Cont: Cancel culture IRL Part 2

[ZiprHead]

Meh, some millionaires snubbing some other millionaires over a personal grudge. Their game is to get us to take sides between them based on ideology, but the real sides are the millionaires versus the proles.

That's not just "some millionaires". It's a state governor punishing a constituent because the constituent used their free speech right.

 

[Dr. Keith]

Mr. Shapiro's position was that Sri Srinivasan was the best pick for President Biden. It logically follows from this premise that any other pick is lesser, regardless of skin color, as Jonathan Chait noted in his article at The Intelligencer. However, it was ill-judged (or in Scott Greenfield's words "reckless") because it was liable to being misunderstood.

But the premise is not logical. There is no single candidate who is best qualified for the job. It assumes a rubric which simply doesn’t exist.

 

[Dr. Keith]

That's not just "some millionaires". It's a state governor punishing a constituent because the constituent used their free speech right.

Isn’t that the risk a constituent runs when its business model is based on the whims of the state?

I agree that it is chilling, but is there an argument that such sweetheart deals should be chilled?

 

[ponderingturtle]

Isn’t that the risk a constituent runs when its business model is based on the whims of the state?

I agree that it is chilling, but is there an argument that such sweetheart deals should be chilled?

Sure they should all be chilled, but they shouldn't be selectively chilled based on supporting the governors positions.

 

[Dr. Keith]

Sure they should all be chilled, but they shouldn't be selectively chilled based on supporting the governors positions.

I agree. My hope is that they will be chilled generally because rich people don’t like being muzzled.

My free speech is tempered by the fact that I like my very well paying career more than I would enjoy being able to say things that would ruin my career. But billionaires like both money and freedom, so it gets harder for them. As it should be.

 

[Chris_Halkides]

baseball

But the premise is not logical. There is no single candidate who is best qualified for the job. It assumes a rubric which simply doesn’t exist.

If I said that Ty Cobb is the best baseball player that ever lived, it necessarily follows that Barry Bonds is a lesser baseball player. Whether the premise is correct or incorrect is a separate issue. Georgetown struck out.

 

[JoeMorgue]

This is the "If a cop only pulls over black speeders he's not being racist because, hey the black people were speeding" argument.

Two wrongs don't make a right and selective enforcement of a bad law is still bad.

Yes you can argue that government shouldn't be in the business of supporting this or that, but pulling support from this or that out of pure political spite is still wrong. This is not a paradox.

 

[Dr. Keith]

If I said that Ty Cobb is the best baseball player that ever lived, it necessarily follows that Barry Bonds is a lesser baseball player. Whether the premise is correct or incorrect is a separate issue. Georgetown struck out.

But that’s not what he said. That’s what you wish he said.

 

[wareyin]

If I said that Ty Cobb is the best baseball player that ever lived, it necessarily follows that Barry Bonds is a lesser baseball player. Whether the premise is correct or incorrect is a separate issue. Georgetown struck out.

If you follow your claim that Ty Cobb is the best with a further claim that all black players are lesser, you lose the benefit of the doubt.


eta: the tweet in question

Objectively best pick for Biden is Sri Srinivasan, who is solid prog & v smart. Even has identity politics benefit of being first Asian (Indian) American. But alas doesn’t fit into latest intersectionality hierarchy so we’ll get lesser black woman. Thank heaven for small favors?

 

[JoeMorgue]

This is the other thing, we have to pretend that every statement happens in a vacuum. And if you hate black people for no reason 6 days out of the week you hating one for a valid reason on Sunday isn't allowed to raise any eyebrows.

 

[Darat]

Why did you ask me and not SuburbanTurkey? See comment #1735.

Doesn't seem to answer my question which was "Why do you not consider your comments as an example of “cancel culture”?"

 

[lomiller]

I agree. My hope is that they will be chilled generally because rich people don’t like being muzzled.

My free speech is tempered by the fact that I like my very well paying career more than I would enjoy being able to say things that would ruin my career. But billionaires like both money and freedom, so it gets harder for them. As it should be.

Governments picking winners and looser in the market place based on which companies support them and which doesn't is a very dangerous precedent. This was the economic model that NAZI Germany used to suppress dissent and it's the model Vladimir Putin uses today to control Russia.

It doesn't matter whether you have sympathy for millionaires or not, if they all support the fascist government because they fear the consequences of dissent then YOU are the one that looses.

 

[Chris_Halkides]

plain meaning

But that’s not what he said. That’s what you wish he said.

That is what at least one pundit and one blogger thought he meant, including one who agreed with you that the premise was wrong, and their articles have already been linked here. I am not sure that David Bernstein was, and he makes it clear how and where he draws a line. It is not what I wish Mr. Shapirl meant; it is what I thought he meant. I am still struggling with how anyone could read it any other way.

 

[Chris_Halkides]

Mark Joseph Stern

I read the entire article that was linked to, including his letter of resignation. Is there something else that I should read that will change my mind about 1) the bad employers and 2) the snowflake?

And of course - why this is "cancel culture"?

I provided a definition of cancel culture in comment #1725, and this incident checked off several boxes and gets bonus points for involving social media. The outside actors trying to get Mr. Shapiro fired included the students and Mark Joseph Stern.
EDT
Given that you read the letter, then you were aware of the comments made by other faculty that were not sanctioned. This nullifies your comment #1939.

 

[Chris_Halkides]

simple

Doesn't seem to answer my question which was "Why do you not consider your comments as an example of “cancel culture”?"

I did not call for anyone to get fired. Would you now please do me the return courtesy of answering my question?

 

[Chris_Halkides]

the tweet itself

If you follow your claim that Ty Cobb is the best with a further claim that all black players are lesser, you lose the benefit of the doubt.


eta: the tweet in question

Thank you for provided the tweet; its wording is plainly different from yours.

 

[Chris_Halkides]

Georgetown's record

Yet the rest of the faculty does, so I really don't think your 2) passes the sniff test.

A faculty member whose tweet suggested that certain men die a horrible death to be followed by mutilation of their corpses. If people were offended by this tweet, then it ran afoul of Georgetown's anti-harrassment policy, taking the words of the IDEAA report at face value. Yet Georgetown defended the tweet, while attacking Mr. Shapiro.
EDT
FIRE wrote, "To be clear, no professor should be investigated or punished for subjectively offensive but protected expression, and Georgetown was right to refrain from responding to these speakers by invoking formal processes. However, Georgetown has clearly applied its free expression policies in an inconsistent manner, based on ideology rather than adherence to its own stated principles. In FIRE’s experience, inconsistent treatment of freedom of expression leads to consistent censorship, stifling speech across the ideological spectrum."

 

[d4m10n]

She destroyed her reputation by being intentionally abrasive, ignoring an explicit warning from her boss to stop engaging in pointless flame wars.

Surely Felicia Sonmez deserved a second chance.

 

[Darat]

I did not call for anyone to get fired. Would you now please do me the return courtesy of answering my question?

That is your definition then, a call for someone to be fired? (Why I didn’t ask another member a question has nothing to do with the question I asked you.)

 

[Darat]

Your point 2 was “Two, neither Shapiro nor anyone else could function under these terms.”

If your point was correct or even substantially correct they would have no or next to no faculty, that they do demonstrates that other people could and do function under those terms.