How did things get this bad?

[Kthulhut Fhtagn]

If there's anything that hurricane Katrina taught us, it's that God protects gays. The city was devastated, except for the French Quarter which is the place where all the gays live. Some have proposed putting gays in strategic locations of large cities so those areas will be protected from God's wrath.

 

[Flo]

You may want to seriously reconsider your amorous stance with her. She's a virulent racist, xenophobe, religious bigot, and a foot-soldier in the GOP army. With Gore and Kerry she believed they both were going to lead us to the anti-Christ. She would never have out-right called Barack Obama the anti-Christ if he wasn't the Democratic nominee, black, has an non-Anglican name, and suspected by some loons of being a Muslim. She went on a tirade the other day, again, about a black boy who has a crush on my younger sister. She told her the same thing, mixing races is against our religion. She never was able to cite a single verse that tells people they cannot mix races. But she's basing it on the misinterpretation, and you and I both know that's a misinterpretation, of the story of Noah cursing the fourth son of Ham Canaan. I explained to her that Canaan was the father of the Canaanites and the modern Canaanites would be the Palestinians, not sub-Saharan Africans. But she still holds on to her misinterpretation claiming that Ham was the one cursed and Ham was the father of the black race. Hence, blacks are cursed by God. She's never read the bible, at least not fully, either. She relies on her husband for her interpretation and his views on the bible are twisted enough.

Except maybe for the anti-blacks racism, that describes KK almost to a K ... the worst part is she looks proud of it

I don't find this the least bit unusual. Whatever else about Islamic fundamentalists, they are expected to read the Koran themselves, and to learn large chunks of it off by heart.

Most muslims outside of arabic countries don't understand arabic. They may learn the koran by heart but mostly don't know what they are saying and are left to the interpretation of the local imam (who may himself be a perfect illiterate ...). That includes most Iranians, Turks, Pakistani, Afghani, South-eastern Asian, Sub-saharian Africans, Eastern European muslims, etc.

 

[Safe-Keeper]

Yes, what we call natural disasters are on the rise everywhere, but I do not think they are just natural disasters and I know I'm not the only one. Many think God may be allowing these to increase for a reason. People do cry out to God when they are in crisis so perhaps there is some good that comes from these kinds of hardships, people who are desperate may be more open to seek God!

And you don't find it the least bit dubious morality-wise that He's allegedly doing this? Certainly you'd find it immoral if I set fire to your community so that 60% of the residents lost their homes and two of them were killed, regardless of how many "found God" or became better friends with their neighbors afterward.

Oh so you think we have a Constitution to believe in still, I do not see it so much anymore? I support the ACLJ which is always fighting the ACLU and their lowsy games.

Cough.

The ACLU is committed to upholding the Constitution. If this means it has to continually attack Christians, it means said Christians aren't respecting the Constitution and thus need to be challenged, not that the ACLU is somehow evil.

I also see how many politicians have been voting and they are taking more and more freedoms away from us, and what about our freedom of speech, they are trying really hard to take that away from us and that is unconstitutional.

I don't follow. Please give examples of the US government trying to take away your freedom of speech.

Are there any good men that fear God in government anymore?? Our government is suppose to rest on God's shoulders, now we have too many people in government who do not even respect or know God.

I thought you lived in the States. Sorry. What country are you really talking about, then?

Some have proposed putting gays in strategic locations of large cities so those areas will be protected from God's wrath.

Why stop there? Make the military an all-gay, all-lesbian Fighting Force of Pink and it'll be blessed and overlooked by Him!

 

[Foster Zygote]

Oh so you think we have a Constitution to believe in still, I do not see it so much anymore? I support the ACLJ which is always fighting the ACLU and their lowsy games. I also see how many politicians have been voting and they are taking more and more freedoms away from us, and what about our freedom of speech, they are trying really hard to take that away from us and that is unconstitutional.

Jay Sekulow's integrity, or rather its lack has been gone over a good deal in DOC's "Thomas Jefferson" thread.

I posted this response to DOC in that thread in post #1037:

I mean do your really think the public school teacher in Utah would be able to attend that after hour bible club on public school property if it wasn't for the American Center of Law and Justice.

