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Rectal Bacteria

I think there is a big difference in smell between animals that eat meat and those that don't. It's all about the undigested stuff. Undigested (rotting) plant matter doesn't stink as much as undigested (rotting) meat.

As a matter of fact, that's one of the ways a farmer can tell if they've got their feed mix right. If the cow/pig/chicken poo gets a heavy ammonia smell to it, there could be too much protein in the feed. They can't absorb it all, so it passes out in the poo.

So anyway, in my not very scientific sample size of one's opinion, if I were given a choice between mucking out the chicken coop vs a human outhouse, I'd head for the birdbarn without even thinking twice.

Sorry for the poopy derail there... back to e. coli.

Meg
 
meg said:
Undigested (rotting) plant matter doesn't stink as much as undigested (rotting) meat.
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That's subjective, and I think you're expanding your definition of "rotting" too far. The steak on my plate may not be alive any longer- they won't serve them to you that way any longer, more's the pity- and in some sense could be considered "rotting", it is yet pretty far from rotten, and smelling.
 
Piscivore said:
That's subjective, and I think you're expanding your definition of "rotting" too far. The steak on my plate may not be alive any longer- they won't serve them to you that way any longer, more's the pity- and in some sense could be considered "rotting", it is yet pretty far from rotten, and smelling.
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When I order filet mignon, in case "rare" doesn't capture the spirit of how I like it, I say "still mooing." As close to alive as possible. ;)
 
I'm confused, Piscivore. Are you saying that if something that is no longer alive gets kind of crushed and ground up with other no longer alive stuff, soaked in gastric acids which break it down a good deal, then spends another 12 to say 48 hours in a pretty warm, dampish place being attacked by microbes and bacteria that are further assisting its decomposition, that calling it "rotting" at that point is expanding the definition of the word too far?

By your terms, when does "rotting" begin?
 
meg said:
I'm confused, Piscivore. Are you saying that if something that is no longer alive gets kind of crushed and ground up with other no longer alive stuff, soaked in gastric acids which break it down a good deal, then spends another 12 to say 48 hours in a pretty warm, dampish place being attacked by microbes and bacteria that are further assisting its decomposition, that calling it "rotting" at that point is expanding the definition of the word too far?

By your terms, when does "rotting" begin?
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"Rotting", as applied to food, usually means the decomposition of an organic substance by bacteria. While the dictionary defines the word with "decomposition", digestion isn't typically listed as a synonym to either word. The key difference here is what is doing the breaking down of the food and who utilises the materials and energy that are the products of that break down. If the process you describe occurs within and by the appropriate human organs and the body associated with those organs utilises the products of that process, I feel it is disingenuous to call that "rotting". If the exact same process were to occur in the dumpster behind Arby's, not so much.

It's the difference between a car being taken apart to be recycled and one that rusts out in the junkyard.
 
meg said:
I think there is a big difference in smell between animals that eat meat and those that don't. It's all about the undigested stuff. Undigested (rotting) plant matter doesn't stink as much as undigested (rotting) meat.
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I would think that the poop smell is directly tied to the E.coli in the intestines. The short chain molecules that are oderific would have been absorbed by the gut if it was from the gastric enzymes. It would have to be produced later in the large intestine/colon.
 
I was raised on a farm across from a dairy. My experiences are purely anecdotal and subjective so take them as you will.

This is a subject that comes up frequently with farmers and from my experience there is no controversy to the list. My family raised chickens and rabbits and I worked at the dairy and had friends with horses and pigs. I've mucked out pens, coops, cages and barns. IMO, From least offensive to worst.
  1. Horse
  2. Cow
  3. Human
  4. Chicken
  5. Pig
For the record, 4 & 5 are orders of magnitude worse than the rest.
 
Ok Piscivore, I get what you're saying. However, wouldn't you say that as soon as it exits the digestive system of said cow/pig/chicken/human and is deposited, say on a sunny spot on the lawn, that the undigested bits contained within said package are now "rotting"?

I would agree with your ranking of stinkiness of barnyard doo, RandFan. I would put human last/worst, though.
 
RandFan said:
I was raised on a farm across from a dairy. My experiences are purely anecdotal and subjective so take them as you will.

