Dawkins, atheism & intelligent design

bwinwright said:
Crusader Richard Dawkins is Anti-Christ, Anti-God, & Anti-Organized Religion

Richard Dawkins, a professor at Oxford University and perhaps the world’s most famous atheist, is working diligently to spread his message that faith in God is one of the world’s great evils. He often refers to the attacks on September 11th, 2001 as his justification, claiming that such evil acts are the direct result of a twisted faith in a non-existent fantasy called God.

When Dawkins was a teenager he believed in the concept of Intelligent Design due to the multitude of highly organized and complex examples of order, purpose, and design he observed all around him in nature. However, after observing so many injustices in organized religion, Dawkins decided to separate himself from these evil institutions and become an atheist.

Of course, Dawkins also realized that being an atheist and scientist in an academic environment like Oxford University simply go hand in hand. It is simply not cool to be a scientist and believe in God too. After all, Charles Darwin was an atheist, wasn’t he?
Dawkins claims that his enhanced understanding of biology naturally led him to atheism.

Dawkins’ most recent book, The God Delusion, has already sold more than 1.5 million copies making him a millionaire many times over. He has tapped into an ever growing contempt for organized religion, helping millions of people justify their own conversion to atheism. Dawkins is earning big money crusading for atheism.

Much like Gay Pride, Dawkins is asking people to be proud of their atheism, to stand up and speak out, announce their atheism to the world. Dawkins is successfully convincing millions of people to reject the tyranny of organized religion and think for themselves.

Dawkins rejects the idea of Intelligent Design because nobody can tell him where the Intelligent Designer originated. He prefers to say that Natural Selection is sufficient to explain all of the orderliness and complexities of nature. Dawkins believes that no intelligence was necessary in the process of establishing the complex order we observe in nature.

Dawkins wants to destroy organized religion so much he carelessly ignores both fact and reason when he claims that highly complex systems and extremely sophisticated examples of orderliness simply evolved through some mindless, non-intelligent process.
He refers to this mindless process as Natural Selection. He fails to realize that Natural Selection “is” Intelligent Design, or he may simply be intentionally ignoring this fact.

For example, when one examines the complexities and sophistication of a Dolphin’s Sonar, one realizes that such a system is far more intricate and involved than anything man can make right now. When all the components and variables are scientifically considered from the perspective of irreducible complexity, the mathematical probability of such a fantastic system evolving through some mindless process is absolutely impossible.

The example of a Dolphin’s Sonar is only one of millions of such examples of super sophisticated and irreducibly complex systems and processes we have observed in nature, all of which would have been impossible without the involvement of intelligence.

Dawkins’ idol is Charles Darwin whose Theory of Evolution has now been disproved by numerous scientists. The field of micro biology, alone, has revealed Darwin’s Theory to be laughably false. Dawkins has been avoiding debates with microbiologists because they know how wrong Darwin’s Theory really is and can prove it too.

Darwin actually believed that a bear that devoted enough time to swimming could actually evolve into a whale. Of course, this idea has been found to be both false and absurd. Modern microbiology thoroughly debunks Darwin’s Theory.

The primary reason Intelligent Design is not allowed to be taught as an alternative to the theory of Evolution is because nobody can scientifically explain the origination of the Intelligent Designer. The law, established in the Kitzmiller v. Dover Area School District trial, says that because we can not explain this Intelligent Designer, scientifically, the theory must be classified as a religion and not allowed to be taught in public schools.

Dawkins says Faith is one of the world’s great evils. Faith has been defined as “the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.” Jesus taught in Matthew 9:29, “According to your Faith be it unto you.”

Jesus also taught in Matthew 21:22, “And all things, whatsoever ye shall ask in prayer, Believing, ye shall receive.”

Jesus also taught in Mark 9:23, “If thou canst believe, all things are possible to him that Believeth.”

Jesus also taught in Mark 11:24, “What things soever ye desire, when ye pray, believe that ye receive them, and ye shall have them.”

