The questions would be along the lines of “are you a ◊◊◊◊◊◊◊ idiot?”
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Australia's Gun Problem
- Thread starter arthwollipot
- Start date
theprestige
Penultimate Amazing
All questions will be awkward, because self defense is explicitly not a valid reason in Australia.
On the other hand, if you tell them you're a collector, they won't ask you any questions at all.
But you still can't use it to defend yourself.
arthwollipot
Limerick Purist Pronouns: He/Him
My contributions. I thought you said I was taking the entire thread somewhere. But that's okay.
"Under what situations do you expect to be needing to kill someone?"
Not true. You'll get plenty of questions - questions about how many you have, how they are stored, whether they are in usable condition or not, and probably some quite interesting questions about any historical pieces you might have.
You still need to apply for a license if you're collecting, and it's not a no-questions-asked process.
theprestige
Penultimate Amazing
I don't think you have the kind of influence that you can "take" a thread anywhere on this forum.
arthwollipot
Limerick Purist Pronouns: He/Him
Thank you. Neither do I.
theprestige
Penultimate Amazing
"Why do you want a gun licence?"
"I'm a collector."
"Thats all right then. Here's your licence. Is there anything else I can help you with?"
Such questions.
arthwollipot
Limerick Purist Pronouns: He/Him
And you speak about the process of obtaining a gun license in Australia with what authority?
You're starting to look deliberately ignorant.
theprestige
Penultimate Amazing
I don't live in Australia. There's probably a lot I don't know about the process of obtaining a gun licence there.
Are there any important questions I'm overlooking? Maybe awkward questions?
arthwollipot
Limerick Purist Pronouns: He/Him
So why do you ◊◊◊◊◊◊◊◊ with such feigned authority?
Are you asking me to quote the specific questions that the officer in charge of approving a collector's license ask? What makes you think I, of all people, will have gone through that process?
It's your ◊◊◊◊◊◊◊◊ framing of the process as "no questions asked" (post #486) that should be questioned here. Why are you invested in pushing that particular narrative?
theprestige
Penultimate Amazing
More like casually ignorant. It's not like I'm planning on ever getting a gun in Australia.
In my experience, Australian gun laws are mostly rhetorical expressions of national chauvinism. It's probably different for someone who lives there.
theprestige
Penultimate Amazing
If you think I gave a bad answer to the question, you could always give your own, better answer.
I'm not asking, but it would be nice.
How would you, of all people, know what the questions are? It's not like you've gone through the process.
The Atheist
Psychopath
- Joined
- Jul 3, 2006
- Messages
- 37,914
FFS, seriously?
Number one would be "Why have you not reported a threat to the police?"
Then, you'd move on to "Why do you think owning a gun will help you, given that the law specifically states you can't?"
Maybe you're operating on the mistaken assumption that you turn up and ask for a licence? In the real world, you have to pass a theory test as you do for a vehicle before you get to first base.
Do you understand now?
Also, this:
...are pointless and simply JAQing off.
Read what I posted above and use a teeny bit of thought and you'll be fine.
Andy_Ross
Penultimate Amazing
- Joined
- Jun 2, 2010
- Messages
- 84,135
In the UK you have to show a need.
That is usually sports. You have to show you are already participating, usually by already being a member of a shooting club and participating in club events. Clubs usually have guns for new members to use.
Shotguns are different, there is requirement to show a need, it's up to the police to show why you shouldn't own one.
That is usually sports. You have to show you are already participating, usually by already being a member of a shooting club and participating in club events. Clubs usually have guns for new members to use.
Shotguns are different, there is requirement to show a need, it's up to the police to show why you shouldn't own one.
Do you seriously think the questioning would stop there? You really must think that Australian police are stupid.
The response would not be “that’s all right then” but “what sort of gun do you want for your collection?” And “tell me about the guns you have in your collection?” If the answer to either question is “a semi-automatic” out the door for you.
But even you want a shot gun, which can be legally owned, you would need more than “I’m a collector” as a reason. It would not pass muster in Australia.
One of the criteria for getting a collector’s licence:
ABLIS | Enabling business
ABLIS helps you find the government licences, permits, approvals, registrations, codes of practice, standards and guidelines you need to know about to meet your compliance responsibilities.
Police are not stupid in Australia.
Thermal
August Member
If you're dealing with "some nutter" that attacks people with guns while unarmed, I've got some bad news for you- he would probably tear your throat out with his teeth if you were unarmed. The overwhelming majority of criminals are not raving psychotics, and want to live to victimize another day.
In my most humble of opinions, bad guys are more bark than bite. They dont want a gunfight or the attention that gunfire will draw, they want your cash. If they can't get it easily, they will retreat fast. Bluffing really is a thing.
P.artially agreed. Not so much for legit self defense, but when people carry as a preferred method of conflict resolution, nothing but bad happens.
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Thermal
August Member
Over here in the US, we trust the police about the same as the average mugger. I won't call them for much, because I've rarely seen a situation improve when they showed up. Usually got worse for all involved, and whoever you called them about walks Scot-free, and now he *really* has it out for you.
Hm. I guess I assumed criminal gangs were pretty much criminal gangs all over? The MM is... a gang with a heart of gold?
I mean I guess I can see that in a way. Our local thugs look out for the locals in a way that the Police don't.
theprestige
Penultimate Amazing
I try not to think of Australian police as a single monolithic bloc.Do you seriously think the questioning would stop there? You really must think that Australian police are stupid.
