Cont: Luton Airport Car Park Fire part II

[W.D.Clinger]

Bear River Mountains? Elevation about 3,000m...?


And nobody lives there.

wiki

We may therefore assume Vixen thinks nobody lives in Syracuse, elevation about 325m, with annual snowfall averaging almost three meters.

Paradise, Washington is "one of the snowiest place on Earth where snowfall is measured regularly."

In most years, the area is snow-free from about mid-July through late September. October snowfall usually melts in between storms. The ground is usually completely snow covered for the winter by Thanksgiving.

The annual snowfall averages over 17 meters.

Paradise remains open year-round. (I have vacationed there myself, because the Nordic skiing on Mazama Ridge is phenomenal from November through April.) The western approach to Paradise is plowed year-round. The eastern approach, through Longmire, is open when they're able to plow it, but is closed at night and whenever there's too much snow or ice to keep it open even during the day, which is often.

 

[zooterkin]

All right. I put my hand up. I stand humbly corrected. I boobed. I only looked at one variable, when of course, there are all kinds of other variables, too, such as global wind streams, temperature due to oceanic effects, location, location, location. I am truly sorry if I upset anybody by seeming to disrespect their home town or region because I know how hurtful and painful it can be.

To recap what we were discussing in respect of this, the issue of why some people seem to be afraid of change that the EV brings and why they are change resistant. I was arguing that beyond the usual factor of people being change resistant by nature (hence the need for Change Management in corporations and governments) and the luddite argument, as put by Roger Ramjets, not to mention the association of anti-Ev-ers with 'Brexiteer/ Gammons' or with the Pro-Fossil Fuel lobbyists, there is another side. OK, so we can laugh at the ordinary chap who has an irrational fear he'll be made to give up his Ford Fiesta, and because he can't afford €60,000 for the compulsory replacement EV, he'll be stuck in a nightmare 15-minute city. But wait, that doesn't mean we should cover up any bad news about the safety of EV's in car parks just because the aforesaid are seen as ignorant bigots. IMV it is quite wrong to withhold relevant information as to what caused the car park fire. The public are entitled to transparency. Especially when it comes to safety.

There was also the issue of other factors, such as the weight of the vehicle, especially in regions where it is compulsory to change tyres regularly in winter months, but I think Dabop explained you can get extra-strong jacks for this purpose.

What does any of that have to do with the Luton car park fire starting in a diesel car, and not an EV, of some sort, as you seemed to believe?

 

[Foster Zygote]

Bear River Mountains? Elevation about 3,000m...?


And nobody lives there.

wiki

How does that make your claim that the U.S. doesn't get heavy, long-lasting snowfalls any less egregiously wrong?

This speaks to your total lack of credibility. You regularly make proclamations that are completely wrong, but none the less maintain your qualifications give you the credentials to offer what amounts to expert assessments regarding all manner of scientific and engineering subjects. Refusing to admit you're wrong doesn't prevent anyone else from seeing that you are.

 

[JayUtah]

Bear River Mountains?

No.

 

[JayUtah]

All right. I put my hand up. I stand humbly corrected. I boobed. I only looked at one variable, when of course, there are all kinds of other variables, too...

Yes, well known ones, not just the very obvious one I mentioned. The problem is not merely that you're confidently wrong. It's that you're confidently wrong about things quite a lot of people know who aren't even meteorologists or geologists. You aspire to be a scientist, but we're still bringing you up to speed on common knowledge. Maybe yours is not a position from which to try to tell everyone else how wrong they must be.

I am truly sorry if I upset anybody by seeming to disrespect their home town or region because I know how hurtful and painful it can be.

Oh, knock it off. No one is crying in their tea just because you're confidently and colossally misinformed about a common fact. They're laughing at you because you insist on a charade of competence that you think means we have to take you seriously when you pontificate on more complicated scientific subjects. They're bringing up places they know or have been to because it's clear-cut evidence of just how inescapably wrong you are.

You can't even properly accept correction. You have to reframe it to apply a dig against the allegedly fragile egos of your critics—you're trying to shame people away from holding you accountable. Then you have to quickly change the subject and spew more conspir-o-twaddle in the hopes it will distract from your abject and widely-ranging ignorance.

