Cont: Cancel culture IRL Part 2

[johnny karate]

Despite the millions of linked articles explaining what cancel culture is and the billions of examples provided an executive decision has been made to redefine cancel culture to mean anything we want it to mean with the exception of government censorship and actions by law enforcement agencies. Unless Tucker Carson says otherwise that is.

In light of this recent decision by the thought leaders of this thread the answer is yes, this is cancel culture, more specifically it's a runaway cancellation cascade.

Is your take that the University President should not lose her job?

If so, why? If not, why?

 

[johnny karate]

That's just accountability culture, nothing to be worried about.

Is your take that the University President should not lose her job?

If so, why? If not, why?

 

[d4m10n]

She should not lose her job; she should issue a statement about whether it is a good idea to sack teachers merely because some students find academically relevant material objectionable.

 

[Stout]

Is your take that the University President should not lose her job?

If so, why? If not, why?

She should not lose her job; she should issue a statement about whether it is a good idea to sack teachers merely because some students find academically relevant material objectionable.

 

[wareyin]

Apparently nobody should ever be fired. Losing your job because of actions that you chose to take would be cancel culture.

 

[d4m10n]

Apparently nobody should ever be fired.

Bit hasty.

 

[Stout]

Bit hasty.

We won't be able to make any determinations WRT the university president until we see that statement. Was this a case of wanting to censor "offensiveness" or was there something greater at play, like fear of a possible beheading?

 

[wareyin]

Bit hasty.

So companies and universities should be able to fire someone for actions that person took? Damn, there goes the central premise of the "cancel culture" boogieman!

 

[d4m10n]

So companies and universities should be able to fire someone for actions that person took?

Of course they should be able to do so, especially in extreme cases. This doesn't imply that any giving firing is morally justified or that it was morally acceptable to call for _________ to be sacked.

I believe parents should be able to teach their children that they are sinful, so much so that a human sacrifice was required to atone for it; I do not believe this is an ethical (or true) thing to teach. There is a pretty wide gap between what ought to be permitted and what ought to be done.

 

[wareyin]

Of course they should be able to do so, especially in extreme cases. This doesn't imply that any giving firing is morally justified or that it was morally acceptable to call for _________ to be sacked.

So...companies should be able to fire employees because of actions those employees took which hurt the business in some way, but those justified firings might not be moral or justified if a right winger gets upset about an employee facing the consequences of their actions?

I believe parents should be able to teach their children that they are sinful, so much so that a human sacrifice was required to atone for it; I do not believe this is an ethical (or true) thing to teach.

Wait, the belief in cancel culture is a religion, now? You might be on to something.

 

[d4m10n]

So...companies should be able to fire employees because of actions those employees took which hurt the business in some way, but those justified firings might not be moral or justified if a right winger gets upset about an employee facing the consequences of their actions?

OP had nothing to do with right wingers, you are just reading that in.

I understand the urge to make everything a battle of good vs. evil, but this discussion doesn't need to be polarized in that way.

 

[johnny karate]

She should not lose her job; she should issue a statement about whether it is a good idea to sack teachers merely because some students find academically relevant material objectionable.

Why shouldn’t she lose her job? If she wrongfully decided to not renew someone’s contract, that’s an abuse of her position and authority. If that’s not a firing offense, what is?

 

[johnny karate]

Of course they should be able to do so, especially in extreme cases. This doesn't imply that any giving firing is morally justified or that it was morally acceptable to call for _________ to be sacked.

I believe parents should be able to teach their children that they are sinful, so much so that a human sacrifice was required to atone for it; I do not believe this is an ethical (or true) thing to teach. There is a pretty wide gap between what ought to be permitted and what ought to be done.

Was the university president behaving morally when she decided not to renew the contract of the adjunct?

 

[d4m10n]

Was the university president behaving morally when she decided not to renew the contract of the adjunct?

Assuming her primary motivation was to kowtow to the mob, clearly not.

Assuming her primary motivation was to prevent students from seeing images of Mohammed, even more clearly not.

Assuming she had good reasons which have yet to come to light, probably so.

 

[lionking]

Despite the millions of linked articles explaining what a ghost is and the billions of examples of ghosts provided an executive decision has been made to redefine ghost phenomena to mean mundane explanations.

I’ve seen some really hopeless analogies in this forum over the years, but this takes the cake. Well done.

 

[johnny karate]

Assuming her primary motivation was to kowtow to the mob, clearly not.

Assuming her primary motivation was to prevent students from seeing images of Mohammed, even more clearly not.

Assuming she had good reasons which have yet to come to light, probably so.

“Good reasons” eventually coming to light notwithstanding, how is behaving immorally in the course of carrying out their job not sufficient justification to fire someone?

 

[d4m10n]

“Good reasons” eventually coming to light notwithstanding, how is behaving immorally in the course of carrying out their job not sufficient justification to fire someone?

Administrators make decisions which cause more harm than good on a weekly basis. This one made a bad call when pressured to do so by people who sincerely believe it is more important to show respect for Islam than to uphold the foundational values of academic freedom. She should be given the chance to make better calls, assuming she understands what she got wrong.

 

[johnny karate]

Administrators make decisions which cause more harm than good on a weekly basis. This one made a bad call when pressured to do so by people who sincerely believe it is more important to show respect for Islam than to uphold the foundational values of academic freedom. She should be given the chance to make better calls, assuming she understands what she got wrong.

In light of her immoral behavior, why do you think the university owes her that? Do they not have the right and reasonable enough justification to make that decision for themselves?

 

[lionking]

I suppose there is cancelling and cancelling though. I was discriminated against in my last job and gave notice that I would take legal action against those concerned (and the employer who was, under our laws, also liable). I was asked to leave……… with a mid six figure payout.

 

[d4m10n]

In light of her immoral behavior, why do you think the university owes her that?

In part because this wasn't a single point of failure event. Academic culture has largely bought into the idea that we should go straight to sacking people when they make a bad decision (especially ones involving allegations of _____phobia or _____ism) instead of taking a less vengeful and more restorative approach.

Do they not have the right and reasonable enough justification to make that decision for themselves?

Certainly they have the former.