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Loose Change - Part IV

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I can't enlighten you about the time discrepancy, but I see the claim is that the first set of seismic data arises from explosions in the WTC basement. If that was the case, do we not then we need three sets of seismic data?; one for the explosions, one for the plane impact and one for the towers collapsing.

As far as I'm aware, we only have two and I would ascribe them to impact and collapse because the fact that these events occurred cannot be disputed, except by hologram nuts.

this was actually discussed elsewhere in this marathon (ok, multi-marathon) series of threads.
Just like any wave traveling through a medium, siesmic waves take TIME to travel from point A to point B.
Somebody pointed out that the discrepancy is exactly that time a seismic wave take to travel the distances from the towers to the nearest seismograph sensor.
No, I'm not going to do your research for you. This is typical of the "Ok, they refuted that evidence thouroghly. We'll leave it alone till they've forgotten about it, and bring it back again..and again..and again" BS that the CT'er use instead of valid arguments. Wear 'em down by asking the same thing over and over and over...
 
Interesting new thread. A new pilot checks in..with a rather familiar sounding name..and begins posting in support of the CT...this after Bizilla's thread has apparently been removed from the Board and you cannot find him listed in the Membership section...

Methinks I smell a rat...

Link: http://s15.invisionfree.com/Loose_Change_Forum/index.php?showtopic=9814
Billzillas thread is still there: http://s15.invisionfree.com/Loose_Change_Forum/index.php?showtopic=7660&st=0

Unless you're thinking of a different one.
 
I thought the same but didn't want to mention it here and blow his cover. You know, in case anyone actually didn't see through it after he gets a few posts in.
Quite amazing how only one person (excluding johndoex) noticed that his name was similar to johndoeX. Bonez' reply was the best:
Welcome to the forums. We have a few pilots here and one of our admins, johndoex, also happens to be a pilot.

Did he even check the name of the person he was replying to? Jondox and johndoex, I noticed it the first second I saw it.
 
Roger @ LC said:
"How come it is so easy to turn off a transponder from the cockpit when they have to be used all the time?"

jondox @ LC said:
I dont know how they did that. Maybe they just switched it off.
Either way its clear that the government are lying through their teeth about what really happened to that transponder and it makes my blood boil.
Did anyone else hear a very loud "woooooosh" sound just then?
I think something just went right over their heads...
 

From that link:

The standards and technology institute, and many mainstream scientists, won't debate conspiracy theorists, saying they don't want to lend them unwarranted credibility.

I believe they are wrong. I think at some point the international scientific community should step up and confront these theorists once and for all, and let people know what a parodie of science these CTers idiots are. I think the science world is being too kind to them. Let's stop being politically correct for once and let's beat the crap out of them. They certainly deserve the humiliation.
 
From that link:



I believe they are wrong. I think at some point the international scientific community should step up and confront these theorists once and for all, and let people know what a parodie of science these CTers idiots are. I think the science world is being too kind to them. Let's stop being politically correct for once and let's beat the crap out of them. They certainly deserve the humiliation.
It won't do a bit of good. The CTists would just shrug it off and call them shills.
 
It won't do a bit of good. The CTists would just shrug it off and call them shills.

But they can't all call them shills. I mean, there's an entire international scientific world that agrees with the official reports on 9/11.
 
But they can't all call them shills. I mean, there's an entire international scientific world that agrees with the official reports on 9/11.
See what you've done there is assumed that CTs obey laws of logic, when this is clearly not the case. They'll call them all shills, unless they're French, in which case they'll call them cheese easting surrender shills.
 
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sometimes I think maybe your right. I mean if CNN and the big media networks ignore Fetzer much longer, I swear his head will just explode (have you seen the guy get mad, he looks like his blood pressure is about 280/180).
 
I'm not sure how relevant this will be to the discussion, but I mentioned this before and now I have some pics. This is the Comcast Tower presently being built in Philadelphia. When it is is finished it will be the tallest building in Philadelphia, beating out 2 decade champ Liberty Place.

Why is this relevant? Well, the design of this building is such that it will be Airplane-proof. Not 'hit at low speed by accident'-proof, but 'rammed by psycho-terrorists at high speed'-proof. This involves a LOT of concrete to make that core, so much in fact that contractors away from the job are having a hard time getting concrete for other projects. (Note to a certain kook: Rebar does not seem to be in use.)

Why do I bring it up? Well it seems like a lot of effort for something that CTers claim cannot happen without explosives.

[qimg]http://i55.photobucket.com/albums/g157/kookbreaker/ComcastTower3.jpg[/qimg]

[qimg]http://i55.photobucket.com/albums/g157/kookbreaker/ComcastTower2.jpg[/qimg]

[qimg]http://i55.photobucket.com/albums/g157/kookbreaker/ComcastTower1.jpg[/qimg]

Excellent point. I have noted at SLC that there are numerous code changes that have come out of the investigation into the collapses of the WTC Towers.
 
sometimes I think maybe your right. I mean if CNN and the big media networks ignore Fetzer much longer, I swear his head will just explode (have you seen the guy get mad, he looks like his blood pressure is about 280/180).

It's amusing and revealing that these guys get covered mostly on conservative outlets--Fox News instead of CNN, Laura Ingraham and not Al Franken, etc. I think sane liberals are all petrified that this will catch on with their base and just discredit them, while of course the conservative outlets are hoping for just that result.
 
