Is Science getting closer to God and the Bible?

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But don't you just love these "The Science in Star Trek" and "The Science in Harry Potter" books! There was even one for the X-Files.
 
Even if your claim were true, one has to wonder why your God included only those scientific facts that were completely worthless to humans a couple of millenia ago. Wouldn't your God have been much more praiseworthy if He gave instructions on how to perform artifical respiration, or how to wash out cuts with alcohol, or how to apply pressure to stop bleeding? Of all the millions of scientific facts available, your God choose to make veiled references to the rain cycle. What a Tool. Instead of including important information, He spends a whole chapter describing what kind of curtains will make Him happy (Exodus 26:1-37). Go peddle your version of Christianity somewhere else, DOC. No one here is buying
 
And Star Wars:

Judges 5:20: "They fought from heaven; the stars in their courses fought against Sisera."
 
If an argument for the truth of the Bible is that it agrees with science, does that not imply the validity of the scientific method? If so, then you have a problem. Rather, you have many -- the Bible contradicts science repeatedly and under no uncertain terms.

Either science is a valid method of approaching the truth or it isn’t; it’s conclusions either trustworthy or not. You can’t have it both ways.
 
Ignore the lies for a minute. They are the same lies that "Christians" have been pushing for decades. It is boring, and attacking DOC for repeating these same boring lies isn't too interesting either.

Instead, it is much more interesting to explore the various mental states of the people involved. We can assume that somewhere along the chain, someone must understand that these ARE lies... but is that a safe assumption? We know that the people repeating the lies aren't applying any rational or critical thinking when they are presented with these make-believe "facts"... but how can they manage to hold jobs and dress themselves, and still fall for this nonsense?

There are a lot of really intriguing things to explore here.:)
 
JoeEllison said:
Ignore the lies for a minute. They are the same lies that "Christians" have been pushing for decades. It is boring, and attacking DOC for repeating these same boring lies isn't too interesting either.

Instead, it is much more interesting to explore the various mental states of the people involved. We can assume that somewhere along the chain, someone must understand that these ARE lies... but is that a safe assumption? We know that the people repeating the lies aren't applying any rational or critical thinking when they are presented with these make-believe "facts"... but how can they manage to hold jobs and dress themselves, and still fall for this nonsense?

There are a lot of really intriguing things to explore here.:)
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Wishful thinking, and/or not thinking for themselves.
 
BTW "DoK" Still haven't spotted that post on your college and major (still curious due to your comment about being great in Logic in college) (and the strong lack of support for that statement given his writings here). ( This refers to the Thomas Jefferson silliness/thread. My post 1866 there in response to his claim an noted here).
 
Hilarious. I can't find a single one that describes a scientific process or phenomenon that wouldn't have been known to the people at the time. Most don't describe what they say they describe.

It's funny that when you point out to a fundie some scientific error in the Bible, like bats being birds, or insects having four legs, the excuse is always that God had to put it in those terms because that's what would have been understood by the people at the time. But now comes the claim that there are all these things that wouldn't have been understood by people at the time (like snow!!), and that goes in the Bible as well.

Some particularly funny ones:

Number of stars:
Genesis 22:17
"That in blessing I will bless thee, and in multiplying I will multiply thy seed as the stars of the heaven, and as the sand which is upon the sea shore; and thy seed shall possess the gate of his enemies"
(So... a lot? There's no way ancient people could have known there were a lot of stars without divine guidance? When exactly did humans master the scientific art of "looking up"?)

Size of the universe:
Job 11:7-9
"Canst thou by searching find out God? canst thou find out the Almighty unto perfection? It is as high as heaven; what canst thou do? deeper than hell; what canst thou know? The measure thereof is longer than the earth, and broader than the sea."
Isaiah 55:9
"For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts."
(Amazing! Who in those times could have guessed that the sky was above the earth, and that the universe was somewhat bigger than the earth?)

Electrical transmission of information:
Job 38:35
"Canst thou send lightnings, that they may go and say unto thee, Here we are?"
(The point of this passage is that people can't do these things. It's in the middle of a whole bunch of things that humans can't do. If you want to argue that humans today can "send lightnings, that they may go and say unto thee, Here we are," then you're arguing that this passage of the Bible is wrong.)
 
DOC said:
Actually, even though Moses (the supposed author of Genesis) probably never took a science course or had access to a telescope he seemed to know a lot about modern scientific theory.