Yes, I do. In fact, I'll bet that if the teacher and students had contacted the ACLU they would have been willing to represent them as they have a right to meet together just like the French Club, History Club, Dungeons & Dragons Club or heck, even the Atheist Club. This whole "Evil, atheist, Communist, queer loving, Jesus hating, smut peddling, liberals are trying to make it illegal for you to pray and soon the black helicopters will be using listening devices to detect prayers in your own home and the NWO Stormtroopers will be breaking down your doors and hauling you and your children off for re-programming" is wearing a bit thin. As long as the Bible Club meets during off hours and isn't part of the school curricula they have as much right as the Glee Club, the Muslim Club, or the Gay Teens Club etc. to meet. Students and faculty can pray all they want too as long as it doesn't interfere with the curricula and it isn't forced upon students in any "official" capacity. If a student wants to say a quick prayer before a test that's perfectly within his/her rights as a citizen as long as the prayer doesn't disturb other students during their studies. An example of the sort of thing that is illegal would be the superintendent using the PA system prior to the SAT exams to announce "And now all students and faculty bow your heads as I recite a prayer to our lord Jesus Christ".

The reason the after school club is legal is that it does not interfere with the standard curricula, it is not imposed as an official religious activity of a state institution, and those who want nothing to do with it have the freedom to have nothing to do with it. The school is simply providing a space where students with a common interest can meet.

The reason the pre-test PA prayer announcement is illegal is because it involves a state institution imposing a religious practice on everyone regardless of their own desires.

Then there was Slingblade's post #671 in which she presented the following from the U.S. Department of Education:

Although the Constitution forbids public school officials from directing or favoring prayer, students do not "shed their constitutional rights to freedom of speech or expression at the schoolhouse gate," [ 9 ] and the Supreme Court has made clear that "private religious speech, far from being a First Amendment orphan, is as fully protected under the Free Speech Clause as secular private expression." [ 10 ] Moreover, not all religious speech that takes place in the public schools or at school-sponsored events is governmental speech. [ 11 ] For example, "nothing in the Constitution ... prohibits any public school student from voluntarily praying at any time before, during, or after the school day," [ 12 ] and students may pray with fellow students during the school day on the same terms and conditions that they may engage in other conversation or speech.

[ 9 ] Tinker v. Des Moines Indep. Community Sch. Dist., 393 U.S. 503, 506 (1969).

[ 10 ] Capitol Square Review & Advisory Bd. v. Pinette, 515 U.S. 753, 760 (1995).

[ 11 ] Santa Fe, 530 U.S. at 302 (explaining that "not every message" that is "authorized by a government policy and take place on government property at government-sponsored school-related events" is "the government's own").

[ 12 ] Santa Fe, 530 U.S. at 313.

No one is trying to take away your free speech Kathy. The laws that people like you decry as "taking away your rights" are actually there to protect you and everyone else. I suspect that you think it would be a brilliant success for freedom of speech if a high school teacher gave a ten minute sermon on the Ten Commandments at the start of each school day. But let me ask you to consider this: What if the teacher was a Muslim and gave a sermon on the Koran to your children every morning?

I'm asking you why are we even paying these guys that are doing us wrong?

So judges are doing wrong when they uphold the Constitution by affirming the rights of homosexuals against the wishes of the majority of the population? Gee, that's really bad news for African Americans in the South.

Maybe the US would be better off without the government as all I see is more and more men with their own power hungry agenda at work and they are not helping for the most part.

"This steering wheel is loose and it keeps cutting into my thighs. Do we really need it?"

All we need now is a ring leader like Obama who is hiding some very dark things to be in charge.

What dark things?

It really does appear to be a game kind of like Russian roulette. Bad governemnt cannot be any better than no government at all, can it?

Well there's the FATA region of Pakistan, and Somalia. If you want tribal warfare, warlords with private armies, poverty, starvation etc., then having no real government is a good start.

Are there any good men that fear God in government anymore??

