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Skeptics For 911 Truth

I'm toying with the idea of forming a new group, Skeptics For 911 Truth, closely affiliated with Scholars For 911 Truth and Justice and related groups. Anyone thought of doing something like this?
I'm trying to think of a good design for a banner.

I'm seeing a banner of a Truther being destroyed by the penetrating blows of a gang of JREF Ninja done like a video game, of course. Perhaps you could have him saying "Seven hijackers alive, ISI financing, controlled demolition, missile at the Pentagon", just as he gets beaten down, preferably by some sort of blunt instruments wielded by the Ninja. Maybe those nunchucks things.

That's my thought for the banner.
 
"Ali baba Osama and the 19 hijackers"
This is what you do best. Present the extremely sophisticated networks of Muslim warriors as compositions of patsies or subhumans. I can tell from this post that you are American. Only Americans actually believe that nobody 'subhuman' could ever be capable of crippling the mightiest nation on earth. The Japanese couldn't possibly find their way across the Pacific and destroy the American Pacific fleet. An "idiot" like Lee Harvey Oswald couldn't possibly be able to fire a weapon out of a window and kill a President. After all, America destroyed the Soviet Union, didn't it? And won both World Wars singlehandedly. Impossible, therefore, that 'cave-dwellers' could ever ever hate you enough to do something about it.
A slogan? What about a country choir singing "Stand by your Bush"?
Most of the people I've seen here actually don't care much for the guy.
 
Uncertainty in which official explanation? Among the 'official' explanations are testimony and research from:

FBI
NIST
SEC
FEMA
FDNY
Port Authority
9/11 Commission
NORAD
NEADS
FAA
GTE

That's not even an exhaustive list of 'official' contributors to our understanding of what happened on 9/11. In contrast, here's a list of professional organisations who have endorsed 'truther' alternatives:

<insert sound of crickets chirping here>

Hmmm--rather little uncertainty.

Uncertainty with all the official explanations I'm afraid, and there's been a few. But no we're not uncertain of the testimony, and it's when you stand that up against the official explanation that the problems start to occur, and this is where the uncertainty lies. It made me skeptical. And I think I should remain that way until I hear a better official explanation.
 
Scooby, can you list the parts of the official account you are skeptical about, together with the parts of the official account you are not skeptical about, please?

Ta very much.
 
This is what you do best. Present the extremely sophisticated networks of Muslim warriors as compositions of patsies or subhumans. I can tell from this post that you are American. Only Americans actually believe that nobody 'subhuman' could ever be capable of crippling the mightiest nation on earth. The Japanese couldn't possibly find their way across the Pacific and destroy the American Pacific fleet. An "idiot" like Lee Harvey Oswald couldn't possibly be able to fire a weapon out of a window and kill a President. After all, America destroyed the Soviet Union, didn't it? And won both World Wars singlehandedly. Impossible, therefore, that 'cave-dwellers' could ever ever hate you enough to do something about it.

Most of the people I've seen here actually don't care much for the guy.

Nonsense! We used both hands.:rolleyes:

Seriously it's people like that that i thought I was going to get banned from Canada for. A couple expressed shock that Canadians fought in WWII and I snapped. After the dressing down I gave them though some guy brought me and my fiancee a drink.
 
Uncertainty with all the official explanations I'm afraid, and there's been a few. But no we're not uncertain of the testimony, and it's when you stand that up against the official explanation that the problems start to occur, and this is where the uncertainty lies. It made me skeptical. And I think I should remain that way until I hear a better official explanation.
That's a good start. You are smart to be sceptical of appeals to authority.

If, for example, the SEC, FAA, NORAD, the Port Authority, NIST, Logan Airport security, and FEMA all told you that you better go ask Dick Cheney what really happened, then you better run for cover.

But they didn't.

The reason you're confused by uncertainty is because that's how the world actually works. You can "catch" anomalies because there isn't any conspiracy here. The FDNY isn't a pawn in some gigantic and incomprehensible neocon plan. Instead, it's a fire department.

That's the same reason you won't ever discover a consensus among your 'truther' friends. Alex Jones frequently contradicts Mike Ruppert. Gerard Holmgren's focus is entirely unlike Greg Palast's. Victor Thorn and Eric Hufschmid can't agree on much of anything. And then there's Chris Bollyn, who thinks that cops in Chicago are trying to kill him.

I think you know they're not conspiring. Just as you know the 'officials' aren't either.
 
C'mon are you guys already losing your faith?

In "Dubya and the holy goat" and "Ali baba Osama and the 19 hijackers"

I know these stories are sacred for you guys. You BELIEVE in them.

We sceptics on the other do not believe in them. It takes too much gullibility for that for our rational and sceptical minds. In short we don't have the stomach.

A slogan? What about a country choir singing "Stand by your Bush"?

Pagan.

