Psychic Samurai applies for MDC...apparently...

[Jeff Wagg]

You have obviously not read the new improved claim in conformity with the proposed rules. The recordings on the tape and video can be any languages at all. The mere fact that "Something" appears where "Nothing" was before is Not Scientifically Explainable. therefore Paranormal.

There are many explanations for something appearing on a recording device where nothing was before.

 

[Czarcasm]

I don't understand.. have you actually made your claim somewhere?

I think he's talking about the post where a bunch of electronics are shoved into a "super faraday cage"(whatever that is), everything is turned on at the same time, he chants some pseudo-religious poetry, then claims credit if anything at all shows up for whatever reason on the various recording devices after 27 minutes have gone by(leaving three minutes for commercials.)
It reminds me of what my grandfather used to tell me-"If you insist on showing off, never say anything more than 'Watch this!', then claim credit for whatever happens afterward."
About the venue itself-is it confirmed that The Professor has acquired permission from the proper authorities to put on this show at the date/time/place stated?

 

[alfaniner]

You have obviously not read the new improved claim in conformity with the proposed rules. The recordings on the tape and video can be any languages at all. The mere fact that "Something" appears where "Nothing" was before is Not Scientifically Explainable. therefore Paranormal.

Any language? How would you determine which one it was?

If you heard "Arem, Shem, Beth, Sedal, Sacravalian, Ahad" could you determine that it was Aramaic?

 

[Elvis666]

Honestly, I can't see how a malfunctioning device in a super faraday cage could produce understandable voices? How would it?

When I have Google search the web for the term "super faraday cage", it states that there are no results found. I did get two hits in newsgroups, both in reference to a posting about Clarke's 'Rendezvous with Rama', that originated in 1998.

 

[jimtron]

I get it... I am so SLOW! All the JREF and Forum members have to do is play hide and seek! What claim? I don't see one, do you Mr. Randi ... No? Me neither. Claim? What claim? Was there a claim of some sort?
Paranormal ... Please prove it's paranormal before the test begins, since we believe nothing is paranormal then it can't be paranormal.
...

Dave, you seem to be implying (and correct me if I'm wrong) that there is a catch-22, and that it's impossible to take the MDC because of the definition of "paranormal," or because the JREF doesn't believe in the paranormal. But if you look at the MCD forum, at past discussions, you'll see that protocols have been approved by JREF, and there's no reason to get stuck regarding the semantics of the term "paranormal."

For example, if you can find water with dowsing sticks, you can win the million--IIRC the JREF has approved protocols regarding that test. And if you look through this forum you'll find many more examples. The reason that you aren't proceeding through the MDC process is because you're not following the rules and stating clearly what your claim is, and how it's a testable, self-evident demonstration of the paranormal.

For more information, take a look at the tread I linked to earlier in this thread--the discussion titled "paranormal=misnomer?"

The onus is on you to explain how your claim is paranormal--you started the application process. Tell us what about the voice or whatever is paranormal.

Could you please tell us also about your past success "making contact" at the Devil's Chair? If not, why not?

eta: Let's set aside the term "paranormal" for a moment. The problem with what you've described so far, is that it sounds entirely scientifically explainable. If the voice or entity or whatever can see inside an opaque box or something like that, it would indicate that we're dealing with something not scientifically explainable. What you've described so far can be achieved through known technology.

 

[RoboTimbo]

I get it... I am so SLOW! All the JREF and Forum members have to do is play hide and seek! What claim? I don't see one, do you Mr. Randi ... No? Me neither. Claim? What claim? Was there a claim of some sort?
Paranormal ... Please prove it's paranormal before the test begins, since we believe nothing is paranormal then it can't be paranormal.
Claim? What Claim?
And your Million Dollars remains safe.
Must be part of that "How not to be a geek" class at DragonCon.

Jim Callahan, can I appeal to you to explain to The Professor why his claim is not a claim of a paranormal phenomenon? Many, many have tried to advise him that just him saying voices will be audible on recording media can ONLY be paranormal, isn't so. Many, many have tried to offer other explanations as to how voices can be made to manifest on recording media by other means.

Nobody can get through to him. You seem to be an acquaintance of his, can you lend a hand? Help him come up with a claim that rules out explainable means. Then we can get on with a protocol.

Thanks.

 

[jenski]

I get it... I am so SLOW! All the JREF and Forum members have to do is play hide and seek! What claim? I don't see one, do you Mr. Randi ... No? Me neither. Claim? What claim? Was there a claim of some sort?
Paranormal ... Please prove it's paranormal before the test begins, since we believe nothing is paranormal then it can't be paranormal.
Claim? What Claim?
And your Million Dollars remains safe.
Must be part of that "How not to be a geek" class at DragonCon.