In case you guys haven't seen this AP article:
Five years after the terrorist attacks, a community that believes widely discredited ideas about what happened on Sept. 11, 2001, persists and even thrives. Members trade their ideas on the Internet and in self-published papers and in books. About 500 of them attended a recent conference in Chicago.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060806...jMh_0as0NUE;_ylu=X3oDMTA3MjBwMWtkBHNlYwM3MTg-

It's nice they didn't take a "balanced" approach, but it's unfortunate circumstances are such that the article had to be written in the first place.

ETA It also goes to show we've been fighting the right people all along. The story reads like a laundry list of our usual suspects.
 
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Why is this relevant? Well, the design of this building is such that it will be Airplane-proof. Not 'hit at low speed by accident'-proof, but 'rammed by psycho-terrorists at high speed'-proof.

Not sure where this low speed claim keeps popping up but it doesn't appear to be true.

The NIST NCSTAR 1-1 (Design, Construction, and Maintenance of Structural and Life Safety Systems) report states:
A three-page document from the Port Authority of New York and New Jersey (PANYNJ or Port Authority) indicates that the impact of a Boeing 707 aircraft flying at 600 mph was analyzed during the design stage of the WTC towers in Februrary/March 1964.

600mph is not low speed for a 707. Also note that the report did no analysis on a fueled plane, nor the effects of the fuel. The NIST report did. You'll also note that the towers did indeed survive the impact.

(Note to a certain kook: Rebar does not seem to be in use.)
Some sort of reinforcement would be required. Rebar is probably being used, you just don't see it. Note that they are building the core before the building. This would be standard, and opposite of what a certain kook claims.

Why do I bring it up? Well it seems like a lot of effort for something that CTers claim cannot happen without explosives.

WTC was a combined conspiracy between the military and concrete companies. One to start a war in Iraq, the other to sell more concrete.
 
Not sure where this low speed claim keeps popping up but it doesn't appear to be true.
im not sure either, if you watch the NOVA special Why The Towers Fell the head designer for the towers talks about how it was designed to withstand a 707 at full speed

he also goes on to talk about how they lacked the ability to model the jet fuel fires at the time, so they pretty much had to ignore it
 
I'm having major computer problems, but let's see if I can get through this post.

Abby, realitybites and I had another successful confrontation with the Ground Zeros yesterday. A particularly virulent strain of truther was out in force. These people really have to be seen to be believed. (Speaking of which, we could really use help. It's tough to compete when they outnumber us 4 to 1.) Several of them are completely batcrap crazy. Abby has a funny story about being mistaken for a truther, although it doesn't involve firemen. A Finnish camera crew was there for a while, and a reporter for U.S. News and World Report spent several hours observing and interviewing for a story on the 5th anniversary of the attacks.

Some highlights:
A crazy old truther lady tore a handful of our flyers out of Reality's hand and tore them up.

While we weren't looking, someone (I'm guessing the above nutter, because she disappeared after that) pulled several of our signs off the wall and threw them into a construction area. (I recovered them.)

I was told that no one could take me seriously because of the shoes I was wearing. I was wearing sports sandals, which served me well on the 8-mile walk I took afterwards. My critic was wearing heavy boots, on a hot day, and did not appear capable of walking far.

A tiny shrill woman demanded that I answer her question about WTC 7, and when I started to speak and show her the relevant photos and quotes I had, she immediately said that if I continued she was going to get the police and file a harrassment complaint against me. Honest.

Two truthers, including Les, the leader, said they had conclusive proof of explosives in the towers, and demanded that I refute it. They fired up a laptop and showed me a CNN video of the south tower collapsing. They were flummoxed by my response: "That's just a video of the south tower collapsing. That's your proof?" Then they left the laptop in the sun, where it died of heat stroke.

Truther Tom Foti had an ingenious plan: wherever I went, he would stand in front of me. If that happened in any other situation I would stop it, but at Ground Zero, it's exactly what I want. The more attention I can get from the truthers, the less they can interact with the public. Tom's plan suffered from some other flaws:
- His own people thought it was stupid.
- He bumped and frightened others with his leaping and gyrating to stay in front of me. ( I was using people as "picks.")
- He is short. See pics below.

I asked Les why he hadn't brought the six-pack of beer that I had won from him on a bet. The bet was that he used a photo of WTC 7 in his former pamphlet that he claimed was the tiny rubble left by WTC 7. And the comment next to the photo was "Photos don't lie, governments do." In reality, the photo was of rubble from WTC 1 and 6, and WTC 7 is clearly standing right there next to it. Les swore that he knows what photos he uses and that wasn't one of them. Abby alertly noticed what I had not: that the photo also appears in the current pamphlet, the ones Les was handing out! Beer is promised for next week. It should be two six-packs, since he was wrong twice.

I kept trying to introduce myself to the most verbose of the troof preachers, who I hadn't seen before, but he would'nt even look at me, much less shake my hand. But at the end of the day he came up to me and snarled, "I know exactly who you are! I know who you work for! I can see into your soul, and you are in trouble! You are in deep trouble!"

If anyone knows of people who might be wlling to hand out pamphlets at Ground Zero on Saturday afternoons, let me know. We can definitely use the help, and it's a fascinating experience.

Photo of realitybites would appear here, but I don't have his permission yet.

879044d68c1ad1f0a.jpg



Ma-ma-ma-myyyy Remora! Note the "7 Hijackers Still Alive" poster.
879044d68c1b473f6.jpg

edit: photo
 
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Great stuff gravy.

Boy I'm gone on vacation for a week and It seems like there are hundreds of new posts to read. Hopefully I'll be catching up in the next day or so.
 
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