Of course, the recent best selling book entitled The Secret was about this mental law of faith or belief as taught by Jesus, otherwise known as The Law of Attraction. This same mental law has been taught by many great philosophers, prophets, and seers throughout history. The bottom line is our experience is a direct reflection of our habitual thoughts and feelings.

Regarding these questions of faith and God, many atheists may choose to believe Dawkins, but I am betting on Jesus and Intelligent Design, respectively.
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Uh huh.... yeah..... and also, this
 
bwinwright said:
Darwin actually believed that a bear that devoted enough time to swimming could actually evolve into a whale. Of course, this idea has been found to be both false and absurd. Modern microbiology thoroughly debunks Darwin’s Theory.
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May I advise that if you plan to attack the merits of a concept, you at least educate yourself first in what the concept actually is?
 
Aint anti-God a bit like being anti-goblin?

Cause I know I am firmly anti-ogre and anti-troll. But anti-goblin is a little too far.

Hobgoblins on the other hand... Get me a rake.
 
bwinwright said:
Jesus also taught in Matthew 21:22, “And all things, whatsoever ye shall ask in prayer, Believing, ye shall receive.”

Jesus also taught in Mark 9:23, “If thou canst believe, all things are possible to him that Believeth.”

Jesus also taught in Mark 11:24, “What things soever ye desire, when ye pray, believe that ye receive them, and ye shall have them.”
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Wow, wouldn't it be wonderful if any of that were really true? If wishful thinking could really elbow its way into the real world, and drop a pile of money on the doorstep or cure Aunt Millie's cancer?

But of course, it isn't. Believing there is a pile of money on the doorstep won't make it appear, and Aunt Millie is better off seeking medical treatment than praying for remission.

bwinwright said:
Regarding these questions of faith and God, many atheists may choose to believe Dawkins, but I am betting on Jesus and Intelligent Design, respectively.
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Why don't you start small -- believe REALLY REALLY HARD that everyone on this forum will start to take this philosophy of wishful thinking seriously, today, this very minute, right now.

Come back in a few days, and see how much difference your fervent belief made in the real world.

If your honest answer is "none at all," maybe you should re-assess how much sense it makes to live your life, this life, perhaps the only life you'll ever live, as though Matthew 21:22, Mark 9:23, and Mark 11:24 were more than empty promises.

Ask yourself: Is it really a good idea to bet on something when you can demonstrate to yourself, this very week, that some of what you've been told by the people you trust is simply not true?
 
bwinwright said:
Of course, the recent best selling book entitled The Secret was about this mental law of faith or belief as taught by Jesus, otherwise known as The Law of Attraction. This same mental law has been taught by many great philosophers, prophets, and seers throughout history. The bottom line is our experience is a direct reflection of our habitual thoughts and feelings.
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Every five seconds a child dies of starvation, how terrible their habitual thoughts and feelings must have been to attract that.

Or the 12 year old girl that got abducted, raped, chopped into pieces and discarded in a trash bag.. wow, what did she think to Attract that?
 
I must commend the OP for being accurate in the title, and first sentence.

After that, it gets a bit fuzzy.

Bwinwright,

I have some advice, if you are at all inclined to take it. Several people have pointed out that your discussion of bears and swimming is, in fact, not what Darwin said. It is, as they noted, much closer to what Lamarck had said.

Now, if you want to argue against Darwin, it would be well to understand what his theory actually says. If you want to do that, I recommend books written by biologists. If that's a little bit boring, try books on the history of science that include discussions of Darwin. You could even try Darwin himself. What you must avoid, if you want to have any chance of successfully arguing against Darwin, is basing your arguments on what you have heard from preachers. They just don't know very much about the subject. They have already led you astray on the subject.

I will emphasize I am not saying you ought to believe what you read. If you read Darwin, you don't have to agree with him. However, at least you would know what it is that you disagree with. Surely you wouldn't want to argue against a straw man, would you?
 
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bwinwright said:
:29, “According to your Faith be it unto you.”