 

[Andy_Ross]

We're currently in the throes of Second Winter. 26″ of new snow in the mountains over the weekend. That's 26 inches, mind you, not 26 minutes. That's atop a months-long persistent base of around 100″. It's almost as if geography had a mysterious third dimension.

Debbie ended up in the UK because she married my mate Alan who was working in Utah as a ski instructor.

 

[phiwum]

The point of the relatively recent law is a focus on road safety rather than rigid dates.
.

Don't tell me. Tell this poster.

Here in Finland, it is the law to change to winter tyres from 1 November to 30 March.

 

[Mojo]

But wait, that doesn't mean we should cover up any bad news about the safety of EV's in car parks just because the aforesaid are seen as ignorant bigots. IMV it is quite wrong to withhold relevant information as to what caused the car park fire. The public are entitled to transparency. Especially when it comes to safety.

Blatantly begging the question.

 

[catsmate]

We're currently in the throes of Second Winter. 26″ of new snow in the mountains over the weekend. That's 26 inches, mind you, not 26 minutes. That's atop a months-long persistent base of around 100″. It's almost as if geography had a mysterious third dimension.

I remember my first winter n northern Ohio.

 

[catsmate]

The snowiest cities in the United States (>10,000 pop.)

1. Sault Ste. Marie, Michigan 119.3 inches

2. Syracuse, New York 114.3

3. Juneau, Alaska 93.6

More here:
https://www.almanac.com/what-are-snowiest-cities-us#:~:text=The%20town%20with%20the%20most,of%20241.7%20inches%20per%20year!

Yes I remember my three weeks working there, including a runway skid.

 

[Dabop]

Snip

There was also the issue of other factors, such as the weight of the vehicle, especially in regions where it is compulsory to change tyres regularly in winter months, but I think Dabop explained you can get extra-strong jacks for this purpose.

Again- they are not 'extra strong' they are standard equipment in hundreds of millions of vehicles worldwide- and even the 'lightest duty' jacks (as fitted to my small hatchback Corolla) would have no difficulty in lifting any of the currently available BEV cars or SUV's up in an emergency- its over its 'legal rating' but still well within its safety margin...

So your argument that they need 'special jacks' is (like all your others) shown to be totally baseless...


Ironically- my Hilux weighs MORE than a Tesla model 3 LR (curb weight of 1955 kg/4311 lbs unloaded for the Hilux, versus 1928 kg/4250.51 lb for the Tesla- but the 'lux has a payload of 1095 kg making a GVM of 3055kg, while the 3LR has only a 388kg payload maximum, making a GVM of only 2343kg- nearly 3/4 of a tonne LIGHTER than the most sold vehicle in Australia...

The standard Toyota jack will lift a Model 3 without even breaking a sweat... (and be within its safe working load even)

Standard equipment...It's a pretty basic screw jack- not even hydraulic LOL

$20 from the local wreckers if you don't have one...

 

[erwinl]

Again- they are not 'extra strong' they are standard equipment in hundreds of millions of vehicles worldwide- and even the 'lightest duty' jacks (as fitted to my small hatchback Corolla) would have no difficulty in lifting any of the currently available BEV cars or SUV's up in an emergency- its over its 'legal rating' but still well within its safety margin...

So your argument that they need 'special jacks' is (like all your others) shown to be totally baseless...


Ironically- my Hilux weighs MORE than a Tesla model 3 LR (curb weight of 1955 kg/4311 lbs unloaded for the Hilux, versus 1928 kg/4250.51 lb for the Tesla- but the 'lux has a payload of 1095 kg making a GVM of 3055kg, while the 3LR has only a 388kg payload maximum, making a GVM of only 2343kg- nearly 3/4 of a tonne LIGHTER than the most sold vehicle in Australia...

The standard Toyota jack will lift a Model 3 without even breaking a sweat... (and be within its safe working load even)

[qimg]https://i.postimg.cc/J7fqqnq6/main-qimg-84230167a57a0bf1651a203ea17643bf-pjlq.jpg[/qimg]
Standard equipment...It's a pretty basic screw jack- not even hydraulic LOL
[qimg]https://i.postimg.cc/fRmT9Hbq/th-487493154.jpg[/qimg]
$20 from the local wreckers if you don't have one...