Sir, dishonesty is incredibly unappealing. How about instead of posturing, you follow the rules. You see, it is so easy. Follow the rules to the letter and should you pass the test (which you agreed to) then you win.

Easy. In fact, it's even easier than snide asides.

 

[Jim Callahan]

There are many explanations for something appearing on a recording device where nothing was before.

Not in this instance.
And you are talking about this instance right?

If not why even bring it up?

If you have some sort of information to back up your claim do so.

I really just want to see this go down becouse I do know how it will end.
(Great fun I say)

So please provide your proof since you put forth the post.

Jim

 

[jenski]

Not in this instance.
And you are talking about this instance right?

If not why even bring it up?

If you have some sort of information to back up your claim do so.

I really just want to see this go down becouse I do know how it will end.
(Great fun I say)

So please provide your proof since you put forth the post.

Jim

Jim, it's become patently obvious to even the sunniest optimist exactly how this will end. TP will not have a testable claim. When October 31st comes around and I am handing out treats to my neighborhood children, he will be on TV proclaiming to the world how James Randi ran away and refused to test him.

 

[Jeff Wagg]

Not in this instance.
And you are talking about this instance right?

If by this instance you mean The Professor's protocol, then yes.

If not why even bring it up?

I didn't bring it up.

If you have some sort of information to back up your claim do so.

How about one of the aforementioned chips from a greeting card placed inside the TV set? Or maybe one of the TV sets is modified in an undetectable way so that it will tune in to a TV station for a second or two every three or four minutes, thus producing a sound that the recorders would pick up? As your are a magician, I'm sure you could think of other ways.

I really just want to see this go down becouse I do know how it will end.
(Great fun I say)

So please provide your proof since you put forth the post.

Jim

Done.

 

[xinit]

I really just want to see this go down becouse I do know how it will end.

As do most of us... with a video on YouTube of Jim Callahan making accusations about how unfair the JREF testing process is, and how James Randi committed some horrible fraud in taking advantage of a well-intentioned Professor.

Yeah, maybe I can get a share of the million for my psychic prediction...

 

[RoboTimbo]

<snip>I really just want to see this go down becouse I do know how it will end.

Jim

I thought it was plain from the beginning.

It will end in shananigans.

 

[Jim Callahan]

OK Jeff I thought Dave allready said you cats bring the toys (Recorders etc.) he will bring the cage.

I bet he will even let you bring that if you want.

Now if it is all stuff you guys buy and bring on the cheap and he never touches the stuff please tell me how your last post offers anything by way of method?

As I said I know of no one who can do this thing.
Judging from your post neither do you.

Jim

 

[Jeff Wagg]

OK Jeff I thought Dave allready said you cats bring the toys (Recorders etc.) he will bring the cage.

I bet he will even let you bring that if you want.

Now if it is all stuff you guys buy and bring on the cheap and he never touches the stuff please tell me how your last post offers anything by way of method?

As I said I know of no one who can do this thing.
Judging from your post neither do you.

Jim

Perhaps there is something that generates sound hidden in the "super Faraday cage," or maybe there's a subwoofer nearby that causes the chair to vibrate, thus making the recorders pick up sound. Maybe he simply has one of the volunteers (who he has offered to pay) slip something into the works during setup.

The point is, the result described is too ambiguous for the challenge.

 

[Loss Leader]

I think somewhere in all of this mess, the Professor has at various times agreed to bits and pieces that could be condensed into some sort of protocol:

1. A new in box digital recording device is opened w/ new bateries and tested. The dB of a speaking voice at close distance with the recorder set at medium voilume is noted.

2. It is set to record and placed in a faraday cage (a medium-sized box lined w/ whatever metal and insulated with sound-proof foam).

3. The Professor flips a coin. If it's heads, he invokes the invocation and then waits three minutes. If it's tails, he does nothing and/or tells the spirits to cool it and then waits three minutes. Repeat ten very boring times. Times from the start of the test are noted.

4. The cage is busted open and the recorder is played. A successful individual trial will be if the max dB at any point when there should have been talking is the same or more than the open test. A successful individual trial will also be if the max dB during a "quiet" period is at less than one-half the dB of the open talking test.

5. A successful test will be nine successful trials.

Is that acceptable to anybody?

 

[Myriad]

I agree with the independently purchased equipment.
The Faraday cage is soundproof as Mr. Callahan has noted. Filled with acoustical padding. Megaphones won't work.

A little about INVOCATIONS, 3.5 minutes is not uncommon. It is actually Short! It is the KEY, the Catalyst, if you will, that starts the Paranormal process.
The equipment should be tested in a neutral place. Not in the graveyard and Not after any Invocation, to show it truly blocks out all possibilities of deception under Normal conditions.
The Place, Time and Invocation are all vital to the Paranormal Event!

The Professor, thank you for the reply.

