Marriage Poll

[hammegk]

A favorite pc'lib mantra ... "bigoted". Which means, "you are not allowed to think and certainly not say that because us pc'libs know better" -- and it isn't "nice".

As mentioned recently elsewhere, a pc'lib's interest in "convincing by logic" is not often shared by the target of his blather. Most targets are more polite than I and don't call one an Ass until one has left.



"Racist" is a good one, too. Or try "homophobe" ... got a nice solid ring to it. "Sexist" just sounds silly.

 

[thaiboxerken]

Hammy, people that hate homosexuals are bigots. Get that through your thin skull.

 

[Piggy]

I can't select a poll choice b/c the liberal-moderate-conservative spectrum is bogus and dangerous.

But it seems to me that the gov't should get out of the marriage racket altogether. Let 'em all be civil unions in the eyes of the state and leave marriage to the church.

I know that's not gonna fly, but that's my feeling.

I will say, tho, that the arguments I've heard from the same-sex-only crowd have been mostly nonsensical.

Dubya struts up to the mic and says we have to define marriage as "one man, one woman" because same-sex marriage will "weaken the good influence" of the institution, but never says why this should be so. If he's right that marriage "promotes the welfare of children and the stability of society", then we should extend marriage, not limit it.

If I ever get married, it'll be a one-man/one-woman marriage. But if same-sex couples want to get married, that wouldn't affect my marriage one bit. My marriage would not need to be "defended" by declaring it the only kind of marriage allowable.

Evangelical leaders are continually calling gays and lesbians on the carpet for their "lifestyle" which, they claim, lacks stability and commitment and promotes promiscuity. Yet they fight tooth and nail to deny same-sex couples the primary means, in our society, for creating and maintaining stable and commited relationships -- the contract of marriage.

The fact is, our legal system places a host of rights and obligations under the umbrella of the marriage contract. It is entirely impractical to expect certain minority groups to seek these piecemeal.

If marriage is a good thing -- and I think it is, generally, although probably not a good idea for me -- then let's have more of it.

And the best way to do that is to finally separate the religious institution from the secular one. Let churches marry whom they will. But let the state grant the right of marriage to all consenting adults who willingly enter into it.

 

[SezMe]

What Piggy said.

 

[hammegk]

Hammy, people that hate homosexuals are bigots.

And?

Get that through your thin skull.

Post reported.

 

[hammegk]

But it seems to me that the gov't should get out of the marriage racket altogether.

Yup. Right after they get taxation, govt benefits, etc not being a function of marital state.

grant the right of marriage to all consenting adults who willingly enter into it.

Not until the fix mentioned above is implemented.

 

[Piggy]

Or anywhere else the majority of responders are in touch with reality.

You do much hanging out in Alabama trailer parks, hemmegk? Let me assure you, they are rife with superstition, conspiracy theory, narrow-mindedness, bigotry, rumor, and armageddon. That's not to say that everyone in the working-class South is out of touch with reality. But if you think the working-class South generally has an informed, realistic view of the world, you got another think coming.

And as a bona fide cracker, whose mother was born in Alabama and who has plenty of family there, I have every right to say so.

 

[hammegk]

Peggy, I fear you missed my point.

 

[Piggy]

Peggy, I fear you missed my point.

Well put down your fear, brother, and proclaim your point so that I may understand.

But don't call me Peggy. I agree to not call you hemmegk.

 

[Piggy]

OK, hamme, I think I grok it now. But that being the case, I reckon you've missed thaiboxerken's point.

 

[Meadmaker]

But it seems to me that the gov't should get out of the marriage racket altogether.

And every other racket, too! Let's have a society where everyone is free to speak his mind. Of course, we can't all speak at once. I have this conch shell..............

 

[clarsct]

Let em marry.

Me? Well..politically I am all over the damned board. I am a conservatively moderate liberal.

I think that people on welfare should have to help maintain the ground of parks and public buildings. Plant flowers, pick up trash and whatnot. I think That we ought to limit our spending so as to be within our means as a country. I think all education should be free, college and otherwise. I believe we ought to have national healthcare. I think we ought to cut foreign aid to other countries. I believe in deportation and exile of career criminals. I believe that anyone wishing to immigrate into this country ought to serve in our military first, as a requirement. I am pro-choice and pro-euthanasia, in certain cases. I believe we should have gone into Afganistan, but not Iraq. I am dissappointed in our govenrment's performance in both cases, but wholeheartedly support the men and women over there trying to do the impossible. I think Bush is an idiot. I suspect we went over to Iraq for the interests of the oil companies. I think we ought to give drug offenders the choice to go to the military or prison. I think we ought to offer counseling for people with real mental health issues, as part of a national healthcare system.