The response would not be “that’s all right then” but “what sort of gun do you want for your collection?” And “tell me about the guns you have in your collection?” If the answer to either question is “a semi-automatic” out the door for you.
But even you want a shot gun, which can be legally owned, you would need more than “I’m a collector” as a reason. It would not pass muster in Australia.
One of the criteria for getting a collector’s licence:
ABLIS | Enabling business
ABLIS helps you find the government licences, permits, approvals, registrations, codes of practice, standards and guidelines you need to know about to meet your compliance responsibilities.ablis.business.gov.au
Police are not stupid in Australia.
Also I'm a little confused. From what you're saying, it doesn't sound like it's up to the police at all. They're just doing what the law commands. Their questioning wouldn't be any more smart or stupid than the law that mandates it.
If the law allowed collecting semi-automatic firearms, even the smartest cop wouldn't have a way to deny the license on that basis. In general, I expect Australian cops are no smarter or stupider than the laws they have to enforce. So it doesn't really make sense to credit them with intelligence that isn't really of their own making.
Also, the cultural terror of shotguns is hilarious. It's not so much that Australians have strict gun laws, but that they're so precious about it.
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arthwollipot
Limerick Purist Pronouns: He/Him
The actual ◊◊◊◊?
arthwollipot
Limerick Purist Pronouns: He/Him
He clearly thinks all Australians are stupid.
Talk about a case of national chauvinism.
arthwollipot
Limerick Purist Pronouns: He/Him
The Commissioner has considerable discretion over whether to issue a license.
Firearms Act 1996 (NSW) Section 8:
11 General restrictions on issue of licences (cf 1989 Act s 25, APMC 4, 5, 6)
(1) The Commissioner may issue a licence in respect of an application, or refuse any such application. (2) A licence must not be issued until after the end of the period of 28 days following the day on which the application is made.
(2A) Subsection (2) does not apply if the application is for the renewal of a licence (including the renewal of a category A or B licence that involves the addition of either of those licence categories to the previous licence).
(3) A licence must not be issued unless—
(a1) the Commissioner is satisfied the applicant’s identity has been verified, and
(a)
the Commissioner is satisfied that the applicant is a fit and proper person and can be trusted to have possession of firearms without danger to public safety or to the peace, and
(b) in the case of a person who has never held a licence (including a firearms licence under a previous Act), the applicant has completed, to the satisfaction of the Commissioner, such firearms training and safety courses as are prescribed by the regulations in respect of the licence concerned, and
(c) the Commissioner is satisfied that the storage and safety requirements set out in Part 4 are capable of being met by the applicant, and
(d) the Commissioner is satisfied that the person to whom the licence is to be issued is a resident of this State or is about to become a resident of this State.
(3A) Despite subsection (3) (b), the Commissioner may require an applicant for a licence to complete such firearms training and safety courses as are approved by the Commissioner in relation to the category of licence concerned.
(4) Without limiting the generality of subsection (3) (a),
a licence must not be issued if the Commissioner has reasonable cause to believe that the applicant may not personally exercise continuous and responsible control over firearms because of—
(a) the applicant’s way of living or domestic circumstances, or
(b) any previous attempt by the applicant to commit suicide or cause a self-inflicted injury, or
(c) the applicant’s intemperate habits or being of unsound mind.
(5) A licence must not be issued to a person who—
(a) is under the age of 18, or
(b) has, within the period of 10 years before the application for the licence was made, been convicted in New South Wales or elsewhere of an offence prescribed by the regulations, whether or not the offence is an offence under New South Wales law, or
(c) is subject to an apprehended violence order or interim apprehended violence order or who has, at any time within 10 years before the application for the licence was made, been subject to an apprehended violence order (other than an order that has been revoked), or
(c1) is subject to a serious domestic abuse prevention order or who has, at any time within 10 years before the application for the licence was made, been subject to a serious domestic abuse prevention order, other than an order that has been revoked, or
(d) is subject to one of the following in relation to an offence prescribed by the regulations—
(i) a good behaviour bond, whether entered into in New South Wales or elsewhere,
(ii) a community correction order imposed in New South Wales,
(iii) a conditional release order imposed in New South Wales, or
(e) is subject to a firearms prohibition order, or
(f) is a registrable person or corresponding registrable person under the Child Protection (Offenders Registration) Act 2000.
(5A) A licence must not be issued to a person
if the Commissioner is of the opinion, having regard to any criminal intelligence report or other criminal information held in relation to the person, that—
(a) the person is a risk to public safety, and
(b) the issuing of the licence would be contrary to the public interest.
(5B) The Commissioner is not, under this or any other Act or law, required to give any reasons for not issuing a licence on the grounds referred to in subsection (5A).
(6) Except in the case of a firearms dealer licence or where the applicant’s genuine reason is business or employment, a licence must not be issued to a person who is not a natural person.
(7) Despite any other provision of this section, the Commissioner may refuse to issue a licence if the Commissioner considers that issue of the licence would be contrary to the public interest.
(8) The regulations may provide other mandatory or discretionary grounds for refusing the issue of a licence.
ETA: it took me literally 30 seconds to find this, and longer to format it for reasonable presentation on this forum. There is no excuse for ignorance.
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