Does 'rape culture' accurately describe (many) societies?

[Poem]

It sounds to me as though they don't have a good headliney way to say 'porn that presents actors as minors' so they are using 'barely legal' to stand in for that, in a way the industry does not.

That is, it's a conflation, possibly an intentional one.

This isn't even ambiguous. Nobody else besides articles/task force talking points like these say 'barely legal' in one breath and 'made in a way to suggest the subject is a minor' in the next.

A typical slang dictionary says:

barely legal​

adjective​

• appearing barely above the age of consent. Used frequently in pornography.

Sure, not all barely legal will be pushing at the boundaries (as Bertin says in the Guardian article).

The new pornography taskforce will propose legislation this autumn aimed at banning a type of “barely legal” content....

 

[Lithrael]

Sure, not all barely legal will be pushing at the boundaries (as Bertin says in the Guardian article).

The new pornography taskforce will propose legislation this autumn aimed at banning a type of “barely legal” content....

No. Again, I think they have straight up coined this usage themselves. Nobody, literally nobody at all, besides these 'task force' types uses the term this way. Nobody producing, nobody searching, nobody nobody.

I take it back on the keyword spamming actually, they probably do. But it seems like 'schoolgirl' is a more popular term for people who want really young looking performers, not 'barely legal' which seems to connote looking like someone you wouldn't be shocked to see having a fumble behind the bandshell.

 

[Poem]

No. Again, I think they have straight up coined this usage themselves. Nobody, literally nobody at all, besides these 'task force' types uses the term this way. Nobody producing, nobody searching, nobody keyword spamming, nobody nobody.

Verify that please.

 

[Lithrael]

Verify that please.

I've already linked to a popular definition and peeked a bit at search results, don't know what else you'd like. I'm in Florida so I can't actually check your Most Wanted for how they do it.

If the threshold for x meaning y is 'when you search for x you will get maybe 10% y' then sure. If you do search for y you get 100% y though.

I will say that 'barely legal' does look like it gets you all the short women up to about age 30.

I saw one thumbnail with a couple giant teddy bears in the shot and one with a girl who looked young as heck. And one handmaid's tale cosplay??? Everything else looked like what I expected from 'barely legal.'

If the taskforce had said all this about 'schoolgirl porn' then I'd still be saying schoolgirls aren't all minors, but you'd have a much stronger case for my argument being a semantic quibble as generally people do seem to use that to mean 'looks 12'

 

[Poem]

I've already linked to a popular definition and peeked a bit at search results, don't know what else you'd like. I'm in Florida so I can't actually check your Most Wanted for how they do it.

The definition you gave:

appearing barely above the age of consent. Used frequently in pornography.

seems just about right to describe the type of porn the article is discussing - where the actors are dressed up, speak and have props etc so as to encourage the impression they are underage.

 

[Lithrael]

(...) the actors are dressed up, speak and have props etc so as to encourage the impression they are underage.

...AKA 'appearing to be underage.'

'Appearing to be barely above the age of consent' and 'appearing to be underage' are meaningfully different things. I don't know how else to say this.

It looks like the genre you're talking about would more specifically be 'doing its best to appear underage and the main way you know they're not underage because it's a legally produced video' than any flavor of 'appears to be barely over the age of consent.'

 

[Darat]

I don't see how this makes any discernible difference. Sounds like the internet producers can just waive their hands and say it isn't portraying anyone underage.

Nope. A court would decide if it breaches the various acts not the porn’s producer.

 

[Poem]

...AKA 'appearing to be underage.'

'Appearing to be barely above the age of consent' and 'appearing to be underage' are meaningfully different things. I don't know how else to say this.

I think 'barely legal' is a handy, short appropriate phrase. No need to get bogged down in semantic nit-picking.

 

[Darat]

The definition you gave:

appearing barely above the age of consent. Used frequently in pornography.

seems just about right to describe the type of porn the article is discussing - where the actors are dressed up,
speak and have props etc so as to encourage the impression they are underage.

Which is already illegal in the UK, no matter what distribution method is used.

 

[Poem]

Nope. A court would decide if it breaches the various acts not the porn’s producer.

I'm still not following your point - if, indeed, there is one.

 

[Poem]

Which is already illegal in the UK, no matter what distribution method is used.

No - it's legal on the net. I asked you for a citation that is at odds with The Guardian and Barnardos.

 

[Lithrael]

I think 'barely legal' is a handy, short appropriate phrase.

Sure, except for the part where everybody else thinks you're talking about porn featuring 18 year olds full stop, and not people dressed as 15 year olds.

 

[Poem]

Sure, except for the part where everybody else thinks you're talking about porn featuring 18 year olds full stop, and not people dressed as 15 year olds.

I assume the tendency for anyone consuming such porn is a justification / bias towards thinking it's got nothing to do with any attraction to children.

 

[Ivor the Engineer]

You seem to think you're contradicting me here, but you aren't. You can do nothing about the "inputs" that a 20-year old male "refugee" from Syria or Libya has received. Those "inputs" are pathological, you cannot correct them after the fact (especially when your criminal justice system is so lenient towards them), and bringing these people in is producing problems.

Because before we had immigrants the UK had far fewer problems with violence against women and girls?