I think that gay marriage is a non-issue and a line ought to be drawn between religious marriage and secular marriage. I think that trying to define marriage in a religious way is a direct violation of church and state. Who the HELL gave you the right to decide what a f'kin marriage is?!

Well, I'm just ranting now, but I didn't vote because I'm unsure of my political views as far as left-center-right. Maybe someone could inform me.


Thanks for reading/listening.

 

[Upchurch]

Or anywhere else the majority of responders are in touch with reality.

What does that even mean? Marriage is a human construct. There is no absolute definition of marriage. What exactly do you think it is you're touching?

But I'd have to agree that, in the US anyway, a slim majority of people appear to disagree with SSM. As has been pointed out else where, this majority mostly lies mostly in the older generations, which will eventually die off. You want reality, hammegk? The reality is that the general acceptance of homosexuality as a legitimate, non-shameful aspect of the human condition is merely a matter of time.

 

[KelvinG]

My judgement as to its' morality does not underly my belief that private behaviors that become public are subject to public approval or censure, and that may work to those detriment of those who so publicize. Why one chooses to approve or censure is their business, not yours.

Yes, private behaviours that become public will be scrutinized and judged by the general population. But, whether you like it or not, homosexual behaviour will (and is) becoming more and more acceptable.
As much as clueless cons loathe to admit it, liberalism inevitably prevails over time and provides much deserved rights to oppressed groups.
Right now arguments against homosexuals seem logical in the mind of the conservative the same way arguments in favour of segregation seemed logical to them 50 years ago.
Of course, now that time has passed the concept of segregation seems ludicirous. It's absolutely inevitable the same thing will happen when it comes to gay rights.
This drives you types crazy, because you know there is nothing you can do about it.

But, don't worry hammegk. In your lifetime you'll always be able to find safe havens where them dirty fags won't dare hold hands in public.
Of course, your children might not be so lucky.

 

[wastepanel]

I'm moderate, religious, and for SSM. I don't understand how we as a nation/culture can deprive others of priveleges we take for granted such as:

mutual health benefits
probate (if die without will)
family status (for hospital visits and other)
taxation benefits
Social Security

There are probably several other benefits I'm probably missing as well. I understand if a church does not want to marry two guys (or girls) (They do have that right.), but I don't understand how the government can take that postion.

EDIT: Upon further thinking, I also feel that being against SSM for "moral" reasons is silly. If it is immoral to have sex out of wedlock, then you are saying that being against SSM means that homosexuality itself should not be allowed either.

PS. I guess I'm even kookier than most religious...I'm for same sex marriage, and against ID or any theological thought taught in science class.

 

[KelvinG]

PS. I guess I'm even kookier than most religious...I'm for same sex marriage, and against ID or any theological thought taught in science class.

No, not kooky. Just endowed with common sense!

 

[Piggy]

I'd have to agree that, in the US anyway, a slim majority of people appear to disagree with SSM.

Where I live, the majority is about as slim as Mama Cass.

Also, there was an editorial in the local rag last week, quoted on page 1, opining that when a US President feels compelled to publicly proclaim that marriage should be reserved for "one man and one woman", it is a reflection of the horrible moral state our country is in right now.

 

[Blue Mountain]

All over the political map

I think that people on welfare should have to help maintain the ground of parks and public buildings. Plant flowers, pick up trash and whatnot. I think That we ought to limit our spending so as to be within our means as a country. I think all education should be free, college and otherwise. I believe we ought to have national healthcare. I think we ought to cut foreign aid to other countries. I believe in deportation and exile of career criminals. I believe that anyone wishing to immigrate into this country ought to serve in our military first, as a requirement. I am pro-choice and pro-euthanasia, in certain cases. I believe we should have gone into Afganistan, but not Iraq. I am dissappointed in our govenrment's performance in both cases, but wholeheartedly support the men and women over there trying to do the impossible. I think Bush is an idiot. I suspect we went over to Iraq for the interests of the oil companies. I think we ought to give drug offenders the choice to go to the military or prison. I think we ought to offer counseling for people with real mental health issues, as part of a national healthcare system.

Are you from Canada?

As for me, I'm for same-sex marriage, for pretty much all the reasons enumerated to now in this thread. In no way do I see my parents' marriage (now in its 51st year) threatened by letting two guys or two gals marry each other. (No more than it was threatened by Brittany's 52-hour fling, with a member of the opposite sex, no less!)

 

[SezMe]

So, Papa Funkosophy, have you drawn any conclusions from your research so far?

 

[rjh01]

I know I do not visit politics forum much, but for the non-USA people can you please define conservative, moderate and liberal or say this is only for USA people?