That's even more heavy duty, than the jack that I have on our RV, should we ever have a flat tire.
That is one of the simple scissor type jacks, you see in all the cars. Bit heavier than those, but not very much so.
And our RV weighs in at 3495 kgs exact (I know this, because I put it on a weighing bridge).

 

[whoanellie]

The public are entitled to transparency.

There are none so blind as those who will not see.

https://www.bedsfire.gov.uk/news/fire-airport-car-park-started-accidentally

As a result of the investigation, all evidence points to the most probable cause being an electrical fault or component failure, which started in the engine bay of the vehicle whilst it was in motion.


The developing fire spread to other components, and whilst the owner of the vehicle attempted to fight the fire, the vehicle became overrun with flames and spread to other parked vehicles.

 

[Foster Zygote]

That's even more heavy duty, than the jack that I have on our RV, should we ever have a flat tire.
That is one of the simple scissor type jacks, you see in all the cars. Bit heavier than those, but not very much so.
And our RV weighs in at 3495 kgs exact (I know this, because I put it on a weighing bridge).

The takeaway here is that our resident expert on automobile fires has clearly never even changed a tire.

 

[Mojo]

The public are entitled to transparency.

There are none so blind as those who will not see.

https://www.bedsfire.gov.uk/news/fire-airport-car-park-started-accidentally

Vixen's argument that there is a conspiracy to hide the truth is now dependent on the premise that there is a conspiracy to hide the truth.

 

[catsmate]

To recap what we were discussing in respect of this, the issue of why some people seem to be afraid of change that the EV brings and why they are change resistant. I was arguing that beyond the usual factor of people being change resistant by nature (hence the need for Change Management in corporations and governments) and the luddite argument, as put by Roger Ramjets, not to mention the association of anti-Ev-ers with 'Brexiteer/ Gammons' or with the Pro-Fossil Fuel lobbyists, there is another side. OK, so we can laugh at the ordinary chap who has an irrational fear he'll be made to give up his Ford Fiesta, and because he can't afford €60,000 for the compulsory replacement EV, he'll be stuck in a nightmare 15-minute city. But wait, that doesn't mean we should cover up any bad news about the safety of EV's in car parks just because the aforesaid are seen as ignorant bigots. IMV it is quite wrong to withhold relevant information as to what caused the car park fire. The public are entitled to transparency. Especially when it comes to safety.

There was also the issue of other factors, such as the weight of the vehicle, especially in regions where it is compulsory to change tyres regularly in winter months, but I think Dabop explained you can get extra-strong jacks for this purpose.

1. So we can add the nature and role of Change Management to the long list of topics that you don't actually understand but pontificate about.
2. Oh look a right-wing lie.
3. No-one is doing so. What is happening is that the risks are being exaggerated and lied about, and you're parroting those lies.
4. So the "EVs are so heavy they'll destroy roads and bridges" lie makes an appearance.

 

[Dabop]

That's even more heavy duty, than the jack that I have on our RV, should we ever have a flat tire.
That is one of the simple scissor type jacks, you see in all the cars. Bit heavier than those, but not very much so.
And our RV weighs in at 3495 kgs exact (I know this, because I put it on a weighing bridge).

Not a fan of scissor jacks, they are bigger than screw jacks, and more prone to failure...
(I suspect the size is the biggest issue in the Lux as to why they went the screw jack- it's a single cab, and the jack etc all have to live in the tiny gap between the rear of the cab and the seat...)

 

[Vixen]

Debbie ended up in the UK because she married my mate Alan who was working in Utah as a ski instructor.

Who knew skiing resorts had snow? Even at Grenoble south France, which is where I expect malbui was during his 'blizzard'. _DOH!

Edited by Agatha: 

Corrected spelling of member's name

 

[erwinl]

Who knew skiing resorts had snow? Even at Grenoble south France, which is where I expect malbui was during his 'blizzard'. _DOH!

Apparently you didn't, as you said that the US didn't have that 'Finnish' snow which would stay for the entire winter, but that the US only had their local, 'disappearing in a few days' snow.

Edited by Agatha: 

Corrected spelling of member's name in quote

 

[Dabop]

LOL- when people think of Australia, they tend to think of deserts and the like, but only a few hours drive from the Opera House and Sydney Harbour Bridge, we have several ski resorts in the aptly named 'Snowy Mountains'