Did Bush personally plants all the explosives inside WTC1?
Did Bush personally plant all the explosives inside WTC 2?
Did Bush personally plant all the explosives inside WTYC 7?
Did Bush personally hijack Flight 77 ?
Did Bush personally hijack Flight 93
Did Bush personally hijack Flight 11
Did Bush personally hijack Flight 175?
Did Bush personally rig all these planes with remote controls?
Did Bush personally fly Flight 77 over the Pentagon ?
Did Bush personally plant the black boxes from this flight at the Pentagon?
Did Bush personally plant the passengers body parts at the Pentagon ?
Did Bush personally plant the passengers personnel events at the pentagon?
Did Bush personally knock over the lamp posts at the Pentagon?
Did Bush personally shoot down flight 93?
Did Bush personally rig the crash sit at Shanksville to look at this plane crashed there?
Did Bush personally take the photograph of the smoke plume of flight 93?
Did Bush personally write the NIST report?
Did Bush personally write the 911 commissions report?
Did Bush personally plant evidence?
Did Bush personally remove evidence?
Did Bush personally fake evidence?
Did Bush personally make fake phone calls and pretend to be the passengers?
Did Bush personally fake the UBL confessions?
Did Bush personally fake all the evidence presented at the Moussiliou trial?
Did Bush personally remove all the steel at GZ and ship it off to China?
Did Bush personally order WTC 7 to be demolished?

And it goes on and on . The answer is no, somebody else did,according to you and your theories other people did this and much more. You can kid yourself all you like that everybody here is simply a Bush supporter but you are accusing many people of being involved in mass murder.

Even if you say , well he just ordered it, then somebody carried out his orders, somebody, many people are covering up those orders.

It means nothing to you, you are totally incapable of grasping this, it is beyond your limited scope of reasoning, I feel sorry for you, seriously.

You contribute nothing to this thread , as you equally contribute nothing to this forum. You simply keep parroting the same BS over and over again. Simply trying to take the moral high ground and say ¨hey look at me guys, I don’t like Bush and because you don’t agree with me you all love him ¨. Your arguments lack any credibility and simply show your utter childishness. Maybe just once could actually venture something substantial to a single thread, maybe just once you could actually act your age and not your shoe size. And maybe just once I will give a damm about what you think.
 
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"Ali baba Osama and the 19 hijackers"
This is what you do best. Present the extremely sophisticated networks of Muslim warriors as compositions of patsies or subhumans. I can tell from this post that you are American. Only Americans actually believe that nobody 'subhuman' could ever be capable of crippling the mightiest nation on earth.
Sadly, he is not an American, he is an European (from Scandinavia).

But he is the type of Europeans that distinguishes between "true Europeans" and other Europeans, if you see what I mean.
 
Sadly, he is not an American, he is an European (from Scandinavia).

That really surprises me.

Most non-Americans are not prone to underestimating threats from other venues. Is there some sort of gigantic neocon cabal involved with Palme's assassination? Why aren't non-Americans as concerned with 'uncertainty' in their own histories as they are with those of Americans? I live in Canada and I haven't seen nearly as many conspiracy theories governing the FLQ crisis in 1970. And our Prime Minister invoked the War Measures Act, a far more sweeping seizure of power than anything in the Patriot Acts in the USA.

But, oddly, the neocon cabal only blows up American buildings and leaves Canada and Sweden alone.

On the bright side, the black metal band Gorgororth is from Scandanavia so perhaps there's hope for pagan yet.
 
Forgetting the 'truth' for a minute, lets just talk about the official story - you see so much uncertainty when you look at the official explanation of that day. It makes me skeptical and I think as much of it should be removed as possible before I start deducing anything. Too many 'known unknowns' as they say.

I think the skeptics for 9-11 truth are on this forum, and they've already done the job you're proposing. Why don't you post a list of the uncertainties the skeptics for 9-11 truth should be investigating, and then they can point you to the results of the investigations they've already done? That was more or less the approach I took - although I found the information was so easy to find that I didn't need to ask - and it cleared up pretty well all of the uncertainties for me.

Dave
 
The only problem I see with Skeptics for 911 truth, is that the member page will be a document of about 1 Terabyte, in order to include everyone who doesn't think it was an inside jawb :D

EDIT: I thought that this was an organization for WE the skeptics.
 
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The only problem I see with Skeptics for 911 truth, is that the member page will be a document of about 1 Terabyte, in order to include everyone who doesn't think it was an inside jawb :D

EDIT: I thought that this was an organization for WE the skeptics.

Yeah how does that work exactly?
Who is 'we'?

I'm skeptical and I know it was an inside job - what went wrong on here?
 
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I think the skeptics for 9-11 truth are on this forum, and they've already done the job you're proposing. Why don't you post a list of the uncertainties the skeptics for 9-11 truth should be investigating, and then they can point you to the results of the investigations they've already done? That was more or less the approach I took - although I found the information was so easy to find that I didn't need to ask - and it cleared up pretty well all of the uncertainties for me.

Dave

No that would be bad science.
I wouldn't want to lead your investigations.

Give us the list you came up with all by yourselves - I'd be curious as to how it compares with other lists.

