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The Russian Invasion of the Ukraine.

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Meadmaker said:
I'm pretty skeptical about a lot of the good news I'm hearing from Ukraine. Killing thousands while losing a couple of hundred against an enemy that's better equipped just doesn't seem realistic.
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how better equipped do you think they are?

What we have seen so far shows they have no tactical situational or awareness.
Advancing through contested or enemy held territory in to prepared resistance needs well trained and skilled troops. We aren’t seeing any evidence of this.
Ukrainian tactics seem to be to attack from prepared ambush positions then to retreat to a new position.
that they would be taking higher casualties than the Ukrainians is not a surprise.
 
Captain_Swoop said:
how better equipped do you think they are?

What we have seen so far shows they have no tactical situational or awareness.
Advancing through contested or enemy held territory in to prepared resistance needs well trained and skilled troops. We aren’t seeing any evidence of this.
Ukrainian tactics seem to be to attack from prepared ambush positions then to retreat to a new position.that they would be taking higher casualties than the Ukrainians is not a surprise.
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See "American Revolution" or "Vietnam War" for examples of the success of this strategy.
 
SuburbanTurkey said:
Are the invading Russian troops that much better equipped?

The Ukrainian citizens getting AKs handed out to them aren't taking out armor or tanks, but I get the impression that the Ukrainian regular armed forces are pretty well equipped with anti-armor weapons.
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The fog of war is a bit too thick to see through, but I just can't believe a 25 to 1 kill ratio against an enemy that is still holding on to the areas surrounding the major cities. It's too good to be true.

I also heat about fierce fighting, and a couple of hundred dead. Something doesn't add up.
 
Meadmaker said:
I'm pretty skeptical about a lot of the good news I'm hearing from Ukraine. Killing thousands while losing a couple of hundred against an enemy that's better equipped just doesn't seem realistic.
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How much better equipped are they? They were a lot better equipped in the winter war but lost men by the bucketful because they didn't have the doctrine and the Fins had plenty of weapons that could take out russian superior armor.

WIth the getting lots of anti tank weapons into the country and fighting from ambush at I could see highly one-sided body counts as possible.
 
Captain_Swoop said:
BBC RollingEarlier it was reported that the talks kept being postponed due to logistical and safety issues.

In his address on Sunday, Ukrainian President Zelensky said that he didn’t expect a breakthrough from these talks.
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I'm reminded of the episodes of MASH in which there would be updates on the status of the peace talks between North Korea and South Korea. At one point, they finally agreed on the size and shape of the table at which the talks would occur.
 
shemp said:
See "American Revolution" or "Vietnam War" for examples of the success of this strategy.
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More like the tactics used by the Russians and Germans in their various fighting retreats in WW2 across the same territory. Tactics that worked then will work across the same ground now.
 
Mike! said:
I hope whoever Ukraine sent to the so called "peace talks" was informed not to accept any offered refreshments, no matter how hungry or thirsty they might be.
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I'm sure the Ukrainians who attended are both very brave, and well aware of the risks.
 
Meadmaker said:
I'm pretty skeptical about a lot of the good news I'm hearing from Ukraine. Killing thousands while losing a couple of hundred against an enemy that's better equipped just doesn't seem realistic.
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Russia isn't better equipped though. Both Russia and Ukraine are equipped with the same late Soviet era stuff. Their respective upgrade programs for this older equipment are probably on par. Likewise their training and maintenance programs.

If I had to guess, I'd guess that Russia probably has more artillery especially rocket artillery,but Ukraine is getting more and better anti tank weapons. Ukraine probably has a better logistics situation and a better morale situation.

I don't know where this meme of the better equipped Russian is coming from.
 
Sky News says that once again Russian state media sites 'hacked' to display messages such as: 'Putin is forcing us to lie and is putting us in danger...It's not our war, let's stop him!'

Update on this

The website of Russian state news agency TASS appears to have been hacked.
Earlier, the regular site appeared to have been replaced with an anti-war message.
"We urge you to stop this madness, do not send your sons and husbands to certain death," the message read.
"Putin is forcing us to lie and is putting us in danger...It's not our war, let's stop him!"
Now an error message appears when trying to access the site.
 
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The Ukraine delegation includes Defence Minister Oleksiy Reznikov and Deputy Foreign Minister Mykola Tochytskyi. Russian Deputy Defence Minister Alexander Fomin and Russian Ambassador to Belarus Boris Gryzlov are also among those there.
 
Russian owner of London Evening Standard uses paper to urge Putin to stop the killing

Media mogul Evgeny Lebedev has used the newspaper he owns to appeal to Vladimir Putin to stop the invasion of Ukraine.
Writing in the newspaper, the crossbench peer - addressing Mr Putin - said: "I plead with you to use today's negotiations to bring this terrible conflict in Ukraine to an end."

In a statement published alongside a photograph of a paramedic performing CPR on a girl injured by shelling, Lord Lebedev said: "On this page are the final minutes of a six-year-old child fatally injured by shells that struck her Mariupol apartment block on Sunday.
"She is still wearing her pink jacket as medics fight to save her. But it is too late. Other children, and other families, are suffering similar fates across Ukraine.
"As a Russian citizen I plead with you to stop Russians killing their Ukrainian brothers and sisters."
"As a British citizen I ask you to save Europe from war. As a Russian patriot I plead that you prevent any more young Russian soldiers from dying needlessly. As a citizen of the world I ask you to save the world from annihilation."
 
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Belarus military convoy filmed near Kobryn 30 km from the border with Ukraine. Of note is that each vehicle is marked with a painted red square, likely for the same friend-or-foe identification as the white Z painted on Russian military vehicles sent into Ukraine. It would seem perhaps that the Belarussian military is about to join the fray.

Of perhaps some comfort, most of the hardware in that convoy seems pretty obsolete.
 
jimbob said:
I'm sure the Ukrainians who attended are both very brave, and well aware of the risks.
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Their level of bravery is absolutely without question, it's the actual depths of Russian treachery that concerns me. I don't think even Putin would have the balls to just shoot them outright on the spot, but poison wouldn't be out of line for him one bit.
 
theprestige said:
Russia isn't better equipped though. Both Russia and Ukraine are equipped with the same late Soviet era stuff. Their respective upgrade programs for this older equipment are probably on par. Likewise their training and maintenance programs.
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Ukrainians might actually be better trained this time around. My understanding is that 2014 was something of a wake-up call.
 
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