Bull ◊◊◊◊. Poverty isn't the problem. Poverty isn't what leads males to think it's acceptable to commit violence against females. To the extent that poverty correlates, it's because of other factors, such as growing up without a father in the house. But you're not actually doing anything about those other factors either. You're doing the same thing that the anti-porn campaigners are doing: tying your own pet causes (ie, leftist politics) to the issue in order to advance what you really care about, not what you claim to care about.

Poverty, social inequality and domestic abuse: The impact on children

New research published by BASW UK and The University of Edinburgh on poverty, social inequality and domestic abuse.

basw.co.uk

Poverty, social inequality and domestic abuse: The impact on children
Implications for Social Work Practice

BASW UK and The University of Edinburgh have published research using data from a survey of 5000 children living in Scotland, examining how poverty and other factors impact on mums experiencing domestic violence and the effects on their children. The research also looked at the involvement of police and social services in such situations.

Key Findings include:

The poorest mums were most likely to experience domestic abuse

Younger mums were more likely to report domestic abuse

Younger mums who were the poorest reported the highest levels of abuse

Children of mums who had experienced domestic abuse generally had poorer scores on different measures of social and emotional development.

Both the size of the evidence base, and the very specific implications for social work practice make this a highly significant piece of research.

That's really what you want. Violence against women? Not actually your concern.

I would like long term solutions to long term problems that are based on evidence. That alone seems to piss off, particularly those who believe in the acausal free will nonsense, which is most people.

Oh, and your ◊◊◊◊◊◊ up immigration situation is making it harder to provide all the social services you claim you want anyways.

I agree that our immigration situation is ◊◊◊◊◊◊ up. We should train the immigrants (<120W/person to run) to do useful jobs rather than building pointless and energy wasteful data centres for AI nonsense.

 

[Ziggurat]

Because before we had immigrants the UK had far fewer problems with violence against women and girls?

The importation of a bunch of young males from deeply misogynistic societies has certainly made things worse.

Poverty, social inequality and domestic abuse: The impact on children

New research published by BASW UK and The University of Edinburgh on poverty, social inequality and domestic abuse.

basw.co.uk

How many of these mothers were not married to the father of their children? How many of these mothers didn't have a father in their own home when they were growing up? How often does drug or alcohol abuse play a role in this abuse? These are just a few of the questions your source didn't even look at. Your source is essentially useless.

There are a ◊◊◊◊ ton of social pathologies which correlate with poverty, but are not poverty. Simply giving people more money may lift them out of poverty, but it won't fix those other social pathologies.

I would like long term solutions to long term problems that are based on evidence.

You're advocating programs that have been tried for decades and consistently failed to achieve their goals. Where's the evidence that they work?

 

[acbytesla]

The importation of a bunch of young males from deeply misogynistic societies has certainly made things worse.

How many of these mothers were not married to the father of their children? How many of these mothers didn't have a father in their own home when they were growing up? How often does drug or alcohol abuse play a role in this abuse? These are just a few of the questions your source didn't even look at. Your source is essentially useless.

There are a ◊◊◊◊ ton of social pathologies which correlate with poverty, but are not poverty. Simply giving people more money may lift them out of poverty, but it won't fix those other social pathologies.

You're advocating programs that have been tried for decades and consistently failed to achieve their goals. Where's the evidence that they work?

One, correlation isn't causation. And you're wrong. What do you think the goal of those policies? I agree, that simply giving people a modest amount of money doesn't necessarily lift them out of poverty. But it does alleviate a lot of suffering that comes with poverty.

 

[dirtywick]

...AKA 'appearing to be underage.'

'Appearing to be barely above the age of consent' and 'appearing to be underage' are meaningfully different things. I don't know how else to say this.

It looks like the genre you're talking about would more specifically be 'doing its best to appear underage and the main way you know they're not underage because it's a legally produced video' than any flavor of 'appears to be barely over the age of consent.'

besides, it's age appropriate for a lot of young men in the age range of like 18-22 or maybe even a little older.

in any case, and again anyone can go look online for themselves, barely legal is a category most often featuring younger actresses of legal age appearing to be the age that they actually are. is that to say that no one has ever produced a video in which an actress was given child like props and setting? no, absolutely not. but that's not a typical thing to see, and you can simply go to any given porn site and pull up the category and see that's not the case.

and that's the problem with this whole threadm, lots of easily verifiable claims are being made that aren't true. a little due diligence is in order here imo

 

[Ziggurat]

One, correlation isn't causation. And you're wrong. What do you think the goal of those policies? I agree, that simply giving people a modest amount of money doesn't necessarily lift them out of poverty. But it does alleviate a lot of suffering that comes with poverty.

We aren't talking about suffering in general. We're talking specifically about violence against women and girls. And Ivor was claiming that progressive entitlement programs would help reduce that. No evidence to that effect has been provided.

 

[acbytesla]

We aren't talking about suffering in general. We're talking specifically about violence against women and girls. And Ivor was claiming that progressive entitlement programs would help reduce that. No evidence to that effect has been provided.

Fair enough. But I don't think being a single mother has anything to with misogynistic violence either.

 

[arthwollipot]

How many of these mothers were not married to the father of their children?

I am not and never have been married to the mother of my child.