Cont: 2020 Presidential Election part 3

[ponderingturtle]

It is a myth that cable news (or any other) needs to classify itself or any part of itself as "entertainment" or "news". There is no such official distinction, nor legal consequence for failing to fall within them.

That may be a valid MARKETING strategy, but there are no legal stakes.

It does effect their defenses to libel claims. If they were journalists they would have to show they did due dilligence in confirming something. As entertainers they say "who could possibly take anything we say as a statement of fact?"

 

[gnome]

It does effect their defenses to libel claims. If they were journalists they would have to show they did due dilligence in confirming something. As entertainers they say "who could possibly take anything we say as a statement of fact?"

If I recall correctly, the most prominent related case recently (Tucker Carlson) did not rely on whether he called himself an entertainer, but on his bad factual reputation itself.

I don't think such labeling would actually help a libel case. Unless there's an example I'm unaware of.

 

[JoeMorgue]

Well regardless of the legalize of it, that's obviously what they are doing socially/morally and they've openly admitted that their opinion pieces are not neutral.

 

[turingtest]

he still thinks he's won

Trump Tweets

Important News Conference today by lawyers on a very clear and viable path to victory. Pieces are very nicely falling into place. RNC at 12:00 P.M.

Let me guess, someone showed him this:

https://www.youtube.com/post/Ugzmek...054laejprv0acdp434krgsfyqwua2ae0lx54lw03c010c

Clear and viable path #1- getting more votes than the other guy.

Clear and viable path #2- getting more votes than the other guy in certain areas of the country.

Clear and viable path #3- when the other guy succeeds in both paths 1 and 2, call in the lawyers to muddy them and rub out the tracks he left.

 

[Andy_Ross]

He seems to be trying to pressure the governor in to cheating for him, second tweet today aimed at Kemp

Trump Tweets

Almost ZERO ballots rejected in Georgia this election. In years past, close to 4%. Not possible. Must have signature check on envelopes now. Very easy to do. Dems fighting because they got caught. Far more votes than needed for flip. Republicans must get tough!
@BrianKempGA

 

[MRC_Hans]

Trump Tweets

Thousands of uncounted votes discovered in Georgia counties. When the much more important signature match takes place, the State will flip Republican, and very quickly. Get it done! @BrianKempGA

This is a sure sign that he knows he can't do anything about it.

Hans

 

[Minoosh]

He seems to be trying to pressure the governor in to cheating for him, second tweet today aimed at Kemp

I wonder if he's getting low-key pushback from some GOP governors. Not necessarily Kemp, but broadly, I don't think even his public allies appreciated his non-leadership on Covid 19, and now he's lecturing actual executives who have run large branches of government, which Trump has no clue about. Same with GOP senators. Both batches of politicians potentially have a lot to lose if they strongly alienate half of their constituents, and IIRC these races are not their call to begin with. Their best bet is to steer clear of the controversy.

ETA: I'm still getting robocalls daily asking for money.

 

[pgwenthold]

I wonder if he's getting low-key pushback from some GOP governors. Not necessarily Kemp, but broadly, I don't think even his public allies appreciated his non-leadership on Covid 19, and now he's lecturing actual executives who have run large branches of government, which Trump has no clue about. Same with GOP senators. Both batches of politicians potentially have a lot to lose if they strongly alienate half of their constituents, and IIRC these races are not their call to begin with. Their best bet is to steer clear of the controversy.

ETA: I'm still getting robocalls daily asking for money.

What sin did you commit that warranted you getting Trump's call list?

 

[Horatius]

You need to divorce the news part from the opinion part.

The problem with that is, Fox viewers don't "divorce the news part from the opinion part". If they hear it on Fox, it's gospel truth to them, no matter whose mouth it comes out of.

 

[Minoosh]

What sin did you commit that warranted you getting Trump's call list?

When I was 18 I registered just to sign a "decriminalize marijuana" petition. This was in 1978 and I still thought Republicans valued personal liberty, so that's how I registered.

I caught on a couple of years later with the rise of the evangelicals but I stayed Republican. In 2018 I vaguely hoped it would keep my ballot from being "lost."

