"OK, Cindy, we need something that suggests Incestual Necrophilia..."

ImaginalDisc said:
You ask a question of Mephisto, without directing the question to him by name, in a public forum, with open discussion, call me a clown for doing what you've been doing as well, and then continue the ad hominem? Enough. Let's stick to the topic. You can insult me all you care to somewhere else.
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Look at the post in question. See that darker blue box? That's the post I'm repsonding to.

Tell you what, next time I'll go lie on a grave someplace so you'll respect my idea of self-expression, mmmkay?
 
ImaginalDisc said:
I'm criticizing your opnion, not your right to an opinion.
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While completely dodging the actual response to your rather snotty question.

Hey, no problem, intellectual dishonesty is protected speech too. I'm sure Jefferson would be proud of you.
 
Jocko said:
While completely dodging the actual response to your rather snotty question.

Hey, no problem, intellectual dishonesty is protected speech too. I'm sure Jefferson would be proud of you.
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Oh, my apologies. I must have missed your pointed, rational question amoungst the flaming, personal attacks, and misreprentation of my statments. I may perhaps have missed it while I was taking a power, or performing at a children's birthday party, or supporting anti-semites.
 
Jocko said:
Except I wasn't talking about Bush's makeup, or even Cindy's for that matter. I think everyone agrees that the photo is contrived/staged/whatever.

I guess it's this: would you support the idea of your mother acting this way, if you were in similar circumstances?
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I wouldn't care what my mother did after I die, and I don't see why so many other people care about what Cindy Sheehan does.

If you believe this is shameless publicity stunt why give it credence by passing it around - wouldn't it be better to let it lapse into obscurity in Vanity Fair or Ladies Home Journal?

If the problem is making fun of contrived photos, I'm guilty. I laughed hard at the photo of Bush militarily checking out "the enemy" through his fieldglasses with the lens caps still on - but that didn't involve the violent death of one of his relatives OR a family grave.
 
ImaginalDisc said:
Oh, my apologies. I must have missed your pointed, rational question amoungst the flaming, personal attacks, and misreprentation of my statments. I may perhaps have missed it I was taking a power, or performing a children's birthday party, or supporting anti-semites.
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Well, all I can suggest is that you set aside a little more time when you post. It's helpful for correctly identifying who's talking to whom and can help you avoid all manner of embarrassing situations.
 
Jocko said:
Yet, Sheehan supporters defend her statements that the insurgents are "freedom fighters" and her son "died for Israel." Accountability cuts both ways.
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Your making general statements, I support Sheehan's anti-war attitude, but I don't call the insurgents anything but murderous extremists and while I'm not sure Sheehan's son died for anything other than lies told by a U.S. President, I would never blame Israel.
 
Mephisto said:
I wouldn't care what my mother did after I die, and I don't see why so many other people care about what Cindy Sheehan does.
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Well, Cindy's in the spotlight because Cindy seeks the spotlight, and all the world loves a tragedy in progress.

If you believe this is shameless publicity stunt why give it credence by passing it around - wouldn't it be better to let it lapse into obscurity in Vanity Fair or Ladies Home Journal?
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I do believe it is such, but I haven't so much as mentioned it outside this thread so I'm not really helping perpetuate it.

If the problem is making fun of contrived photos, I'm guilty. I laughed hard at the photo of Bush militarily checking out "the enemy" through his fieldglasses with the lens caps still on - but that didn't involve the violent death of one of his relatives OR a family grave.
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Hey, tacky photo-ops are tacky photo-ops. If the subject lets him/herself look like an ass, that's his/her fault. I'm not defending Bush on that score.
 
Mephisto said:
Your making general statements, I support Sheehan's anti-war attitude, but I don't call the insurgents anything but murderous extremists and while I'm not sure Sheehan's son died for anything other tha lies told by a U.S. President, I would never blame Israel.
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Manny has the exhaustive link library on Sheehan's more questionable quotes, so I apologize that I don't have time to scrape 'em up myself... but she is on record expressing both sentiments.

But that's kinda my point... you can be anti-war without hoisting Sheehan onto your shoulders. Yet many people are glad to do so, baggage be damned.
 
Mephisto said:
Yeah, and a lot of us patriotic, disabled Vietnam veterans sure like to rationalize too.
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Oh noes, you have played your disabled veteran card. Now I must backpedal and try not to look insensitive. Oh wait, I'm not a coward who backs down from someone who exploits their own loss to fricken "win" an arguement. Its why I don't fall for the "you cant criticize Cindy because she lost son crap", why do you think it would work here?

By the way, Captain Rickey Mooney ex-SF who served one tour in vietnam thinks your wrong for fronting your disability like that.
 
corplinx said:
Oh noes, you have played your disabled veteran card. Now I must backpedal and try not to look insensitive. Oh wait, I'm not a coward who backs down from someone who exploits their own loss to fricken "win" an arguement. Its why I don't fall for the "you cant criticize Cindy because she lost son crap", why do you think it would work here?

