Simple Challenge For Bigfoot Supporters

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LAL said:
That's what it's been doing, isn't it? How would it get up any other way?
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But if they ALWAYS gather their feet under themselves when standing, shouldn't there be multiple hoofprints in the center of an elk lay impression?

Where are they in this elk lay?

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RayG
 
Yet there are no elk tracks located in the center of the Skookum imprint, only deep and clear elk prints skirting the imprint.
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Which is exactly what you'd see with an elk imprint, as we have conclusively shown, Dr. Meldrum.

I can only speculate that the references Meldrum used were believers in bigfoot.
 
LTC8K6 said:
I can only speculate that the references Meldrum used were believers in bigfoot.
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It seems that once Bigfooters decide that some bit of secondary evidence suggests Bigfoot, they stick with it. When your Bigfoot expert hero endorses something, you can put your eggs in that basket. It doesn't matter what anyone else (including relevant scientists) says about the evidence. As long as your token expert continues to support the bit, you can defend it as well.

Noll must have spontaneously decided that the Skookum imprint was something worthy of pouring huge gobs of casting material. At that point an investment is made. I wonder if some of this kind of BF evidence gets so much initial endorsement by token experts that it becomes difficult for them to declare it non-evidence. Bigfoot experts may fear losing their fan base (folks who buy books, DVDs, etc) if they admit to too many mistakes.

That Bigfoot has not yet been confirmed in the flesh (or bone) is powerful ongoing evidence of its absence. That it never shows up in biodiversity surveys is a strong message. For all practical purposes, the creature does not exist. For story-telling and fantasy purposes, it can be imagined to exist.

All skeptics are left with is to observe the personalities and behaviors of those who profess to believe.
 
Some behavior for your perusal ...

LAL said:
Owen knew him personally and posted a statement from him.

I think we know what reporters do, sometimes.

I take Grover's own words over what someone says he said.
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WTF ? ! Nothing like contradicting yourself in one swell foop ...


Of course Lu has no problem posting pages of what reporters say, if it supports her point of view..


( exploding irony meter here )
 
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LAL said:
Well, I'm sorry you're disillusioned, but you might want to try to catch up rather than assuming there's nothing new. There's ongoing research and some of it's pretty intriguing.
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kitakaze said:
Such as? I'd really like to know.
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LAL said:
You know I'd really like to tell you. All I can say is, you probably won't find out about it on this board.
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Call me non-plus but IMHO I think this is just such a case of the type of thing that causes people to lose patience with you and write you off as being disingenuous, Lu. Makes me wonder if you really don't understand why some people get frustrated in the course of communication with you. Of course we've had the same exchange in different words more than once before.

You'd really like to tell me? Is that true? There's a handy pm feature if you don't feel like sharing it with everybody. I thought you don't make unsubstantiated claims but that's exactly what your doing here. What happened, when I came to the conclusion that bigfoot's existence was doubtful did lose access to the good stuff? You chide Ray for not being aware of some ongoing, intriguing research and when I respond with a sincere request to help me be aware you give the above answer. It's lame and more than a little frustrating. It exactly this type of behaviour that makes it very hard to root for bigfoot proponents.

Maybe what you should have said is something to the effect of "nevermind what I said, kitakaze. I was just trying to chide Ray. I'm not going to share whatever I was thinking of with you because I don't think you'll appreciate it the way I do. If you really want to pursue the matter all I am willing to say is that here is not the place that you will find what your looking for."
 
Here is a link to an interview of Alton Higgins by Melissa Hovey, Teresa Hall, and Kathy Strain on their podcast show Let's Talk Bigfoot.

Of particular interest is Higgins' responses to Kathy Strain raising the issue of Noll's use of a 650-pound elk's wrist in making comparisons to the Skookum cast. I listened to the show and took some notes on things that caught my interest.

Humourously and humbly Higgins referred to himself as a 'semi-scientist', made clear he was no expert on elks, and tried to impress that he doesn't consider himself to be of the same caliber as Meldrum.

- he said that he doesn't think there would be much difference in the size of the wrist if the elk was much heavier.

- he said he thinks an elk of the sufficient size to account for the 'heel' imprint would never have layed down in that spot and would be too wary.

- he thinks a lack of elk prints in the middle of the cast is compelling.

- he makes vague references to hair flow.

- he was under the impression that John Pickering provided Rick Noll with the elk wrist. Pickering was in the chat room during the interview and refuted that. It was agreed to put the point to Noll in next week's interview.

- he seems to confuse the casting artifact issue with the Skookum cast.

- he saw a large rendition of the Skookum cast in San Antonio and was underwhelmed by it. He felt it was not as impressive as the original. He was unsure whether or not it was a faithful rendition. I wonder why.

