• Quick note - the problem with Youtube videos not embedding on the forum appears to have been fixed, thanks to ZiprHead. If you do still see problems let me know.

JFK Conspiracy Theories VII: Late November back in '63...

Status
Not open for further replies.
Yes, that's pretty much my conclusion too, after an exhaustive reading of all 26 volumes of the Warren Commission Hearings and Exhibits.

https://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/contents.htm

What led me to read all that was that reading the various critics, they would sometimes come to different conclusions after citing the same evidence. All of them, however, argued the Warren Commission got it wrong, but none pointed out how other critics got it wrong too.

I wanted to resolve it to my own satisfaction, and hence began my reading. Originally I was spending time on my lunch hour, after work, and Saturdays reading the volumes at the NYC Public Library (the big one - I worked in mid-town). But I eventually sprung for my own set of the 26 volumes - I bought that from The Presidents Box Bookshop in the 1980s for $2500 (that was back when $2500 was real money, at least to me). I wound up reading the volumes through twice and spent a lot of nights up until two or three in the morning. My conclusion was Conspiracy Theorists Lie.

They were, in short, committing every sin they claimed the Warren Commission committed, and then some.

Hank

PS: Here's the two trailers concerning the film:

https://www.d-word.com/documentary/725-Conspiracy-Theorists-Lie

I've been a member here for about a year but was one of those lurkers that are occasionally appealed to for a while before that. I spent about two months reading pretty solidly, catching up on this thread from part 1, post 1 to part 4, the one with the Wales, which had then just started.

I am aware your of own history regarding JFK :-)

It was reading here that informed me as to how mixed up conspiracists are.
 
Last edited:
Yes, that's pretty much my conclusion too, after an exhaustive reading of all 26 volumes of the Warren Commission Hearings and Exhibits.

https://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/contents.htm

What led me to read all that was that reading the various critics, they would sometimes come to different conclusions after citing the same evidence. All of them, however, argued the Warren Commission got it wrong, but none pointed out how other critics got it wrong too.

I wanted to resolve it to my own satisfaction, and hence began my reading. Originally I was spending time on my lunch hour, after work, and Saturdays reading the volumes at the NYC Public Library (the big one - I worked in mid-town). But I eventually sprung for my own set of the 26 volumes - I bought that from The Presidents Box Bookshop in the 1980s for $2500 (that was back when $2500 was real money, at least to me). I wound up reading the volumes through twice and spent a lot of nights up until two or three in the morning. My conclusion was Conspiracy Theorists Lie.

They were, in short, committing every sin they claimed the Warren Commission committed, and then some.

Hank

PS: Here's the two trailers concerning the film:

https://www.d-word.com/documentary/725-Conspiracy-Theorists-Lie

Which goes to prove that the CTs are still out there and still believe that a conspiracy occurred in this assignation and the WC hid the "truth" and lied to everybody. What I find interesting s that the most simple dynamics are disproved easily, but the CTs still don't get it. The main pro-conspiracy tell a suave appealing story that is full of fallacies that normal people get connected unless they do critical thinking that defeats the story with hard physical evidence and science.
 
The root of the JFK Assassination CTs is the Vietnam War.

The theories started in 1964 as Mark Lane did work for Oswald's mother. He, like any good defense lawyer, knowingly took advantage of the gray areas by using the conflicting testimonies which came out of of the chaos to weave a counter narrative.

Basically, "Forget what these two hundred people saw, I've got six witnesses who saw something else."

Lifton and other "researchers jumped into the CT game too, maybe because they genuinely believed there was a conspiracy, but mostly to make a buck. Even today a JFK CT book will sell well.

All of this occurred in the vacuum of the 1960s and 70s before the Zapruder Film became available to public viewing. By that time Hollywood movies had become more violent and gory thanks to evolving special makeup effects. By the time most Americans viewed the film they had been conditioned that the skull explodes outward from a frontal gunshot wound. It made the "Back and To the Left" nonsense believable to the average person who's never shot anyone, nor seen anyone shot with a high powered rifle. Hence the second gunman lunacy was given eternal life.

Flash forward to 2020. Americans are all too familiar with what one man with a gun can do. Oswald is just one of a list of shooters who killed someone on their lunch hour. The Assassination CTs are beginning to die off with the Boomers who spread them and accepted them as gospel. Younger Americans have grown up understanding that the US Government is fully capable of colossal blunders without resorting to false flags or conspiracies to manipulate the masses.
 
Look at how much damage Anders Breivik and Stephen Paddock did, to give two examples.

Neither had help.

