Merged (edited) General thoughts about Christianity and the bible

[Mojo]

Doesn't the term "agnostic" leave a door open to possibility?

It is just the position that we cannot know anything about gods.

 

[Rusty Tyler]

That NDEs almost certainly tell us nothing about what, if anything, happens after death.

Having read a good number of NDE testimonies, I see plenty about the afterlife.
- An encounter with a loving God
- The need for healing human relationships
- A life-changing experience for the one who traveled to the afterlife
- Loss of the fear of death

 

[Mojo]

Doesn't the term "agnostic" leave a door open to possibility?

If by "agnostic" you mean "not sure whether God exists", then that is in fact an atheist position. Either you believe God exists or you don't.

 

[Rusty Tyler]

It is just the position that we cannot know anything about gods.

Haven't you read Greek mythology? "Great Zeus!"

 

[Steve]

Doesn't the term "agnostic" leave a door open to possibility?

Of course it does. There is a very remote possibility that some entity resembling a general concept of a god may appear someday and do something apparent to a majority population of our planet that resembles close enough the general concept of a god's singular abilities that people in general accept it as such. There is no evidence, barring anecdotes, that such a thing has ever happened in the past. And no reason to think that such an entity currently exists.

In fact "agnosticism" - the idea that we do not know everything - is the very thing that keeps science going - the idea that real compelling evidence could be found that overturns some aspect of current thinking. Nobel prizes are often awarded for such discoveries, and that particular field of science is changed forever.

So this particular attempt at a "gotcha" fails miserably.

 

[Rusty Tyler]

If by "agnostic" you mean "not sure whether God exists", then that is in fact an atheist position. Either you believe God exists or you don't.

I thought atheists were sure God doesn't exist.
Agnostics aren't sure.

 

[Rusty Tyler]

Of course it does. There is a very remote possibility that some entity resembling a general concept of a god may appear someday and do something apparent to a majority population of our planet that resembles close enough the general concept of a god's singular abilities that people in general accept it as such.

Like the Second-coming of Christ?
Seems that the first coming garnered a reasonable amount of attention. ???

 

[Steve]

Haven't you read Greek mythology? "Great Zeus!"

Many of us here are familiar with Greek mythology. Just as we are familiar with christian mythology. The sources for both equally lack any basis for believing them to be true or accurate.

Do you believe in Zeus too? If not, why not?

 

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Unfortunately, faith requires believing even when the evidence is not all there.

"...is not there at all." Corrected.

 

[Steve]

Like the Second-coming of Christ?
Seems that the first coming garnered a reasonable amount of attention. ???

That is one possibility, although I am not sure that the appearance of such an entity would be "second" as there is rather little actual evidence, bar mythology, for the first.

ETA - which is adequately covered in the parts of my post that you snipped.

 

[The Great Zaganza]

Great question, thanks.
Usually the person who experiences an NDE comes back with a message.
Typically a life-changing experience for them. We need to listen to them. IMHO

I find the idea incredibly problematic: why do we have to wait for someone to almost die to receive a message of critical importance? Why use such an unreliable conduit as someone who has just undergone a traumatic experience?

But assuming that is the only way to learn from supernatural forces, the moral and logical thing to do would be to have farms of people being strategically brought to death and back and then debriefed.

 

[Matthew Best]

If NDEs were real, wouldn't they all be the same?

 

[Rusty Tyler]

Many of us here are familiar with Greek mythology. Just as we are familiar with christian mythology. The sources for both equally lack any basis for believing them to be true or accurate.

That's a valid question about whether the Genesis account is literal of figurative.
Was Adam the first man? If not, how does that effect the atonement?
Whose sin was original?

Do you believe in Zeus too? If not, why not?

No.
I do believe in elohim. (plural for gods)
Elohim (capital E) being the supreme God.

 

[Rusty Tyler]

If NDEs were real, wouldn't they all be the same?

They seem to be tailored to the individual.
However, I see many similarities.

 

[Rusty Tyler]

why do we have to wait for someone to almost die to receive a message of critical importance?

Seems to be the only way to really get our attention.

 

[Gawdzilla Sama]

If NDEs were real, wouldn't they all be the same?

Maybe they're orchestrated by different kinds of kami?

 

[Pixel42]

Having read a good number of NDE testimonies, I see plenty about the afterlife.

Having read a great deal of fantasy fiction, I see plenty about elves. I still know nothing about them, including whether they even exist.

 

[Mojo]

I thought atheists were sure God doesn't exist.
Agnostics aren't sure.

No, atheists don't believe that God exists. That includes people who "aren't sure".

Theists are sure that gods don't exist.

 

[Mojo]

Haven't you read Greek mythology? "Great Zeus!"

Are you aware that mythology is mythical?

I ask because of the thread title.

 

[Carrot Flower King]

What do you conclude from that?
A meaningless existence?

Can you clarify what you are getting at here, please?

It appears at first sight to be a fairly standard religionista claim that those of us without any sort of religious faith or belief can only lead meaningless lives, which is, of course, complete nonsense. Did you mean this? Or something else?