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Does 'rape culture' accurately describe (many) societies?

Poem said:
Please tell the thread what you would be protecting a child from if you had the chance to intervene where an adult was about to (or was having sex) with a child. We know that you do not know if there is any material difference between the above scenario and an adult scratching the child's back. I mean, you wouldn't intervene if the adult was doing the latter would you? - so it follows that you wouldn't with the former either. You'll CMIIW.

Again, you double down on individualism even when we are talking about an adult having sex with a child.
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Wow, you just continue with strawmanning everything I say.

I'm of the belief that intellectual and emotional growth takes time. It is unfair to expect that underage individuals have grown to the point where it is fair to expect them to not be taken advantage of. This is why we don't allow them to sign bsiness contracts and have sex with adults. We recognize that age usually mean both emotional, physical and intellectual growth.

If you can't understand that I see this, we'll, that's your problem. Not mine.
 
acbytesla said:
Wow, you just continue with strawmanning everything I say.

I'm of the belief that intellectual and emotional growth takes time. It is unfair to expect that underage individuals have grown to the point where it is fair to expect them to not be taken advantage of. This is why we don't allow them to sign bsiness contracts and have sex with adults. We recognize that age usually mean both emotional, physical and intellectual growth.

If you can't understand that I see this, we'll, that's your problem. Not mine.
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You aren't answering my question or establishing that I have strawmanned you. You do not know if there is a material difference between sex and scratching an itch and yet somehow we should protect children from the former?

It looks like you do in fact know that there is a material difference. That is correct isn't it? You do know that there is something special about sex which makes it more than a trivial act?
 
Sometimes sex really is just scratching an itch.

But sex, even if it's just the scratching-an-itch kind, needs to be between consenting adults - those who aren't, cannot consent. Like dith many other things - driving a car, drinking, loaning money, signing contracts etc - you need to be an adult to understand the possible/probable consequences of what you're doing.

Apart from that, to each their own.
 
Poem said:
You aren't answering my question or establishing that I have strawmanned you. You do not know if there is a material difference between sex and scratching an itch and yet somehow we should protect children from the former?
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I have answered your question multiple times.

Strawmanning is assigning a position to others that they do not hold. You do that every time you state or imply that because I don't hold the position that sex necessarily has to have meaning that I don't or shouldn't care if adults have sex with underage individuals. That is a strawman, a non-sequitor and an ad absurdum fallacy all rolled into one. You hit the trifecta of illogical reasoning.
Poem said:
It looks like you do in fact know that there is a material difference. That is correct isn't it? You do know that there is something special about sex which makes it more than a trivial act?
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I never said it was trivial. Another strawman. I said it doesn't have to have meaning.
 
In other words, a person does need to be mature enough to formulate their own fully informed attitude towards sex. Whether they feel it's deeply meaningful or not.
 
Poem said:
then the sexual act (in whatever form) can be considered purely in terms of it's pleasurable aspect without any further meaning or moral import.
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What meaning and moral import would you like it to have?

Poem said:
This implies that there is something about sex that is meaningful.
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Or that there is something meaningful about children.

Poem said:
You do not know if there is any material difference between scratching someone else's itch and having sex with them?
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Is there? Scratching someone else's itch is a pretty intimate act.

Poem said:
Ramifications? The ramifications of performing a meaningless act with no moral import?
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Yes. You can conceive a child or catch an STI from a meaningless act with no moral import. Ramifications.
 
arthwollipot said:
What meaning and moral import would you like it to have?


Or that there is something meaningful about children.


Is there? Scratching someone else's itch is a pretty intimate act.


Yes. You can conceive a child or catch an STI from a meaningless act with no moral import. Ramifications.
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Acting irresponsibly has moral import, in my opinion.
 
Lithrael said:
In other words, a person does need to be mature enough to formulate their own fully informed attitude towards sex. Whether they feel it's deeply meaningful or not.
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And as part of that process of teaching them the benefits (both individual and societal) of monogamy and sexual restraint (i.e. the possible deeper meaning of sex), we introduce them (often from as young as age 9)) to internet porn.
 
Poem said:
And as part of that process of teaching them the benefits (both individual and societal) of monogamy and sexual restraint (i.e. the possible deeper meaning of sex), we introduce them (often from as young as age 9)) to internet porn.
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If by that you mean we tell them that it exists, that some people enjoy it, and that is made for entertainment purposes and should not be assumed to represent real-life sexual activity with a consenting partner, sure. What part of that do you have a problem with?

On the other hand, if by that you mean that we force them to watch porn, then ◊◊◊◊ right off. Nobody is suggesting that 9 year olds should be watching porn.
 
I am curious about our persistent interlocuter's view on kinky sex is. Especially kinky sex with a power dynamic in one direction or the other.

I probably shouldn't be, as it won't advance the conversation one bit. (Let's face it, this conversation has never actually been advanced, in any sense.)
 
arthwollipot said:
If by that you mean we tell them that it exists, that some people enjoy it, and that is made for entertainment purposes and should not be assumed to represent real-life sexual activity with a consenting partner, sure. What part of that do you have a problem with?
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Your continued pretence that porn is not made available to children, including 9 year olds, is noted. Further, your pretence that the real sex taking place in porn does not to some degree represent real life is also noted.

"...I wasn't sure it was normal to watch it..."
A significant minority want to emulate what they have seen in online pornography, and there is a perception, particularly from boys, that what they have viewed is realistic. These are worrying findings, given the acknowledgment by the young people themselves that online pornography is a poor model for consent or safe sex. On the other hand, if by that you mean that we force them to watch porn, then ◊◊◊◊ right off. Nobody is suggesting that 9 year olds should be watching porn.

1) A greater proportion of boys (53%) concurred with the option that pornography was realistic than the proportion of girls (39%);
arthwollipot said:
On the other hand, if by that you mean that we force them to watch porn, then ◊◊◊◊ right off. Nobody is suggesting that 9 year olds should be watching porn.
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This is irrelevant. 1 in 10 nine year olds have seen porn.
 
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Human sacrifice on the altar of sexual self-gratification.
 
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