I had not heard of him, but I was working offshore during that period and news came either through the internet or the three main TV channels. Interesting reading, exploded a bomb in a van and then a year later shot the remaining victims attributed to him. I wonder if he had been know as the bomber in the first incident when committing the second?
 
Damit, you guys, you got me back into this thing!! Anyway, this video from 1967(!!!) gave me a chuckle.




Holy crapperoni!!! How many recreations have they done?!! Won't the critics ever be satisfied? Sadly, I think not ...
 
Damit, you guys, you got me back into this thing!! Anyway, this video from 1967(!!!) gave me a chuckle.




Holy crapperoni!!! How many recreations have they done?!! Won't the critics ever be satisfied? Sadly, I think not …

Sadly indeed, but "critical" evaluations of the WC sells books, follow the money, for me that never happens as I have never bought a CT book. That is CT of ANY variety. :)

ETA: I applaud all those in this thread that started out a CT and after reviewing the facts, turned away from those beliefs.
 
Last edited:
Which is difficult to comprehend, because history shows that many people who kill or attempt to kill people of sufficient import that that action is called "assassination" rather then "murder", turn out to be nobodies.

James Earl Ray (MLK)
Sirhan Sirhan (RFK)
John Hinckley Jr (Pres. Ronald Reagan)
Mark David Chapman (John Lennon)
Gavrilo Princip (Archduke Ferdinand)
Nathuram Godse (Mahatma Gandhi)

All nobodies.

I agree they were all nobodies. However I should mention that both Gavrilo Princip and Nathuram Godse were part of actual conspiracies to assassinate their targets. In the case of Gavrilo it involved an organization called The Black Hand and involved members of the Serbian government. In the case of Nathuram it involved members of radical right-wing Hindu political group.
 
I agree they were all nobodies. However I should mention that both Gavrilo Princip and Nathuram Godse were part of actual conspiracies to assassinate their targets. In the case of Gavrilo it involved an organization called The Black Hand and involved members of the Serbian government. In the case of Nathuram it involved members of radical right-wing Hindu political group.

However no CT for the rest of the assassinations, regardless of the attempt by others in this thread to show a CT regarding JFK.
 
From my article "Faulty Evidence":

WC defenders note that the order form, money order, and envelope used to purchase the Mannlicher-Carcano were filled out in handwriting identified as Oswald's (see, for example, Moore 48). Furthermore, they point to Oswald's alleged use of the alias "Alek Hidell." The rifle was sent to Oswald's post office box, but it was ordered in the name of, and addressed to, "A. Hidell." According to the Dallas police, Oswald was carrying an "Alek J. Hidell" ID card when he was arrested. Here's where things get interesting.

To begin with, Oswald was at work when he is said to have purchased the money order (Summers 213). So who bought the money order? If Oswald didn't buy it, why does the handwriting on it seem to be his? There are forgers who can copy a person's handwriting so well that it is difficult if not impossible to detect their fakery, especially if only a small quantity of writing is required. Also, the original order form and envelope were destroyed, so the FBI had to rely on microfilm copies of this evidence.

Another problem with the connection between Oswald and the Carcano is that nobody at Oswald's post office reported giving him a hefty package such as the kind in which a rifle would be shipped (Summers 59; Meagher 50). In fact, none of those postal workers reported ever giving Oswald any kind of a package. Oddly, the FBI apparently made no effort to establish that Oswald picked up the rifle from the post office, or that he had ever received a package of any kind there. Furthermore, postal regulations required that only those persons named on the post office box's registration form could receive items of mail from the box, yet there is no evidence that Oswald listed the name of Hidell on the form (Smith 290-291). In fact, in a report dated 3 June 1964, the FBI stated, "Our investigation has revealed that Oswald did not indicate on his application that others, including an 'A. Hidell,' would receive mail through the box in question" (Meagher 49, emphasis added).

There is no question that the amount of handwriting on the money order, envelope, and order form could have been faked. The famous "Oswald" note to "Mr. Hunt," signed by Lee Harvey Oswald, is a case in point, according to lone-gunman theorists themselves. WC defenders now claim the note was faked by the KGB. Yet, three renowned handwriting experts examined the note and concluded it was written by Oswald. The HSCA's handwriting experts could not decide if the handwriting on the note was Oswald's, but their doubts centered on the signature. They said the text of the note was in handwriting that appeared to be Oswald's. So if the "Mr. Hunt" note could have been faked, then the money order, order form, and envelope certainly could have been faked as well.

