Was Christopher Columbus obsessed with the Bible

[Wheezebucket]

So how is the fact that Columbus (a genocidal slave trader douche bag) was a Christian helping your cause? Ok, great, he sailed into a land mass and proceeded to rape the **** out of it - how does that make him a great Christian?

 

[joobz]

...
Much like science.

NO. Nothing you have done has been anything like science. Science is about hypothesis testing. What is your hypothesis on the relavence of Christiopher columbus and the validity of christianity?

 

[JoeEllison]

I am occasionally offering evidence that strengthens the case for Christianity.

When have you done so? No one has seen any of this evidence. We've seen you post random bits of useless trivia, much of which has been false and/or misleading, but absolutely no evidence that "strengthens the case for Christianity."

 

[Taffer]

I am occasionally offering evidence that strengthens the case for Christianity. For example, when Christ says this in the book of Mathew chapter 16 verse 18:

"And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it."

And then I offer this

http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=85633&highlight=spent+years+Rome

and the largest Christian Church in the world is based in Rome. Then it is my opinion that this evidence strengthens the case for Christianity. But of course this one fact does not prove Christianity but it certainly is a factor in its favor.

Much like science. When those 2 scientists (through intelligent design) designed an experiment that when they passed some electricity through various elements thought to exist on earth in its early stages got some organic matter -- that was some evidence for the theory that life came from non-living chemicals. The "intelligently designed" experiment certainly wasn't proof that life came from non-living chemicals but it was a factor in its favor. Much like Peter "the Rock" being in Rome (in light of what Christ said) is a factor in favor of the case for Christianity.

Y'see, DOC, the difference is that the experiment used facts, while as your point uses something the Bible says. You have to prove that the Bible is factually accurate first.

 

[Lonewulf]

...
Much like science.

Wrong.

 

[kmortis]

Y'see, DOC, the difference is that the experiment used facts, while as your point uses something the Bible says. You have to prove that the Bible is factually accurate first.

Let's clarify this for the viewers playing the at-home version.

It's not just the Bible that has to be shown to be factual, but each of the books contained in the Bible, at least any part that you want to submit as corroborating evidence for an event. For example, you brought up Jesus chatting with Pete. Then you have to provide evidence that:

• There was a Jesus
• There was a Peter Simon
• Jesus and Peter knew each other.
• That Jesus actually said to Peter what the author of Matthew claims that he said

Good luck with that. Since the origional autographs aren't available to examination, have fun trying to prove that anything was what the author meant to say. Then have even more fun trying to correlate what the author wrote and what actually took place (assuming that the first two list items have been satisified first).

Far cry from actually producing amino acids from a protien slurry, as has been hypothesised.

 

[Cleon]

Once again, I present to you the T-shirt based on this thread....

 

[PrincessIneffabelle]

Once again, I present to you the T-shirt based on this thread....

And, once again, I really wish I had the *ahem* courage to wear it!

 

[Cleon]

And, once again, I really wish I had the *ahem* courage to wear it!

There's always TAM.

 

[JoeEllison]

I am so getting that T-shirt!

 

[DOC]

Well I'll get to the science and bible comments when I get the time. I saw part of that special on Columbus on the History channel. According to the show the first thing Columbus did was say a prayer of Thanksgiving at his first landing site. He named the area San Salvador which means "Holy Savior".

He left 39 people behind on his 1st voyage. When he came back to see them on the second voyage they were all slaughtered and the camp destroyed. The show showed Columbus looking at some of the skeletons. That had to do a number on his psyche to see the skeletons of people he knew. This could also explain his tough and sometimes brutal behavior on both the Natives and his own men in subsequent years.

 

[Safe-Keeper]

Much like science. When those 2 scientists (through intelligent design) designed an experiment that when they passed some electricity through various elements thought to exist on earth in its early stages got some organic matter -- that was some evidence for the theory that life came from non-living chemicals. The "intelligently designed" experiment certainly wasn't proof that life came from non-living chemicals but it was a factor in its favor. Much like Peter "the Rock" being in Rome (in light of what Christ said) is a factor in favor of the case for Christianity.

I thought your threads were posted just to "throw info around"?

 

[Hokulele]

He left 39 people behind on his 1st voyage. When he came back to see them on the second voyage they were all slaughtered and the camp destroyed. The show showed Columbus looking at some of the skeletons. That had to do a number on his psyche to see the skeletons of people he knew. This could also explain his tough and sometimes brutal behavior on both the Natives and his own men in subsequent years.

Way to blame the victims.