Here is what I heard Dr. Carl Baugh talk about one time on his TV program:


Genesis 1:1a - the universe came first

Genesis 1:1b - then the earth

Gen 1:10 - then land and sea

Gen 1:21 - then life in the sea

Gen 1;24-25 - then land animals

Gen 1:27 - lastly humans

Also other biblical writers had other unusual scientific knowledge of such things as evaporation, condensation, a time when there was no precipitation. and that the earth hung suspended in space. Gen 2: 6,7 , Eccl 1:7 , Isa 40:22 , Job 26:7
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Here's another account:

Ezra 6:38 - Heaven and earth
Ezra 6:40 - Light
Ezra 6:41 - Water above, water below
Ezra 6:42 - Water confined to 1/7 of the earth; 6/7 dry land
Ezra 6:44 - Fruits and flowers
Ezra 6:45 - Sun, moon, stars
Ezra 6:46 - Sun, moon, and stars commanded to serve man.
(Sun, moon, and stars laugh behind God's back; there IS no man yet...)
Ezra 6:47 - Watery 1/7 gives birth to fish and birds
Ezra 6:49 - One living creature for the water (Leviathan), one for the land (Enoch)
Ezra 6:53 - Beasts, unbeastly cattle, and creeping things
Ezra 6:54 - Adam

I hope science never catches up to that 1/7 water, 6/7 land factoid; I much prefer 7/10 water, 3/10 land. And I do wonder how the earth (and light!) was created before the sun, moon, and stars. And how the flowers and fruit trees managed photosynthesis before the creation of the sun (oh, wait, there was still all that LIGHT, so God could see while he worked). And I hope Jesus won't need to be crucified again to atone for all the people who might mistake this for good science.
 
DOC said:
I came across this site that claims many scientific principles were actually presented first in the bible.

http://www.creationevidence.org/scientific_evid/se_scripture.html
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To answer the thread's title question, "Is Science getting closer to God and the Bible?", that would be a resounding "No".

FWIW, my introduction to skepticism was through a college philosophy class called "Science and Pseudoscience" and I recall studying one of Morris' books then... guess which side he was studied as an example of? :D
 
JoeEllison said:
We can assume that somewhere along the chain, someone must understand that these ARE lies... but is that a safe assumption?
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In Space by Michener, there is a character who runs small-time UFO scams in the back of magazines during the rise of the space age in the United States. The character senses the winds of change as the 80s approach (and interest in space wanes) and switches to a televised ministry. I wonder if Michener wrote this as an indictment of liars at the top of ministries.
 
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Taffer said:
Wishful thinking, and/or not thinking for themselves.
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Well, yes and no. "Wishful thinking" makes me hope I'll win the lottery, not imagine that the reason I haven't won the lottery is that there is an international cabal of Jewish bankers, Freemasons, and Latin American meat packing glitterati conspiring to keep me from collecting my rightful winnings. There's a difference of degree AND of kind between normal wishful thinking and the willful rejection of reality in favor of some millennia-old sheepherder mythology, combined with a delusional twisting of both to create a false agreement between the two.
 
DOC said:
Here is what I heard Dr. Carl Baugh talk about one time on his TV program:
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Carl Baugh

He and several others are known for claiming to have discovered human and dinosaur footprints together in rocks near the Paluxy River in Texas. Baugh's "research" has put him at odds with other young earth creationists. His claims are rejected by many in the scientific community as pseudoscience.

{snip}

He also appears on a weekly Trinity Broadcasting Network show called "Creation in the 21st Century" and is president and Ph. D alumnus of the Pacific International University, which many have accused of being a diploma mill.

{snip}

Baugh has claimed several degrees, at one point professing to earning three doctorates. All three "doctorates" are from unaccredited "schools." One is an honorary "Doctor of Philosophy in Theology" from the California Graduate School of Theology (not accredited). His 1989 "doctorate" comes from Pacific International University (not accredited), a distance education only "school" Baugh was the president of. His dissertation titled "Academic Justification for Voluntary Inclusion of Scientific Creation in Public Classroom Curricula, Supported by Evidence that Man and Dinosaurs Were Contemporary" was reviewed at the "Talk Origins Archive" website as including "descriptions of his field-work on the Paluxy river 'man-tracks', speculation about Charles Darwin's religious beliefs and phobias, and odd ramblings about the biblical Adam's mental excellence." In 2005, Baugh completed a Doctorate degree in Theology from the unaccredited Louisiana Baptist University.
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Yikes. This guy is an even worse source than the guy in your OP. At least Henry Morris had an education and didn't just invent things out of whole cloth.
 
JoeEllison said:
Ignore the lies for a minute. They are the same lies that "Christians" have been pushing for decades. It is boring, and attacking DOC for repeating these same boring lies isn't too interesting either.

Instead, it is much more interesting to explore the various mental states of the people involved. We can assume that somewhere along the chain, someone must understand that these ARE lies... but is that a safe assumption? We know that the people repeating the lies aren't applying any rational or critical thinking when they are presented with these make-believe "facts"... but how can they manage to hold jobs and dress themselves, and still fall for this nonsense?

There are a lot of really intriguing things to explore here.:)
Click to expand...


I can’t help wondering how much difference there is between a fundamentalist who insists on things which are easily and repeatedly proven wrong, and brain-washed cultists.

ETA: And hey, did the forum clock update to the old end of DST, or is something paranormal going on in the temporal dimension?
 
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Ryan O'Dine said:
I can’t help wondering how much difference there is between a fundamentalist who insists on things which are easily and repeatedly proven wrong, and brain-washed cultists.

ETA: And hey, did the forum clock update to the old end of DST, or is something paranormal going on in the temporal dimension?
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Why would you assume that there's any real difference at all?
 
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