Miss Cranky Pants
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Any chance we can see the show here in the US? Richard ... I am hoping that the truth doesn't get edited out! I very much hope that good things come to you from this show.
Merged The One - Australian TV
- Thread starter Richard
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Richard
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The spirits must be mad at me as my digital recorder blew up. I'm sure someone in Australia will record the show and it will end up on a torrent or whatever. I'll know if I have done my job right if I get heckled in the streets by the wo wo crowd.
nettiemoore
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I think there's a fair discussion to be had about skeptics appearing on shows like this because we all know the trend is very much to screw us over. But they are going to make this show anyway and better they get an experienced skeptic like Richard than some Channel Seven celebrity to be the token. He knows what he's seeing and can break it down in a few sentences. Just getting the words "cold reading" out there in the public at prime time is valuable. When you google it the top results are all solid skeptical links.
We all know the true believers can rarely be swayed and yeah the "psychics" are going to see a swelling of the bank balance as a result, even after failure. That's going to happen anyway. Talking to other people in the audience, many people are intrigued by the concept and perhaps had had "experiences" of their own but were still able to see the validity of the cold reading explanations once you laid it out for them. We need to have someone up there providing that opportunity, however curtailed by the demands of crappy TV. I think Richard is very brave to put himself in the firing line -- from the mystery-mongers and the skeptics.
I was at the studio for the taping of three episodes, including the finale yesterday, and can say Richard has absolutely nailed the "psychics" in his comments. A bit of "I don't know how she did it but I'm not convinced" in the first episode goes a long way to diffuse the constant "closed minded" criticism (which I loathe, skeptic=open minded by definition, you fools.), and makes the PWNage later more effective. The host and whole production was setting up the "close minded" fallacy as a trap, walking straight into it does nothing for our message in the long term. So, don't sweat the promo grab.
What they choose to show via editing is out of our control but I would personally rather 10% of something than 100% of nothing.
Anyway, if you are going to watch I recommend getting Skeptico's Cold Reading Bingo cards and play along at home.
I'm not allowed to post the link 'cause I haven't made 15 posts but anyway, google it!
We all know the true believers can rarely be swayed and yeah the "psychics" are going to see a swelling of the bank balance as a result, even after failure. That's going to happen anyway. Talking to other people in the audience, many people are intrigued by the concept and perhaps had had "experiences" of their own but were still able to see the validity of the cold reading explanations once you laid it out for them. We need to have someone up there providing that opportunity, however curtailed by the demands of crappy TV. I think Richard is very brave to put himself in the firing line -- from the mystery-mongers and the skeptics.
I was at the studio for the taping of three episodes, including the finale yesterday, and can say Richard has absolutely nailed the "psychics" in his comments. A bit of "I don't know how she did it but I'm not convinced" in the first episode goes a long way to diffuse the constant "closed minded" criticism (which I loathe, skeptic=open minded by definition, you fools.), and makes the PWNage later more effective. The host and whole production was setting up the "close minded" fallacy as a trap, walking straight into it does nothing for our message in the long term. So, don't sweat the promo grab.
What they choose to show via editing is out of our control but I would personally rather 10% of something than 100% of nothing.
Anyway, if you are going to watch I recommend getting Skeptico's Cold Reading Bingo cards and play along at home.
I'm not allowed to post the link 'cause I haven't made 15 posts but anyway, google it!
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Can you now research how these people did things you didn't understand and come out in public with the answers? ie This forum, or the daily newspapers/other tv stations.
Or did you sign a "I won't say a word after the show" contract?
nettiemoore
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Richard can speak for himself but .... They didn't do anything he doesn't understand and moreover that is not what he is quoted as saying in the promo, which I presume is all you have seen. The exact quote is: "I'm not exactly sure how she did it." Which is a perfectly accurate thing to say if it relates to the "challenge" I am thinking of, which was not a cold reading type one.
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Richard
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Yes., good points. I am free to put my case and I did so on the show. What I won't do is blab about what happened on the the show before it goes out as that would be spoilers. Hell, there are lots of people who just want to see what happens each week.
ail
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The online voting poll to the question
Are you a believer or a skeptic?