 

[Minoosh]

I know it's probably not in Biden's best interest to pursue this, but is anyone tracking cases of potential Republican voter fraud? If the Dems are doing it I'm 100 percent positive the GOP is doing it too. Why wouldn't Trump cheat? Or do they figure it can all be accomplished with voter suppression, armed "observers" and whatnot?

 

[gnome]

I honestly think most election manipulation beyond petty locals trying to pull a fast one, is not in voter fraud itself. I've said the analogy before, it's like trying to embezzle money by sending people to rob the tellers of a bank you partly own. A lot of risk for not very much reward. There are way better plays.

 

[Lurch]

I never said it was. But dismissing the seriousness of the sitting POTUS's attempt to do exactly that is...a mistake.


Maybe not. But I think he probably will, against his will and as un-enthusiastically as possible.


It's possible you might be one of those people too, right?
What I understand is going on here is that the political ground is being fertilized for some very strange fruit.

I'll throw in here my concurrence, and a missive against the kind of complacency SG is mooting and purveying.

We have a mainstream media entity--Fox--which is, what, the biggest player in the US? Even if it's "just the pundits" playing along, it's those very damnable creatures who the target market cleave to. And the market, added to via other right wing outlets, comprises some 40% of the populace.

Indeed it is the case that the ground is being prepared for a future authoritarian, certainly more competent than incompetrump.

The frog is on a slow boil. Not at a uniform rate, and even with a spell of cooling, but the heat is generally rising.

 

[Lurch]

You are still conflating the pundits with the news anchors. It's no secret to anyone here that Fox pundits push CTs.

As for audience size, Fox has plenty of people listening to those CTs. But even the news side of Fox is not considered mainstream news.

To the target audience, the pundits ARE the news.

 

[acbytesla]

I want the Democrats to improve their messaging

The Democrats need to quit playing the Republicans' game. They need to demand an end to this farce. While the Republicans are playing there little racist game of trying to disenfranchise citizens in Detroit and Philadelphia they are also ignoring that Trump lost America by 6 million votes. This has to be on the lips of every Democratic official and leading every writtten statement they make.

 

[Andy_Ross]

Rudy says

"It changes the result of the election in Michigan if you take out Wayne County"

"Your question is fundamentally flawed, when you're asking, 'where's the evidence?' You clearly don't understand the legal process"

"You're a totally discourteous person" -- Giuliani gets mad at a reporter who asks why so many lawsuits brought by the Trump campaign have been dropped

"In the middle of the night, after they've supposedly stop counting, and that's when the Dominion operators went in and injected votes"

"The recount in Georgia will tell us nothing because these fraudulent ballots will just be counted again."

 

[Andy_Ross]

Trump Tweets

Lawyers now on @newsmax, @OANN & maybe @FoxNews. An open and shut case of voter fraud. Massive numbers!

 

[quadraginta]

While I didn't take it to be an exact statistical analysis, I took it as more than hyperbole.

I did take what you said to mean, literally, "Just as many people believe Trump is plotting a coup as believe that the election was fraudulent."

It was intended more as "lots of people over here and lots of people over there" illustrating the divide.

It sounded like you intended to suggest an equivalence where none exists.

 

[dirtywick]

Fox is mainstream media, but Fox News is not mainstream news. It never officially changed its primary mission from news to entertainment; that's a myth. But has defended on-air personalities by saying they are essentially entertainers, not journalists.

there's a reason that I said mainstream media and not mainstream news

when i say the mainstream media is putting out conspiracy theories, you guys are explaining the difference between mainstream media and Fox News like it matters to the tens of millions of viewers who use this is a primary source of information.

fine then, i guess technically fox news can switch from entertainment to news as they battle libel claims in court. i don't think that matters much in millions of people's homes

 

[pgwenthold]

Trump Tweets

Lawyers now on @newsmax, @OANN & maybe @FoxNews. An open and shut case of voter fraud. Massive numbers!

To be fair, they are certainly open-and-shut cases.

They barely even get in the door before they lose.