There are a great many Christians in government Kathy. Why do you think that this is not the case? Is it because they do not push to turn the U.S. into a Christian theocracy?

Our government is suppose to rest on God's shoulders, now we have too many people in government who do not even respect or know God.

Please show us where in the U.S. Constitution it states that this is a nation founded on any god, or where it says that anyone holding office must be a member of any religious group.

 

[joobz]

What dark things?

*Homer simpson whisper*
I think she means his skin.

 

[angelsaramark]

Checking the Bible

Whatever your view on sin (as defined by the bible); and I really don't care, so don't tell me, it seems we are now in a time where the bible can be checked for accuracy. With divorce rates at historic highs among other sins as defined by the bible our nation is in jeopardy of judgement. So if there is a God, we'll not last much longer as a nation (e.g. Sodom / Gomorrah).

So if we get conquered by some unknown entity and / or cease to exist for other reasons in the next few years, does this prove anything?

 

[Safe-Keeper]

Are there any good men that fear God in government anymore??

Let's see. You need to be Christian to be elected President; atheists can't join the Boy Scouts; civil rights workers had to fight tooth and nail to throw mandatory prayer out of school; the Theory of Evolution has been censored from many public schools in favour of "Intelligent Design" and Christian myths, and atheists are distrusted more than Muslims, dollar bills have Christian slogans on them, and the President was able to use religious jargon to get people to support the war in Iraq...

...but no, Kathy, I don't think America is much of a Christian-controlled nation anymore.

Seriously - stow the persecution complex already. It's bad enough that people push such transparent nonsense if others aren't going to start buying it, too.

 

[Foster Zygote]

I'll let my hubby answer you when he gets a moment.

And as far as the reality of homosexual behavoir, "it does too hurt people!" I know some gay people and I try to reach out to them and let them know God will forgive them and heal them if they choose to ask him into their lives. A spirit filled person knows it's wrong because the Holy Spirit will reveal it to them. I quess until someone is saved they just can't see what sin is. It's sad for me because I'm on the other side now and I do see sin, it's everywere and none of us can save ourselves from the effects of it. Sin is evil because it condemns us. The good news is there is a way out!

So you think that the government should be in the business of forbidding gay marriage because it is a sin? I can point out two huge problems with your argument:

Firstly, the government is not in the business of enforcing religious rules. The government can't enforce Christian prohibitions on homosexuality any more than it can enforce Islamic prohibitions on eating pork.

Secondly, if you are going to justify restricting the rights of homosexuals based on Biblical definitions of sin then it sets a precedent for restricting the rights of others who behave in ways that are declared sinful by Christians. For instance, you could argue that rejecting Christ is a sin just as homosexuality is. Therefore it is every bit as just to restrict the practice of Islam or atheism as it is to restrict the practice of homosexuality.

 

[Hokulele]

So you think that the government should be in the business of forbidding gay marriage because it is a sin? I can point out two huge problems with your argument:

Firstly, the government is not in the business of enforcing religious rules. The government can't enforce Christian prohibitions on homosexuality any more than it can enforce Islamic prohibitions on eating pork.

Secondly, if you are going to justify restricting the rights of homosexuals based on Biblical definitions of sin then it sets a precedent for restricting the rights of others who behave in ways that are declared sinful by Christians. For instance, you could argue that rejecting Christ is a sin just as homosexuality is. Therefore it is every bit as just to restrict the practice of Islam or atheism as it is to restrict the practice of homosexuality.

It can also restrict women from becoming college professors or anything else involving adult education.

 

[CurtC]

And you don't find it the least bit dubious morality-wise that He's allegedly doing this? Certainly you'd find it immoral if I set fire to your community so that 60% of the residents lost their homes and two of them were killed...

Well, if a few of them started believing in you, then it would all be worth it. All hail Safe-Keeper! We're not worthy!

 

[Foster Zygote]

Whatever your view on sin (as defined by the bible); and I really don't care, so don't tell me, it seems we are now in a time where the bible can be checked for accuracy.

The problem is that you can't accurately measure ambiguity.

