Transwomen are not Women - Part 15

I like how Thermal also seems to be ignoring that I also responded to the correction, and accepted my mistake.
Not to get this going again, but the mistake was not the problem. What was interesting was the acceptance of such a conclusion, which was ludicrous on its face. It shouldn't have passed the sniff test, yet that narrative is so deeply drilled into some heads here that they couldn't recognize how absurd it was.
 
Also, it's probably worth asking how the trans rights activists would react at the proposal to add a gender marker (based on self-i.d.) while retaining birth sex. I'd ask them here, but alas, this thread has become oddly one-sided when compared to the general population of ISF.
Some people don't cope well with having their spurious belief systems challenged and complicated with inconvenient scientific facts and evidence.

My guess is that they would reject the proposal out of hand, because their goal is not to provide more useful information but rather to continue the process of replacing birth sex with gender identity in law and policy, which has been the central principle of gender ideology for many years now.
Of course they would reject it.
The reason transgender identified males want an 'F' on their identity documents is purely about validation - about forcing everyone else to play along with their fetish.
 
As i literally just said, I'm not back. I responded to an alert that was asking me a question by replying directly.

Absolutely. Right after you and others acknowledge the factual criticisms I've given to your posts for about a year now. It'll be a rather long wait, as you will have to queue up.

I'm at the end of a very long line. You and a couple others are at the front of it. You want integrity and courtesy shown to you? Lead by example.

We could discuss that. Then we could discuss whether a few actors are representative of a whole, and the other things you have been ignoring for the last year.

Intransigence noted. (Your "factual criticisms" are nothing of the sort. They're merely wishful-thinking assertions that someone is making up stories and lying, and ridiculous demands for the sort of "evidence" that simply isn't available.)
 
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Perhaps Thermal would like to fact-check this.
There's a year's worth of stories in line ahead of these. No cuttsies.

I would ask what relevance they have, though. A reader might think you had no reason at all to post these other than to post the worst actors out of millions and extrapolate 'that they are all like this'. If the reader was on a skeptics forum, they would scoff and point out the logical fallacy in doing so.

But thats not fair to you.That would be naked bigotry.
 
I thought Pixel was all for it? She was the one who introduced the idea.
I was the one who could not see a good reason for including it, and suggested that - if it was causing controversy - simply removing it might be the easiest solution, yes. I don't really have anything further to add on the subject.
 
I was the one who could not see a good reason for including it, and suggested that - if it was causing controversy - simply removing it might be the easiest solution, yes.
I'd be fine with removing the sex marker, although it does provide useful identifying information > 95% of the time.

I'd be fine with supplementing birth sex with a gender marker, because it would be helpful in the relatively few cases when sex and gender presentation are not well-aligned and because it would help new i.d. holders come to understand that sex and gender are two distinct concepts.

I'd oppose any attempt to redefine sex to mean gender identity, for reasons to numerous to mention right at the moment.
 
There's a year's worth of stories in line ahead of these. No cuttsies.

I would ask what relevance they have, though. A reader might think you had no reason at all to post these other than to post the worst actors out of millions and extrapolate 'that they are all like this'. If the reader was on a skeptics forum, they would scoff and point out the logical fallacy in doing so.

But thats not fair to you.That would be naked bigotry.

You know perfectly well why we post these articles. They illustrate the very high prevalence of sexual exhibitionism, sex offending and in particular child sex offending among trans-identified men, something which has been known about since approximately forever, but which suddenly we're supposed not to notice. We can go back over the stats in relation to convictions for sex offending in men, trans-identifying men and women again, if you like, since you absolutely refused to get your brain around them first time around.

Other men sexually offend too of course. And this is not OK. But other men are not being given carte blanche to enter women's intimate spaces, or at least, to avail themselves of this they do have to say the magic words "I identify as a woman".

The pattern of offending and offensive behaviour between these men who claim to be women and actual women is markedly different. You'll scour the internet for months to find more than a few cases of women accused of or convicted of sexual offences, and when you find them the nature of the offences is very different. In most cases the woman is acting as the catspaw of a man, either assisting him to commit rape, or acquiring images of children for a paedophile. Others are of older women seducing underage but still post-puberty boys.

The point of this is to rub your face in the reality that these are the men you are advocating for, these are the men you want to have free access to women's intimate spaces, with the women compelled to accept them on pain of being called a bigot at best and being charged with a hate crime at worst. "They're all like this"? Who knows. There are way too many of them (although even "none" would still not be a reason to expect women to accept any men in their intimate spaces).

