Transwomen are not Women - Part 15

I find actual guidance to the New Jersey police that DIRECTLY contradicts a statement YOU made about them, and you call it a Poe
Jesus Christ dude, you find the very police guidelines that say a cop cannot argue or debate about a person's identity, followed by clear conditions when the officer can act on his reason for suspicion, providing those reasons are "compelling, professional, and articulable". Yet here you are, still trying to deny that.

Two snaps up!
 
Does he look like a man? You didn't actually answer my question.
I did. Looks like a man, and also looks like a transwoman.

I'm not the one having trouble with this.

They are, by New Jersey law, unisex with extra steps.
This doesn't mean anything. There are no "steps" to a unisex bathroom. It's just a bathroom everyone is allowed to use.

The mere fact that there are steps you have to take in order use the ladies' room (if this is what you mean) is a tacit admission that it's not a unisex bathroom.
 
Last edited:
They are, by New Jersey law, unisex with extra steps.
Those steps, according to your massively flawed understanding, include willful deceit, which, as Dr Smartcooky was so kind as to recently document, does not have to be accepted. If the cop does not accept the claim for good reason, the cop can disregard it.

Your unisex bathroom interpretation is failing at every level.
 
I did. Looks like a man, and also looks like a transwoman.

I'm not the one having trouble with this.


This doesn't mean anything. There are no "steps" to a unisex bathroom. It's just a bathroom everyone is allowed to use.
Under NJ law, everyone is allowed to use the "women's" restroom. That seems unisex to me.

Sure, there's a magic phrase that unlocks the access for males, but there's zero requirement for verification, so that's not much of a "step".
 
Under NJ law, everyone is allowed to use the "women's" restroom.
Christ, another person willing to argue the law without understanding it.

No, not everyone is allowed to use the women's restroom.

Sure, there's a magic phrase that unlocks the access for males, but there's zero requirement for verification, so that's not much of a "step".
There is no magic phrase that unlocks access for anyone. There's no verification involved, and there never was. You just go in.
 
Last edited:
An immediately necessary consequence of "inclusive of both sexes" is "inclusive of females" and "inclusive of males."
Surely you can see it's misleading to leave half of those off while feigning quotation.
It's weird to me that you would make this objection, since I'm sure you're aware of the existence of scare quotes.
Which usage did you mean? I'm guessing "a writer is purposely misusing a word or phrase" but it's hard to say.

None of this really matters, though, I only ask that you try not to misrepresent what I've written by replying to made-up quotes.

Gender-segregated bathroom are not inclusive of males.
Not all males, to be sure, but some males.

In point of fact, both gender-segregated bathrooms are inclusive of a subset of males rather than all males.

Neither of these two subsets is more or less male than the other one, by my reckoning.
 
Last edited:
Surely you can see it's misleading to leave half of those off while feigning quotation.
It's not remotely misleading since it's an immediate and necessary implication, and I'm not feigning quotation. I'm distancing myself from the idea that the women's room is "inclusive of males". Because it's exactly backwards.

Which usage did you mean? I'm guessing "a writer is purposely misusing a word or phrase" but it's hard to say.
It's not hard to say at all for people who are minimally familiar with the concept, who don't feel the obligation to act like they just arrived on this planet and are trying to figure the world out exclusively by reading Wikipedia.

None of this really matters, though, I only ask that you try not to misrepresent what I've written by replying to made-up quotes.
Absurd.

Not all males, to be sure, but some males.
Which means they aren't unisex bathrooms. Because unisex bathrooms are inclusive of all males.

You just ceded this entire idiotic argument, but I don't expect that to stop you. "Are they, though? According to Merriam Webster..."

In point of fact, both gender-segregated bathrooms are inclusive of a subset of males.
I'd say one was inclusive of the whole set of males. I doubt you're going to get trespassed from the men's room if you're male under any circumstances.

Neither of these two subsets is more or less male than the other one, by my reckoning.
Unless you know what numbers are.
 
Last edited:
I don't believe this has ever happened, but it's good to know you believe it could.
It's codified very specifically in law, so it was at the very least legally provided for.

Whether or not it has actually happened is up for grabs tho. The odds are pretty good it never has because no one except the profound thinkers ITT thinks magic words are gonna bail anyone's ass out of anything. So you might be right.
 