I've cast a few invocations in my time, and written a few, so I understand about the length. I was just trying to imagine a protocol where it might have to be repeated five times. Also, I couldn't be sure from what you stated before whether the content of the Invocation is important to your claim.

But, a glimmer of progress here: the invocation is key! So, we have established at least one phrase that should be part of your claim: "...by means of a spoken Invocation of approximately five minutes in duration..." The Invocation (not necessarily by itself, but as a necessary component among others) has a paranormal effect. That is not to say that the Invocation is itself paranormal, any more than a dowser's rods are paranormal objects.

Now, you believe that the effect of this Invocation is to summon the presence of paranormal entities. But as has been explained, the presence or absence of paranormal entities, or the question of whether even an entity that is acknowledged by all to be present is in fact paranormal, are untestable. So, we must focus on the tangible and unambiguous effects that you claim the presence of the invoked paranormal entities will have. Focusing on that, we can leave the paranormal entities out of the claim altogether. We can instead state that the effects observed are caused (indirectly, but still caused) by the Invocation process itself. So we can append "... I shall cause..." to the previous phrase of your claim, and go on to state what unexplainable effects will be observed.

Now this part, you've already spoken about, so I'll just go ahead and jot down, "...audible sounds... ...to be recorded by electronic recording devices..." as part of the effects.

That's not quite enough, though, because recording audible sounds by electronic recording devices is far from unexplainable; that's what those devices are for after all. If the claim were that live snakes would be recorded by electronic recording devices (not the sound or images of snakes, but the actual snakes), we could probably stop there, but as it is we need something more.

So, we add, referring to the recording devices, something like ..."that are isolated acoustically, optically, and electromagnetically from all possible signal sources...". That's certainly something that wouldn't normally happen.

Except, "audible sounds" by itself is a little vague. Audible at what volume? Even a new blank tape will produce audible sounds if you turn the playback volume high enough. So, just to make sure you're not attempting to exploit this trivially obvious phenomenon, let's add just a bit of quantitative specification. Referring to the recorded sounds, we add: "...exceeding the recorded volume, as measured by a sound meter in decibels, of a 35-decibel reference sound recorded on the same tape immediately before the start of the invocation...".

Now, if you string those phrases and clauses together in the right order, add some punctuation, and you'd have something very much like a claim. I'm not going to do that for you because this is your claim and I'd rather encourage you go through the same thought processes yourself from the beginning and fill in your own answers.

Note that this is the claim not the protocol, so whether and how this claim can be tested is not addressed. Don't try to do that. State the claim first.

Respectfully,
Myriad

 

[not daSkeptic]

If the date of October 31st is so significant (regardless of the year), I assume that means conducting the test on any other day would result in failure. That said, could not a few control tests be run on other days? If TP will really be successful only on Halloween, there should be significant differences in the recorded results between the control tests and the actual test.

 

[NobbyNobbs]

I get it... I am so SLOW! All the JREF and Forum members have to do is play hide and seek! What claim? I don't see one, do you Mr. Randi ... No? Me neither. Claim? What claim? Was there a claim of some sort?
Paranormal ... Please prove it's paranormal before the test begins, since we believe nothing is paranormal then it can't be paranormal.
Claim? What Claim?
And your Million Dollars remains safe.
Must be part of that "How not to be a geek" class at DragonCon.

TP: It's not so much that you have to prove that it's paranormal. It's that you have to prove that it couldn't be anything but paranormal. You have to be able to nullify every single possible way that sounds could appear on those tapes according to any method known to science. You have yet to do that task, which is why you are getting such a hard time here.

 

[Hatchet]

You have obviously not read the new improved claim in conformity with the proposed rules. The recordings on the tape and video can be any languages at all. The mere fact that "Something" appears where "Nothing" was before is Not Scientifically Explainable. therefore Paranormal.

So is your paranormal claim any of the following?

While sitting on the Devils Chair at midnight on Halloween, you can:

• Make 'something' appear on a blank video or audio tape.
• Make a voice appear on a blank audio or video tape
• Make a voice which speak a clear and intelligible sentence appear on a blank audio or video tape.
• Make a voice appear on a blank audio or video tape which is able to answer questions asked of it.
• Make a voice appear on a blank audio or video tape which is able to read the contents of a sealed envelope.
• One of the above, but the voice will clearly be in English
• One of the above, but the voice will be in another language

I believe this is more like what Jeff means when he is asking you for a claim. A short description of what you actually claim to do.

Some of the above may be testable while others clearly are not.

Cheers,

Hatchet

 

[yairhol]

Another suggestion if TP will accept.

TP, can you put sound, picture or whatever on a magnetic (or some other) cassette when the cassette is not inserted into any recording device? A plain cassette in its wrapping which when opened will play answers to questions you are given at the challenge date?