By the way, Captain Rickey Mooney ex-SF who served one tour in vietnam thinks your wrong for fronting your disability like that.
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corplinx, you said "Jeez, you hippies and commies sure like to rationalize someone who whored their grief out to Vanity Fair. Its time to stop making excuses." If you're going to use such an inflamatory ad homimen, then you don't have much right to critisize someone for proving that they're neither a communist nor a hippie, but a disabled vet. You brought it up first.
 
ImaginalDisc said:
corplinx, you said "Jeez, you hippies and commies sure like to rationalize someone who whored their grief out to Vanity Fair. Its time to stop making excuses." If you're going to use such an inflamatory ad homimen, then you don't have much right to critisize someone for proving that they're neither a communist nor a hippie, but a disabled vet. You brought it up first.
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You haven't been here long "but commies and hippies" is a loving term that means nothing I use sometimes. Its supposed to be a flippant/glib 1980s macho-frat-Steve Dallas-like phrase.
 
corplinx said:
You haven't been here long "but commies and hippies" is a loving term that means nothing I use sometimes. Its supposed to be a flippant/glib 1980s macho-frat-Steve Dallas-like phrase.
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Ah. That may be what you imply, but that's not what's infered. Would you object if I affectionately called you a gun worshiping, jack-booted, goosestepping Nazi thug?
 
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Jocko said:
Manny has the exhaustive link library on Sheehan's more questionable quotes, so I apologize that I don't have time to scrape 'em up myself... but she is on record expressing both sentiments.
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No problem, I'm not aware of her questionable quotes and I can probably find them myself - as much as she may seem like a "flip-flopper," I can understand how that might be, like many parents who've lost children in Iraq, she may have been reaching for something to hold the memory close, and believing that supporting the President is the same as supporting the troops seems to be a common misnomer.


Jocko said:
But that's kinda my point... you can be anti-war without hoisting Sheehan onto your shoulders. Yet many people are glad to do so, baggage be damned.
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I'll concede that point to you squarely, since I am anti-war, but was so long before Sheehan's son even died. By the same token, however, you can be pro-war (or better yet, pro-Democracy in Iraq) without hoisting the likes of the Grand Inquisitors Bush & Cheney and their blatant smear tactics onto your shoulders.

Skeptic has done for this photo what many fundie Christians do for books and movies they want banned; bring it into view of a public that would have let it passed unnoticed. He is, in a way, more of a supporter of Cindy Sheehan than you or I.
 
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Mephisto said:
Skeptic has done for this photo what many fundie Christians do for books and movies they want banned; bring it into view of a public that would have let it passed unnoticed. He is, in a way, more of a supporter of Cindy Sheehan than you or I.
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If Skeptic had suggested that the picture should not be viewed then I would think that you have a point. I kinda think Skeptic wants it to be see. I know I do.
 
corplinx said:
By the way, Captain Rickey Mooney ex-SF who served one tour in vietnam thinks your wrong for fronting your disability like that.
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I didn't know Mickey Rooney was young enough (or tall enough) to have been in Special Forces. Are you sure it wasn't Special Events Services?
 
RandFan said:
If Skeptic had suggested that the picture should not be viewed then I would think that you have a point. I kinda think Skeptic wants it to be see. I know I do.
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Exactly my point - it was such a horribly-contrived, completely-partisan photograph showing one person's opinion of the war. If you agree with the accompanying message of the photo, it's best to pass it to as many people as possible. Otherwise (it would seem to me) it would be best to allow it to quietly die after a limited audience. To do anything else is like stepping in dookie and smelling it twice!

It's much like fundie X-tians complaining about sex & violence on TV - you don't have to watch it if you don't like it.
 
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It's irrelevant what she's protesting, she has a right to do so. Jocko, you're attempting to trivialize the point of her protest by ridiculing the method.

It's the other way around. The point of her protest is trivial--it's the same "impeach Bushitler the world's dumbest fascist" boilerplate nonsense we've heard a million time from the usual gang of idiots.

Her real goal, rather obviously, had long ago morphed from protesting the war to retaining her celebrity status for as long as possible. And for this, what matters is not the nominal "point" of her protest, but what outrageous things she does next to keep herself in the limelight.

She is prostituting her son's memory to get a beauty shot in Vanity Fair. The most generous intepretation I can give to this is that she had, in fact, gone insane from grief. The less generous ones are unprintable.
 
Skeptic said:
She is prostituting her son's memory to get a beauty shot in Vanity Fair.
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But you had no problems with the other women in Vanity Fair prostituting their looks and bodies to get a beauty shot in Vanity Fair? Tell, me Skeptic what are the Fall colors in vogue for makeup this year?
 
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