Last edited:
Those steps, according to your massively flawed understanding, include willful deceit, which, as Dr Smartcooky was so kind as to recently document, does not have to be accepted. If the cop does not accept the claim for good reason, the cop can disregard it.
We can’t have penis police, but we can’t have gender police. Even though there is no legal justification for it, and it’s never happened in the context of bathrooms in New Jersey.

The irony is not lost on me that it’s vastly more difficult to evaluate intent than it is to evaluate sex.
 
unisex bathrooms are inclusive of all males.
Now we're getting somewhere. You clearly don't mean unisex in the sense I linked at #12,271 but rather in some slightly but significantly narrower sense.

"suitable or designed for both males and females" "suitable or designed for all males and females"

The bathrooms and locker rooms of NJ are not unisex in the latter sense, if that is indeed the sense you mean.

I doubt you're going to get trespassed from the men's room if you're male under any circumstances.
I propose to test this empirically, but I'm going to need someone trollish like Blaire White.

Unless you know what numbers are.

What have numbers to do with it? The relatively size of the two subsets doesn't change anything about whether they are all male.
 
We can’t have penis police, but we can’t have gender police. Even though there is no legal justification for it, and it’s never happened in the context of bathrooms in New Jersey.

The irony is not lost on me that it’s vastly more difficult to evaluate intent than it is to evaluate sex.
Agreed, much easier. But necessary, or even desirable or beneficial? I dunno.
 
*laughs* in Merager defense attorney :ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO:
How's that? The allowability of presence was never at issue. Hell, he was called "he" in court documents and jury instruction. No magic words were invoked.

He was allowed in under law and policy, as were the other transgender patrons known to staff. How we doing on learning how those trans people were accommodated? Were they also males on the women's side? Did anyone raise a stink? Was Cubaba Angel already aware, and set up her conveniently filmed Karen complaining call-out accordingly?
 
You guys are saying "unisex" when you mean mixed-sex, but I suppose that's past praying for.

(A unisex facility is one designed to be occupied by one person at a time, with all facilities in one room behind a lockable door. It can be used sequentially by people of either sex. The issues from women's perspective is that men are disgusting and pee on the floor and the seat and leave wet paper everywhere, and they plant hidden cameras.)
 
Now we're getting somewhere. You clearly don't mean unisex in the sense I linked at #12,271 but rather in some slightly but significantly narrower sense.
Not so much a narrower sense, but the actual sense of the actual noun phrase unisex bathroom in the Standard American English dialect (and various other synonymous noun phrases.) How could unisex bathroom be synonymous with gender-neutral bathroom if it didn't mean this?

It's seldom a good idea to do lexical analysis like this. I could say that unisex consists of the morphemes uni-, meaning "one, single" and sex, "one of two reproductive forms" and conclude that unisex bathroms are actually single-sex bathrooms. And then I could push myself out a window.

What have numbers to do with it? The relatively size of the two subsets doesn't change anything about whether they are all male.
But it does change something about the maleness of the groups they're a part of.

If I tell you Group A consists of 10 males and 90 females, and Group B consists of 80 females and 20 males, is it at all difficult to answer a question like "Which group is more male?" Do we need an endless digression, is it just kind of obvious what this means?
 
Last edited:
Unisex, and indeed gender-neutral I think, describe single-occupancy facilities, fully enclosed and lockable, intended to be used by one person (of either sex) at any one time.

You guys need to start using the correct term, mixed-sex, for facilities which are used simultaneously by people of both sexes.
 
If I tell you Group A consists of 10 males and 90 females, and Group B consists of 80 females and 20 males, is it at all difficult to answer a question like "Which group is more male?"
Not remotely, but that has nothing to do with what I said at all.

I said "both gender-segregated bathrooms are inclusive of a subset of males rather than all males" and I'm happy to break that down for you: Cisgender males go in one bathroom or locker room, and transgender males go in the other one.

Which group is more male? Neither.
 
You guys need to start using the correct term, mixed-sex, for facilities which are used simultaneously by people of both sexes.
Fair enough.

Gender-segregated restrooms in NJ are technically mixed-sex restrooms.

Women and girls at Wi Spa were upset to find themselves in a mixed-sex space rather than a single-sex space.
 

Back
Top Bottom