This is a subject that comes up frequently with farmers and from my experience there is no controversy to the list. My family raised chickens and rabbits and I worked at the dairy and had friends with horses and pigs. I've mucked out pens, coops, cages and barns. IMO, From least offensive to worst.
  1. Horse
  2. Cow
  3. Human
  4. Chicken
  5. Pig
For the record, 4 & 5 are orders of magnitude worse than the rest.
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I don't know much about the topic, and certainly defer to your superior shitpertise. But, I've worked in confined chicken houses (on a kibbutz in Israel), and I can't see chickenpoo being worse than human.
 
meg said:
Ok Piscivore, I get what you're saying. However, wouldn't you say that as soon as it exits the digestive system of said cow/pig/chicken/human and is deposited, say on a sunny spot on the lawn, that the undigested bits contained within said package are now "rotting"?
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Okay, but with the caveat that the odor of rotting meat would be incidental and particular to the feces of the animal in question, and not part of the normal biological workings of said creature. The waste product of a normally operating carnivore's digestive tract is not meat. If someone or something has a signifigant amount of undigested material in their feces there is a problem, as I understand it.

ETA: And the smell of rotting meat being worse than the smell of rotting plants is still a subjective judgement.
 
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RandFan said:
I was raised on a farm across from a dairy. My experiences are purely anecdotal and subjective so take them as you will.

This is a subject that comes up frequently with farmers and from my experience there is no controversy to the list. My family raised chickens and rabbits and I worked at the dairy and had friends with horses and pigs. I've mucked out pens, coops, cages and barns. IMO, From least offensive to worst.
  1. Horse
  2. Cow
  3. Human
  4. Chicken
  5. Pig
For the record, 4 & 5 are orders of magnitude worse than the rest.
Click to expand...

I grew up on a farm and raised those animals and more. And we had an outhouse (just so we didn't have to go all the way back to the house when we were working). That list is accurate. Ducks and geese are similar to chicken. Sheep fall in between cow and human (maybe between cow and horse). Rabbits are less offensive than horses.

Linda
 
To go back to the original point made, baby's poo changes with both an adoption of microflora AND a change in diet. The first couple of defecations are made of a substance which coats the inside of the digestive tract whilst it's in utero, something called 'meconium'.

The first intestinal discharge from newborns is meconium, which is a viscous, dark green substance composed of intestinal epithelial cells, lanugo, mucus, and intestinal secretions, such as bile. Intestinal secretions, mucosal cells, and solid elements of swallowed amniotic fluid are the 3 major solid constituents of meconium. Water is the major liquid constituent, making up 85-95% of meconium. Intrauterine distress can cause passage into the amniotic fluid. Factors that promote the passage in utero include placental insufficiency, maternal hypertension, preeclampsia, oligohydramnios, and maternal drug abuse, especially of tobacco and cocaine. Meconium-stained amniotic fluid may be aspirated during labor and delivery, causing neonatal respiratory distress. Because meconium is rarely found in the amniotic fluid prior to 34 weeks' gestation, meconium aspiration chiefly affects infants at term and postterm.
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http://www.emedicine.com/ped/topic768.htm

Athon
 
Just to add fuel to the fire, I've heard that feces is 1/3 undigested food, 1/3 live bacteria, and 1/3 dead bacteria. My guess is that the smell is most likely from the rotting bacteria, since it is nothing like the way rhe food smelled on it's way in, and I doubt if the live bacteria smell- why would they, to attract mates?
 
Some odors in poop come from what is eaten however I think bacteria produce the majority of stinky things in poo (indoles, skatoles and hydrogen sulfide)
 
Piscivore said:
Would that be bits of actual whole food, or the undigestible/unusable leftover components of the food?
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Unless you have some kind of absorption problem, Undigestible bits, I assume. Like fiber/bulk/roughage. I don't think that estimate is good for horses, whose intestinal fauna digest cellulose, but not all of it.

Somebody up-thread said the bacterias don't contribute to digestion, but that's not true. True, humans don't have the critters that cows have to digest cellulose, but we do have many that do neccessary processes. Like yeasts that make B vitamins. Or lacto-bacillus that digest milk components. Ever know anybody that needed to take one of those strong intestinal anti-biotics? Flagyl, I think is one. It probably took them months to get their digestion back to normal after killing everything inside.
 
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