- he feels from hand prints that he has examined in Oklahoma that he doesn't agree with the idea of sasquatches having non-opposable thumbs facing the same orientation as the rest of the digits.

Anyone who wants to listen to the show and skip out the non-Skookum related discussion will find it in the middle part of the interview. I think it's great that Melissa and Teresa are doing this. Cheers to them.
 
Diogenes said:
Some behavior for your perusal ...


Originally Posted by LAL View Post
Owen knew him personally and posted a statement from him.

I think we know what reporters do, sometimes.

I take Grover's own words over what someone says he said.
Click to expand...


WTF ? ! Nothing like contradicting yourself in one swell foop ...


Of course Lu has no problem posting pages of what reporters say, if it supports her point of view..


( exploding irony meter here )
Click to expand...



I think LAL has filtered out Greg, so I'm quoting him so she can see this message.
 
kitakaze said:
Here is a link to an interview of Alton Higgins by Melissa Hovey, Teresa Hall, and Kathy Strain on their podcast show Let's Talk Bigfoot.

Humourously and humbly Higgins referred to himself as a 'semi-scientist', made clear he was no expert on elks, and tried to impress that he doesn't consider himself to be of the same caliber as Meldrum.
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His characterization of David Daegling is rather different:


"In my opinion, Daegling is an intellectual fraud masquerading as a purveyor of accuracy and truth.

I once knew a brilliant man, prominent and influential in some circles, who did many good things in his life. However, “Dr. M.” had a fatal flaw: he was a racist. Not the cross-burning kind but, rather, the prideful kind. Dr. M. was German, and he refused to accept the possibility that Germany committed atrocities during the war.

“There was no holocaust,” he said.

It didn’t matter that Jewish prisoners said they were there. It didn’t matter that American soldiers said they saw the death camps or the victims. He wasn’t impressed by the photographic evidence. He refused to accept the reality of the holocaust, period, insisting that the anecdotal accounts and “so-called evidence” were misinterpretations or fabrications, and that holocaust historians were perpetuating a gigantic hoax.

Daegling reminds me of Dr. M."

http://www.cryptomundo.com/bigfoot-report/big-thicket-bigfoot/

In the sixth comment response.

This of course, reminds me of "Godwin's Law":

http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/2.10/godwin.if_pr.html
 
tube said:
His characterization of David Daegling is rather different:


"In my opinion, Daegling is an intellectual fraud masquerading as a purveyor of accuracy and truth.

I once knew a brilliant man, prominent and influential in some circles, who did many good things in his life. However, “Dr. M.” had a fatal flaw: he was a racist. Not the cross-burning kind but, rather, the prideful kind. Dr. M. was German, and he refused to accept the possibility that Germany committed atrocities during the war.

“There was no holocaust,” he said.

It didn’t matter that Jewish prisoners said they were there. It didn’t matter that American soldiers said they saw the death camps or the victims. He wasn’t impressed by the photographic evidence. He refused to accept the reality of the holocaust, period, insisting that the anecdotal accounts and “so-called evidence” were misinterpretations or fabrications, and that holocaust historians were perpetuating a gigantic hoax.

Daegling reminds me of Dr. M."

http://www.cryptomundo.com/bigfoot-report/big-thicket-bigfoot/

In the sixth comment response.

This of course, reminds me of "Godwin's Law":

http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/2.10/godwin.if_pr.html
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Mm hmm, it didn't take Meldrum too long to bust a meme in his recent interview I linked. When asked by Melissa how he defines himself given three options including skeptic he promptly makes a Nazi comparison and does a dry Nazi impression while commenting on the irrationality of being a skeptic. It was about as funny as Martin Lawrence doing a 'look at me, I'm white' bit.

Oh crap! I'm suddenly very conscious of my new avatar... not. Seriously, making a comparison to holocaust deniers for not being inclined to accept a jumbo coffee, extra weak is pretty sad. If someone did it here I'd give them a link to the history section here so they can have a boo at a couple actual loony holocaust deniers. Denialists, even!

Oh crap!
 
William Parcher said:
Do you think they are helping to answer the question: "Does Bigfoot exist?"
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WP, that's a fantastic, infuriatingly straight-forward question and in a way puts me on the spot. Maybe it really only demands a simple 'yes' or 'no' response but when I tried to answer it last night I couldn't do it without wanting to go in depth a little. It made me sit in front of the computer far longer than I intended and eventually I deleted my response. I'm going to get back to it but tonight's a Saturday for me and time to step out.
 
Alton Higgins is a prestigious professor at Mid-America Christian University.

Sorry I guess I am not allowed to link at this point in my career



m
 
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