What are the skeptics top 10 problems with the official story?
 
scooby said:
Forgetting the 'truth' for a minute, lets just talk about the official story - you see so much uncertainty when you look at the official explanation of that day. It makes me skeptical and I think as much of it should be removed as possible before I start deducing anything. Too many 'known unknowns' as they say.
I think you've perfectly summarised actually why the government position is in fact the most reliable one. If the government's explanation was on the nose certain about every aspect, that's when you start smelling the BS. As in with the WMD intelligence!

What happened on 9/11 was that four planes were hijacked and crashed, three of them into buildings, two of them the largest skyscrapers in the world. The crashes all being deliberate and completely catastrophic, there are very few traces of the people who did it, or substantive evidence of precisely how they accomplished what they did. From lists of passengers you start with clues as to who they might have been, and this is confirmed from other evidence of their prior activities. Identifying the hijackers is actually one of the most impressive feats in the FBI's investigations of the day. But other than this, a great deal has to remain speculation. The skyscrapers fell. The reason for that is something that has to be investigated, for future building safety. But you can only provide a "most likely" explanation. The fact that the official cause of the collapse has changed from one model to a different one is in fact good news for regarding as much actual fact as possible having been discovered. Someone on another thread (Aphelion?) was questioning the fact that it seemed clear that WTC7 was going to collapse prior to it collapsing, and was asking for evidence one way or another. But this is a ridiculous expectation: WTC 7 was perfectly fine standing up prior to 9/11, and possibly would have stood for another century. Then 9/11 happened, and the skyscrapers fell, damaging other buildings in the vicinity, and starting fires in them. For some hours, then, WTC7 was in a precarious state, and some people reported that it was likely to fall. Then it fell. In terms of hard evidence, all we can say (who weren't there) is that one day it wasn't going to fall, then something happened, and then it fell. It's ridiculous, however, to ask for evidence of how likely it was to fall during the period it had been damaged, because we can't all go back in time and look at it. We can only rely on eyewitness testimony, and that can only talk about what seemed likely on the day.

Sure it is that nothing will be known for absolutely certain, and therein lies our surety that the government did not, in fact, murder 3000 of its own citizens in order to enter a botched war. (It used the murder of 3000 citizens to do so, but that's a different matter).
 
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Yeah how does that work exactly?
Who is 'we'?

I'm skeptical and I know it was an inside job - what went wrong on here?

You are not a skeptic, however. You are a denialist, or as we say around here: a "Truther", twoofer, troother, looser, conspiracist, or conspiracy theorist. Take an appropriate label.

Bastardizing the label of truth was bad enough, but now you want to take skeptic, too?

That kind of deception shows just how poor the entire argument is.
 
You are not a skeptic, however. You are a denialist, or as we say around here: a "Truther", twoofer, troother, looser, conspiracist, or conspiracy theorist. Take an appropriate label.

Bastardizing the label of truth was bad enough, but now you want to take skeptic, too?

That kind of deception shows just how poor the entire argument is.


Huh? You are the conspiracy theorist. You believe in the Bush adm. conspiracy theory. We don't, we are the sceptics.

The Bush adm conspiracy theory is what is on the table. Nothing else. We truthers use our critical faculties to debunk this conspiracy theory that you try to defend. You are the believer we are the sceptics.

Our debunking activities of this official theory has resulted in the conclusion that it is false on many accounts. So we have strong suspicions that it was an inside job.
But, we don't have any proofs who did it. To determine that we need further investigations.

You are mudding the waters here. The semantics is on our side. We are the sceptics, you are the believer in a conspiracy theory.
 
Huh? You are the conspiracy theorist. You believe in the Bush adm. conspiracy theory. We don't, we are the sceptics.

The Bush adm conspiracy theory is what is on the table. Nothing else. We truthers use our critical faculties to debunk this conspiracy theory that you try to defend. You are the believer we are the sceptics.

Our debunking activities of this official theory has resulted in the conclusion that it is false on many accounts. So we have strong suspicions that it was an inside job.
But, we don't have any proofs who did it. To determine that we need further investigations.

You are mudding the waters here. The semantics is on our side. We are the sceptics, you are the believer in a conspiracy theory.

You have a whole month to get nominated for the Stundie, pagan....pace yourself.
 
Huh? You are the conspiracy theorist. You believe in the Bush adm. conspiracy theory. We don't, we are the sceptics.

The Bush adm conspiracy theory is what is on the table. Nothing else. We truthers use our critical faculties to debunk this conspiracy theory that you try to defend. You are the believer we are the sceptics.

Our debunking activities of this official theory has resulted in the conclusion that it is false on many accounts. So we have strong suspicions that it was an inside job.
But, we don't have any proofs who did it. To determine that we need further investigations.

You are mudding the waters here. The semantics is on our side. We are the sceptics, you are the believer in a conspiracy theory.

Um, I don't give a rats crap what Bush says...

And the scientific explanation is not a conspiracy theory. Skeptic does not mean disbelieving everything you are told- mostly because of who is telling it to you- it means finding and accepting proof of wild claims. There is sufficient evidence to conclude that the scientific theory is correct. Denying that is not scientific- and it is not skepticism.
 

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