With divorce rates at historic highs among other sins as defined by the bible our nation is in jeopardy of judgement. So if there is a God, we'll not last much longer as a nation (e.g. Sodom / Gomorrah).

So if the U.S. does collapse, we should blame people like my sister for divorcing her philandering, alcoholic, psychologically abusive husband before he could totally ruin her and her two children's lives? Or my friend for divorcing her philandering, physically abusive, coke-addicted husband before he started beating their son?

Thanks a lot Slingblade. It's all your fault for not staying with that cheating drug addict who punched you and psychologically tortured you.

So if we get conquered by some unknown entity and / or cease to exist for other reasons in the next few years, does this prove anything?

Considering that people have been pretty much constantly predicting the imminent collapse of various cultures throughout history, I'd have to say "no".

 

[Ladewig]

it seems we are now in a time where the bible can be checked for accuracy.

What are you talking about?

 

[tomwaits]

How did things get this RAD???

 

[Foster Zygote]

How did things get this RAD???

[qimg]http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/imagehosting/thum_214124901066089866.jpg[/qimg]

An NWO Kitty beach assault!

 

[Safe-Keeper]

With divorce rates at historic highs among other sins as defined by the bible our nation is in jeopardy of judgment.

If there's a psychopath in the sky preparing for a terrorist act or war on some people on Earth, He is the one with a problem. "Entity x is punishing you, so you're wrong and He is good" is not a good argument.

 

[Elizabeth I]

You may want to seriously reconsider your amorous stance with her. She's a virulent racist, xenophobe, religious bigot, and a foot-soldier in the GOP army.

Nope, KK would fall instantly into (Platonic, agapean only, of course) love and she and your mother would be bosom friends forever and ever. (Excuse me for saying "bosom;" I will now go do penance for using such a suggestive word.)

Secondly, if you are going to justify restricting the rights of homosexuals based on Biblical definitions of sin then it sets a precedent for restricting the rights of others who behave in ways that are declared sinful by Christians. For instance, you could argue that rejecting Christ is a sin just as homosexuality is. Therefore it is every bit as just to restrict the practice of Islam or atheism as it is to restrict the practice of homosexuality.

Um, I think KK is actually arguing for that point of view. She would be thrilled to see every other form of worship (and non-worship) made into criminal offenses.

 

[Kthulhut Fhtagn]

Um, I think KK is actually arguing for that point of view. She would be thrilled to see every other form of worship (and non-worship) made into criminal offenses.

I think what you're trying to say, and correct me if I'm wrong, is that KK is a theocrat.

 

[Kthulhut Fhtagn]

I found a very interesting article on the whole Obama is the anti-Christ deal.

To me, the number of people who think it's true is both surprising and very sad.
What has our world come to when a man is called the Antichrist for having a good message?

I realize that many people tend to have negative opinions of politicians. I can almost understand how a politician that seems genuine could be scary.

People are afraid of things they're not used to, but calling Obama the Antichrist takes it a little too far.

"I feel in my soul that he is the Antichrist," Howser, a member of apostropher.com, posted in a forum. "He's too good to believe."

People in these forums seem to be forgetting an important fact. Obama doesn't fit the Bible's description of the Antichrist.

The Bible states the Antichrist will not desire women, which leaves most people to think the Antichrist will be homosexual or celibate.

Obama, who has a wife and two young daughters, clearly desires women. Therefore, he doesn't fit in those categories.

Full Article

Emphasis mine. Can anyone give me relevent passages on this?

ETA: Found something.

Daniel 11:37 -- “He will show no regard for the gods of his fathers or for the desire of women, nor will he show regard for any other god; for he will magnify himself above them all."

Thoughts?

 

[wolfgirl]

And as far as the reality of homosexual behavoir, "it does too hurt people!"

How, Kathy. Tell us how homosexuality hurts you. Or me. Or your family. Or anyone else. It has absolutely no effect on you or your life. Didn't you mom teach you to mind your own damn business?

 

[arthwollipot]

The Bible states the Antichrist will not desire women, which leaves most people to think the Antichrist will be homosexual or celibate.

But wasn't there this whole Whore of Babylon thing? Or were they just friends?