Has Believer at 36% and skeptic at 64% with 1172 respondants
And this is before the show has aired !
http://au.tv.yahoo.com/b/the-one/
Are you a believer or a skeptic?
Has Believer at 36% and skeptic at 64% with 1172 respondants
And this is before the show has aired !
http://au.tv.yahoo.com/b/the-one/
rjh01
Gentleman of leisure
37 to 63% with 1202 votes. Looks like a few believers voted.
You are allowed to vote often.
You are allowed to vote often.
Richard
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You might like to see what the other judge - Stacey Demarco has to say so far on her blog.
http://themodernwitch.blogspot.com/2008/07/wowbig-reaction-and-it-hasnt-even.html
http://themodernwitch.blogspot.com/2008/07/wowbig-reaction-and-it-hasnt-even.html
Wolfman
Chief Solipsistic, Autosycophant
Personally, I applaud Richard's efforts here.
Not every skeptical appearance has to be about unequivocally debunking psychics or other purveyors of woo. Randi's various shows and demonstrations are a good example...yes, he debunked a number of people quite soundly, but the very nature of his shows meant that A) a lot of woos would simply refuse to appear on his show, and B) the audience that he attracts will tend to be an audience that is already more skeptical.
Richard is working in a different medium. He won't be (I presume) actually debunking these people and showing them up as frauds. But he'll be raising legitimate questions, raising obvious problems, etc. He'll have the chance to appear with people who would never dare to appear with James Randi. And he'll be reaching an audience many of whom would never watch James Randi.
If by his presence on this show, he's able to simply get some small portion of the viewers questioning the abilities of the performers, or looking at the performances more critically, he'll have accomplished something important.
Even more importantly, perhaps, he'll be gaining significantly higher celebrity status; he'll be a recognized face, a recognized name. He'll have many more opportunities to do other appearances at which he'll be able to present his own opinions and beliefs more clearly than might be allowed on this particular TV show. He'll become a defacto spokesman for skepticism, and have the opportunity to reach far, far more people than he does at present.
In the process of doing this, he's also going to be subjecting himself to all sorts of criticism and abuse. Both from the woo community who will condemn him for being closed-minded, and from those in the skeptical community who will berate him for "not doing enough".
Come on, people. The man's already done more to promote skepticism than the majority of members here; and this TV show is going to give him the opportunity to do much more (if not on the TV show itself, then in the many new opportunities he'll get afterwards).
I say kudos to Richard for doing this. I wish that there were more skeptics actually getting involved (and particularly trying to reach out somewhat to the woo communities), rather than sitting on their posteriors and ruminating online with other people who already pretty much believe the same things they do.
Its people like Richard who are going to help the skeptical movement grow and develop.
Not every skeptical appearance has to be about unequivocally debunking psychics or other purveyors of woo. Randi's various shows and demonstrations are a good example...yes, he debunked a number of people quite soundly, but the very nature of his shows meant that A) a lot of woos would simply refuse to appear on his show, and B) the audience that he attracts will tend to be an audience that is already more skeptical.
Richard is working in a different medium. He won't be (I presume) actually debunking these people and showing them up as frauds. But he'll be raising legitimate questions, raising obvious problems, etc. He'll have the chance to appear with people who would never dare to appear with James Randi. And he'll be reaching an audience many of whom would never watch James Randi.
If by his presence on this show, he's able to simply get some small portion of the viewers questioning the abilities of the performers, or looking at the performances more critically, he'll have accomplished something important.
Even more importantly, perhaps, he'll be gaining significantly higher celebrity status; he'll be a recognized face, a recognized name. He'll have many more opportunities to do other appearances at which he'll be able to present his own opinions and beliefs more clearly than might be allowed on this particular TV show. He'll become a defacto spokesman for skepticism, and have the opportunity to reach far, far more people than he does at present.
In the process of doing this, he's also going to be subjecting himself to all sorts of criticism and abuse. Both from the woo community who will condemn him for being closed-minded, and from those in the skeptical community who will berate him for "not doing enough".
