The sinking of MS Estonia: Case Reopened Part VII

[Vixen]

They already had those brackets; you've already been told this. The retooling was at the EPIRB factory, to produce only immersion activated beacons, instead of manual ones (though I suspect not much retooling would have been needed, just the obsoletion of the manual production line, since I think automatic ones were already being made). They would have had to ramp up production if all the manual EPIRBs installed on ships had to be replaced, though, which was the point.

Stop waffling. The IMO CHAPTER III came into effect 1988 pursuant to the 1987 Herald of Free Enterprise public inquiry. IOW the EPIRB factory had six years to get their act together. Manually-activated EPIRB'S and PLB's are by no means 'obsolete' even today.

I have seen some weak arguments but this takes the biscuit.

 

[Vixen]

So the newspaper was guessing and speculating.

That's why it's not a good source.

The newspaper, being one of the most respected, sent its top journalists to the Press Conference arranged by the JAIC and likely given handout sheets of what it was about.

 

[Vixen]

'Gushing schoolboy style'?

How would you describe this style of writing?

max hastings secret war excerpt p181 by Username Vixen, on Flickr

 

[Andy_Ross]

JAIC do not mention the cargo nor 101 other things. Such as why the vessel slowed to 5/6kn just prior to the WNW turn shortly before it sank?

It slowed because the bows fell off, the correct thing to do was slow down and turn the head from the weather.

Then the machinery space flooded stopping the engines and power was lost, that would cause the ship to broach side on to the waves. If you lose headway you are going to end up side on to the swell, you can't stop it.

Well, actually you can on a small boat, you can trail an improvised sea anchor over the bow, it will hold your head to the wind and swell if you are lucky. A ship has no chance

 

[Andy_Ross]

The newspaper, being one of the most respected, sent its top journalists to the Press Conference arranged by the JAIC and likely given handout sheets of what it was about.

So it was guessing and speculating.

 

[Andy_Ross]

How would you describe this style of writing?

[qimg]https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53257326068_b24849b977.jpg[/qimg]max hastings secret war excerpt p181 by Username Vixen, on Flickr

What is 'gushing' or 'schoolboy'?

 

[Jack by the hedge]

Erm, if they are designed to be automatic, they do need to be tested that they will do what it says on the tin. Why else would the IMO stipulate that all GMDSS equipment must be inspected and tested by certified radio electricians to ensure conformance?

Not tuning. Irrelevant.

 

[Here_to_learn]

How would you describe this style of writing?

[qimg]https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53257326068_b24849b977.jpg[/qimg]max hastings secret war excerpt p181 by Username Vixen, on Flickr

Successful?

 

[Jack by the hedge]

Oh really? So how come MRCC didn't get the may day until 02:00?

You know the same facts we do. You just joined a few dots and turned that into an episode of the X-files in your head. There was no communications blackout.

 

[Myriad]

Look. The JAIC in its initial stages were problem solvers. There was the problem of automatic free float buoys that appeared not to have automatically emitted a signal to the COSPAS-SARSAT satellites, despite having been inspected and tested the week before as being in ready functional mode. This was a puzzle to the extent they were extensively tested by the sea vessel TARMOS for a full four hours...

Here are some similar puzzles:

"The car's transmission was automatic, and was in good working order, so why did it fail to put itself in 'park' prior to the roll-away incident?"

"The shooter was using an automatic rifle, which was in good working order, so how could the shots have missed the target?"

And why do I have to measure rice and water into my automatic rice cooker? Shouldn't it do that itself? Maybe it's not in good working order.

 

[P.J. Denyer]

Oh, it's Groundhog Day again.

 

[Blue Mountain]

I can confirm it means 'tuned'.

Oh, you speak Finnish, then?

 

[Mojo]

Ah yes. I've now received the book Andy_Ross recommended 'The Secret War' by Max Hastings and at first glance appears to be quite readable, albeit in a gushing schoolboy style with pointed jokes, despite being about 600 pages and a quite different genre from the last two chick-lit thrillers I read.

Does it say anything about the Times having reporters eavesdropping on German soldiers and filing stories from the German front lines at Stalingrad, or the German front lines elsewhere?

.I stand by my comments about the TIMES article in question.

Can you provide a reference for the Times article that you believe to be "the TIMES article in question".

 

[Jack by the hedge]

I stand by my comments about the TIMES article in question.

The Times article in question described German newspaper reports playing down the bad news of Italy quitting the axis, for the satisfaction of British readers, and your comment was you cannot see how the information can have been anything other than reports from British agents secretly embedded in the German front lines.

You are plainly not being serious.

 

[Axxman300]

As an interesting counter argument - and it is always good to see arguments from all sides - is the following:

https://estoniafyndet.wordpress.com...nia-15-vattnet-som-sankte-estonia-del-1-film/

Margus Kurm has zero credibility. And it is clear from both the photos and new simulations the damage was from impacting the bottom. No conspiracy, Kurm is a liar. End of story.

 

[Steve]

The Times article in question described German newspaper reports playing down the bad news of Italy quitting the axis, for the satisfaction of British readers, and your comment was you cannot see how the information can have been anything other than reports from British agents secretly embedded in the German front lines.

You are plainly not being serious.

Exactly as serious as always.

 

[LondonJohn]

but these days, the word ' virittys' means 'tuning', as derived from the word, 'virta' which means 'current', 'flow' or 'power' as in electricity, radio wavelengths or water, as in a river.

Which ironically makes it far more likely that the word actually pertains to the flow of current (=power) in the device, as opposed to anything concerning the frequency of the transmitted signal.

In other words: the EPIRB going from a state of no current flowing, to a state in which current was flowing.

In other words, the switching on of power to the EPIRB (which in this model of EPIRB was solely by way of a manually-operated switch).


You've now been told numerous times that no EPIRB - whether manually-activated or immersion-activated - has the facility to alter the frequency at which the emergency signal is broadcast. If you knew anything about this issue (or if you had any scientific literacy at all), you'd understand why this has, by definition, to be true. But you don't, so you don't.

 

[LondonJohn]

Looking at the set-up/testing instructions, the buoys have to be set up in a particular way so that when released they emit the correct signal on floating to the surface. In the testing mode, you need a 121 frequency radio (iirc - check this) to receive the signal or an antenna mast , as illustrated, from an instruction sheet dated 1996.

[qimg]https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53246894461_85a00b3654_z.jpg[/qimg]Test set up 1996 by Username Vixen, on Flickr

Remember, the technology in 1994 was probably slightly more basic than now.

Oh mannn. This is a pitifully ignorant "explanation" about how and why EPIRBs are tested on a rig. You don't have the first idea what you're talking about. It's embarrassing.

 

[whoanellie]

I can confirm it means 'tuned'.

And according to you "tuned" means "tested".

 

[W.D.Clinger]

You are plainly not being serious.

Someone who is wrong or deluded can be perfectly serious.

Someone who is wrong or deluded almost all of the time can be both seriously wrong and seriously deluded.