 

[Safe-Keeper]

Also dodging the question:

So how is the fact that Columbus (a genocidal slave trader douche bag) was a Christian helping your cause? Ok, great, he sailed into a land mass and proceeded to rape the **** out of it - how does that make him a great Christian?

As for your 'enraged and traumatized by seeing 39 skeletons' excuse, was not pretty much everything with white skin and two legs carrying out imperialistic colonialism at this time? Are you saying that everyone else who carried out atrocities in the Americas were evil, but good old Chris was a True Christian(TM) who just happened to have gone a little nuts from watching his old friends die, and otherwise would've gone against his society's norms, expectations of him, and most likely his orders by being all buddy-buddy with the natives?

I don't think so.

 

[linusrichard]

Well I'll get to the science and bible comments when I get the time. I saw part of that special on Columbus on the History channel. According to the show the first thing Columbus did was say a prayer of Thanksgiving at his first landing site. He named the area San Salvador which means "Holy Savior".

So?

He left 39 people behind on his 1st voyage. When he came back to see them on the second voyage they were all slaughtered and the camp destroyed. The show showed Columbus looking at some of the skeletons. That had to do a number on his psyche to see the skeletons of people he knew. This could also explain his tough and sometimes brutal behavior on both the Natives and his own men in subsequent years.

Did Bartolome de las Casas see the skeletons? I'm not sure it matters.

Here's the thing: we can go back and forth, you and everyone else, on whether what Columbus did was good or bad, right or wrong, understandable or not, forgivable or not. That's subjective. We can be disgusted that you think what Columbus did was okay, but we can't say you're incorrect. But what's not subjective is whether Columbus was being Christlike in his slaving and murdering. We have an official version of what Christ supposedly did and told us to do, and we can compare somebody's actions with that to see if he's being Christlike. And Columbus was not.

I wish you would really examine your absurd and somewhat circular argument. You have to try to show that Columbus was a good Christian in order to show that he was a good guy, because if he was a good guy, that makes Christianity look good, because Columbus was a good Christian. It's not effective. Here's a hint: the people on this forum who argue that Hitler was a Christian are not the Christians.

 

[JoeEllison]

I thought your threads were posted just to "throw info around"?

I think he gave up on telling that particular lie a week or two ago... finally.

 

[eir_de_scania]

He left 39 people behind on his 1st voyage. When he came back to see them on the second voyage they were all slaughtered and the camp destroyed. The show showed Columbus looking at some of the skeletons. That had to do a number on his psyche to see the skeletons of people he knew. This could also explain his tough and sometimes brutal behavior on both the Natives and his own men in subsequent years.

Columbus had a TV crew on board?
I doubt that was the firs time Columbus saw the remains of people he knew. And I doubt he was all sunshine and sweetness before, as well. We're talking about sailors and adventures here.

 

[kmortis]

I think he gave up on telling that particular lie a week or two ago... finally.

That's ok, two weeks is just the right amount of time for him to pick it up again.

 

[Nogbad]

Actually the Christian Pilgrims had a good relationship with the Indians. And there are several very rich tribes out there because of Indian Gaming. So not everything turned out so bad. It's certainly more peaceful now on the North American Continent than before the Europeans came.

It is true that the small number of original pilgrims had a relatively peaceful relationship with Native Americans but that did not last long. The decline in the Native American population in the following years was spectacular and the Revolution, war of 1812, the Spanish American war, the incredibly bloody Civil War, the wars against the Native Americans were hardly peaceful - all in all the first 100 years of US history was pretty violent.

 

[six7s]

From JREF Forum » General Topics » Religion and Philosophy » The Troubling Beliefs of an "Influential" Atheist"

I'm probably not going to respond to any more derails. Take the topic to the thread it came from and I might respond to it if I get the time.

Fingers crossed

The entire Western Hemisphere (including Native Americans) are now enjoying peace because of the dangerous voyages of the quasi-Christian explorers

This 'Western Hemisphere' that you mention... where are its borders?

According to the book "The picture History of the Great Explorers" by Gillian Clements

Amazon: Editorial Reviews

Beginning with the first prehistoric explorers and moving through recent explorations of space, this short introduction covers a wide variety of figures. Some names are well known: Leif Eriksson, Francis Drake, and Thor Heyerdahl. But many lesser-known explorers are introduced as well. William Jansz found trading opportunities for the Dutch East India Company in the 1600s, and Hugh Clapperton explored Africa in the early nineteenth century.

The two to three paragraphs of information per subject are probably insufficient for school reports, and the few maps do not provide enough assistance for pupils. But this highly visual book (with an illustrated time line running along the bottom of the page) will attract browsers

Great to know you have access to such esteemed resources!