Come on, people. The man's already done more to promote skepticism than the majority of members here; and this TV show is going to give him the opportunity to do much more (if not on the TV show itself, then in the many new opportunities he'll get afterwards).
I say kudos to Richard for doing this. I wish that there were more skeptics actually getting involved (and particularly trying to reach out somewhat to the woo communities), rather than sitting on their posteriors and ruminating online with other people who already pretty much believe the same things they do.
Its people like Richard who are going to help the skeptical movement grow and develop.
Richard
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I was asked by the producers after they saw a clip of me on another show. They were after someone who could perform on TV but also knew the topic. They also didn't want someone who would just sit there and say 'it's all BS'.
And I didn't want them to use a fake 'skeptic', a personality or academic who thinks they know how things work. It was hard, very hard. It tested ME more than the contestants I think. I am also alone on the show, the only voice of reason.
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nettiemoore
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Homework for Andrew Daddo:
-- definition of "skeptic"
-- concept of "subjective validation"
Don't come out of your room until you're finished!
-- definition of "skeptic"
-- concept of "subjective validation"
Don't come out of your room until you're finished!
i have the pleasure of watching "the one" as im typing this. im torn between cheering for richard and kicking the tv screen. cold reading..check!, retrofitting..check!. lots of " you must be open minded.." but only if you're a sceptic, if you're a true bleever you arent being asked to be open to the possibility that its all made up crap. im actually astounded at how rubbish they all are. your average magician could do a far more convincing job. mind you, the "Dr of reiki" looks like steven seagal crossed with a hippy librarian. they are soooooooo bad. im sensing a man/women/dog. you are an old man in your 60's, hmmm must be a heart condition! bingo!. you have a prostate "issue". turns out the old fella doesnt but apparently thats a hit too. lots of asking questions. ooh, this is too funny - "im sensing you have plumbing isses" plumbing issues!!. "is someone having a birthday? she's showing me a cake" bleaugh!!. and surely if they're the best psychics they already know who's going to win?. anyway, i can already tell that i'll be watching the whole series in horrified fascination. kudos to you richard for giving it a go. the look on your face for much of the show is definately worth it. how hard was it not to just sit there rolling your eyes and shouting?. i reckon it's probably the most skeptical it's possible to be on woo friendly commercial television.
Australia's Most Convincing Charlatan
Well, suffice to say I'm convinced.
I've abandoned all rational thought and converted to woo. No, not really. The first episode of Australia's Most Gifted Psychic aired tonight and, well...
...it's a solid hour of entertainment for those without a skeptical bone in their bodies. For everyone else, it's Psychic Detectives all over again.
If you wanted to write a book on psychic cliches, this would be it. They even did some silly cold reading nonesense with unrestricted feedback. And Richard Saunders was a complete tool of the program. Any credibility he may have had has now been blown completely out of the water.
This is something for the woo woo crowd, and nothing more. There was no attempt to disprove or rationalise anything. It's all, "Well, he was certainly close!" and, "He knew things he couldn't have known!"
Ooh, wow, it's amazing, a miracle, sign me up for a thousand crystals and some applied kinesiology.
Dark days, my friends. Very dark days.
Well, suffice to say I'm convinced.
I've abandoned all rational thought and converted to woo. No, not really. The first episode of Australia's Most Gifted Psychic aired tonight and, well...
...it's a solid hour of entertainment for those without a skeptical bone in their bodies. For everyone else, it's Psychic Detectives all over again.
If you wanted to write a book on psychic cliches, this would be it. They even did some silly cold reading nonesense with unrestricted feedback. And Richard Saunders was a complete tool of the program. Any credibility he may have had has now been blown completely out of the water.
This is something for the woo woo crowd, and nothing more. There was no attempt to disprove or rationalise anything. It's all, "Well, he was certainly close!" and, "He knew things he couldn't have known!"
Ooh, wow, it's amazing, a miracle, sign me up for a thousand crystals and some applied kinesiology.
Dark days, my friends. Very dark days.
Despite asking my family to let me know when "The One" is being shown (not being a Channel 7 watcher) I only get to see the tail end. My family tells me that Andrew Daddo looks skeptical as well. Hope so. But good to see you on the big screen Richard.