I don't care how many shy vulnerable trans-identifying men there are. I have my own opinion on that. The point is that their wishes should not be pandered to at the expense of forcing women to treat this large cohort of bloody perverts as fellow-women. However shy and vulnerable they are, they're men, and they're not women's problem to solve, or they should not be. All men need to stay out of women's spaces to keep the perverts, the porn-sick and the abusers out.
 
Oh, look what I just found. Stats from the USA.


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Oh, look what I just found. Stats from the USA.


View attachment 65633
"The percentage of men id'ing as "trans" who are in for "sex offenses" remains shockingly high: over 51%.
This is almost *four times* as high as the general BOP population (all men and all women)."
 
Identifying characteristics needn't be immutable, they only need to be well-correlated with appearance
Gender isn't actually well correlated with appearance.
; we don't put headshots and weight on the i.d. because they are invariant over time
They can change, yes, but they typically change slowly.

Not gender (or, if you like, apparent gender). That can change almost instantly.
Personally, I think it is somewhat easier to identify someone when I know in advance (from the i.d. card) that they are a male trying to dress and look like a female, or vice-versa
What information would that provide that a picture plus sex doesn't give?
 
"The percentage of men id'ing as "trans" who are in for "sex offenses" remains shockingly high: over 51%.
This is almost *four times* as high as the general BOP population (all men and all women)."

I can't see how it would ever be possible to get real stats as to the percentage of trans-identified men who are porn addicts, kiddie-fiddlers, exhibitionists, wife-beaters and so on. Most of these creeps have never been arrested or charged. Much of the objectionable behaviour falls short of the actual criminal. The convicted paedophiles and rapists are just the tip of a very nasty iceberg. But the stats we went over before, from Scotland, England and New Zealand I believe, showed that trans-identifying men were four to five times more likely to be imprisoned for sexual offences than other men.

It would be interesting to know what these US stats would look like if you took women out of the BOP population, but since in most jurisdictions there are few incarcerated woman and many incarcerated men, it might not change the result much.
 
Well, I'm prepared to admit when I'm wrong. I opined that the bloke in the women's changing room at Gold's gym was probably an ordinary pervert just trying it on because he knew he could. Sorry.


He had already been kicked out of two other gyms for the same behaviour and he is certainly trans.
"I feel like this *had* to happen"

What happened was an obvious male went into a female shower room, ogled a female who was naked, and when the male was called out on it proceeded to tell the female in question that "straight women like to look at dick".
 
I see no reason why passports, identity cards, driving licences etc should mention the bearer's sex at all. It's totally irrelevant information.
Meh. Up until five minutes ago, it was relevant information. The purpose of identity documents is to prove that you are who you say you are, and they contain physical descriptors that allow other people to quickly and efficiently verify that information. In the real world, sex is perhaps the single most visibly identifiable characteristic a person can have, with skin color being a close second.

If you have a room full of people and you're trying to tell your pal which one of them is Alex, narrowing the field is immensely helpful. If 99 of them are male and 1 is female, sex is pretty much the only piece of information you need to provide: "Alex is the female" gets it done. If 50 of them are each sex, but the majority are hispanic and Alex is chinese, then "Alex is the chinese female" sums it up. If it's a highly mixed group, you have to provide more information - enough to allow your pal to figure out which of those 100 people you're talking about. I might end up being "Alex is the chinese female in the green shirt, standing next to the swedish male in the orange trousers".
 
You don't have to strip someone naked to confirm their height or eye colour.

There's no good reason to include it. Just remove it. Problem solved.
In 99% of cases, you don't have to strip anyone down to know what sex they are. We're really, really, really good at accurately sexing people by face alone, especially when we're in person without filters and precise camera angles intended to deceive the observer.
 
I mean... you know you could have said this pages ago and it would have all been over, right?

But it was "insignificant"!

He only asserted that a peaceful pre-arranged pro-trans protest had been attacked by abusive pro-women's rights counter-protestors, who "brought violence" to the event, and one of whom was arrested. Then he asserted that because he could find no record of any arrests by Police Scotland, this meant the whole thing (about the events in London) was invented.

And then he really started to dig the hole.

Just a wee insignificant slip, hardly worth mentioning, right? Certainly not worth apologising for.
 

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