Jesus also taught in Matthew 21:22, “And all things, whatsoever ye shall ask in prayer, Believing, ye shall receive.”

Jesus also taught in Mark 9:23, “If thou canst believe, all things are possible to him that Believeth.”

Jesus also taught in Mark 11:24, “What things soever ye desire, when ye pray, believe that ye receive them, and ye shall have them.”
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When I hear biblical quotations, I know the situation is helpless regarding intelligent debate.

You guys can try if you want; I promise not to say "I told you so".
 
bwinwright said:
[Dawkins] fails to realize that Natural Selection “is” Intelligent Design, or he may simply be intentionally ignoring this fact.
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I don't think he's failing to realize anything. There is often an element of intelligence involved in natural selection -- when a predator chooses which member of a herd to pursue, for example, or when members of the herd recognize an approaching predator and flee.

If you are willing to concede natural selection is one of the forces guiding evolution, perhaps there's hope.

bwinwright said:
For example, when one examines the complexities and sophistication of a Dolphin’s Sonar, one realizes that such a system is far more intricate and involved than anything man can make right now.
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This is probably not really true, if you're talking about the sonar itself. If you're talking about the signal processing the dolphin does on the back end, you're probably right that man-made systems can't do it as fast as the dolphin does (at least I don't think they can -- I don't have high-level security clearances, so I may be wrong about that).

bwinwright said:
When all the components and variables are scientifically considered from the perspective of irreducible complexity, the mathematical probability of such a fantastic system evolving through some mindless process is absolutely impossible.
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Clearly not true. Every time a dolphin zygote "evolves" into an adult dolphin, mindless processes make it happen, every step of the way.

bwinwright said:
The example of a Dolphin’s Sonar is only one of millions of such examples of super sophisticated and irreducibly complex systems and processes we have observed in nature, all of which would have been impossible without the involvement of intelligence.
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What is your basis for claiming that dolphin sonar is "irreducibly complex"?

bwinwright said:
The field of micro biology, alone, has revealed Darwin’s Theory to be laughably false.
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How so? My reading of relatively recent books by microbiologists, such as Touchstone of Life by Werner R. Loewenstein, doesn't confirm your claim. The work of microbiologists with whom I'm familiar extends and confirms Darwin's theory.

bwinwright said:
Dawkins has been avoiding debates with microbiologists because they know how wrong Darwin’s Theory really is and can prove it too.
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I'll be happy to debate them, and I don't know 1/10 of what Dawkins knows. Tell them to bring their debate here, unless they're running scared.
 
ferj said:
Dorkins has writ too many books to be taken seriously. He's in it for the moolah. Anyway, man can intelligently design things like cars and nuclear bombs and stuff.
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Don't forget McDonald's and New York City.
 
Bwinwright, I think you just proved Dawkins' thesis with your rant. And you strengthened that proof by quoting from a despicable work that has no divine source at all, the Bible. The less said about that ridiculous and offensive work, the better.
 
bwinwright said:
Jesus also taught in Matthew 21:22, “And all things, whatsoever ye shall ask in prayer, Believing, ye shall receive.”

Jesus also taught in Mark 9:23, “If thou canst believe, all things are possible to him that Believeth.”

Jesus also taught in Mark 11:24, “What things soever ye desire, when ye pray, believe that ye receive them, and ye shall have them.”
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In that case, all of this can be resolved in minutes:

1. Pray that the Theory of Evolution never existed.

2. Pray that God flys through the sky writing "I am the Intelligent Designer" in rainbow colours.

3. Pray for all atheists and members of other religions in the world to realise the error of their ways and acknowledge Jesus Christ as their saviour.

I await the above miracles with baited breath...
 
Foster Zygote said:
The craziest thing is when you scroll down to the bottom you find a link that says "NEXT PAGE".
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I know! I actually clicked on it, though I was a bit frightened. The second page has a couple dozen other links. I did not explore them. Gotta give the guy one thing: He has passion.
 
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