]

I oticed that when Derren turned the tray round to reveal the numbers, they all seemed tilted quite high up on the balls which also makes me wonder if a projection device/laser was above, out of shot (and further away) aimed on the balls.

While this may well be the explanation, it doesn't sound very "Derren" like to me.

If this is how he did it, I'd be even more surprised if he admits to this "explanation" on friday.