Most conspiracy theorists see the mail-order murder weapon and the "Hidell" ID card as evidence of a frame-up. They note the sheer stupidity of it all. In the Texas of 1963 Oswald could have bought a rifle across the counter with few if any questions asked. He could have done so and risked only a future debatable identification by some gun shop worker. Instead, we are told, Oswald ordered the murder weapon by using the alias "A. Hidell," gave his own post office box number, committed his handwriting to paper, and then went out to assassinate the President of the United States with this same "Hidell"-purchased rifle and while carrying a "Hidell" ID card in his wallet!

Many WC critics doubt that Oswald was carrying the "Hidell" ID card at the time of his arrest. They point to the fact that the Dallas police said nothing about the fake ID card until the FBI later announced that the alleged murder weapon had been ordered by an "A. Hidell." Critics also note that neither the phony identification nor the use of an alias is mentioned in the transcripts of the radio traffic between the arresting officers and the police station (Groden and Livingstone 183-184; Lane 133-136). One of the officers who brought Oswald to the police station, Paul Bentley, said he established Oswald's identify by going through his belongings, and there was no suggestion that Bentley had to decide whether his suspect was named Oswald or Hidell. Said Bentley, "On the way to City Hall I removed the suspect's wallet and obtained his name" (Groden and Livingstone 184). Additionally, not one of the arresting officers mentioned finding or seeing the Hidell ID card in their reports to the police chief two weeks after the assassination (Meagher 186).
 
From my article "Faulty Evidence":

WC defenders note that the order form, money order, and envelope used to purchase the Mannlicher-Carcano were filled out in handwriting identified as Oswald's (see, for example, Moore 48). Furthermore, they point to Oswald's alleged use of the alias "Alek Hidell." The rifle was sent to Oswald's post office box, but it was ordered in the name of, and addressed to, "A. Hidell." According to the Dallas police, Oswald was carrying an "Alek J. Hidell" ID card when he was arrested. Here's where things get interesting. To begin with, Oswald was at work when he is said to have purchased the money order (Summers 213).

A claim by Summers is not the equivalent of a proof. Oswald neither punched in or out, attendance was on the honor system at the Texas School Book Depository. Summers cannot establish Oswald was at work, at best he can assume it, or claim Oswald was supposedly at work.

This is typical Conspiracy Theory Inflation, where one CT makes a claim based on unproven and/or hidden assumptions, and another CT cites the claim as a given, ignoring the unproven/hidden assumptions.

Moreover, there is no doubt about Oswald's use of the Alek Hidell alias, that has been established beyond doubt. There is nothing 'alleged' about it. He put the name on one of his PO Boxes (#30061), as a person entitled to receive mail there: https://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh17/html/WH_Vol17_0362a.htm

For another example, he used it on handbills he distributed in New Orleans with a return address of his PO Box #30061, like this one (on right): https://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh26/html/WH_Vol26_0242b.htm

The use of the word 'alleged' by you is specious. It is established beyond any reasonable doubt he used that alias elsewhere (other than the purchase of the rifle).


So who bought the money order?

Based on the evidence and not the hidden assumption by Summers, Oswald bought the money order.


If Oswald didn't buy it, why does the handwriting on it seem to be his?

This doesn't seem all that difficult to figure out, once we understand the hidden assumption in your citation of Summers claim. The handwriting on the money order appears to be Oswald's because Oswald did buy it and it is therefore Oswald's handwriting.


There are forgers who can copy a person's handwriting so well that it is difficult if not impossible to detect their fakery, especially if only a small quantity of writing is required. Also, the original order form and envelope were destroyed, so the FBI had to rely on microfilm copies of this evidence.

You're now reduced to assuming what you must prove -- that the money order and the paper trail are forgeries. The money order is the original. There was nothing nefarious in the destruction of the original order form and envelope. Kleins Sporting Goods routinely had their paper documents reduced to microfilm and the originals discarded, as a space-saving gesture. Today, mail orders or phoned-in orders would be retained as electronic information in a computer database. Nothing nefarious about that either. And of course, if someone orders something via the internet, the business record would be entirely electronic. Nothing nefarious there either.

You're also ignoring the other evidence that indicates Oswald received the weapon. It includes, but is not limited to, the business records of Kleins Sporting Goods showing the rifle with the serial number C2766 was shipped to Oswald's PO box, Oswald's fingerprints on the C2766 rifle shipped by Kleins to Oswald's PO Box as a result of the order, photographs of Oswald taken with Oswald's own camera by Oswald's own wife holding that C2766 rifle shipped by Kleins to Oswald's PO Box as a result of the order, and Oswald's wife's own admission on the afternoon of the assassination that Oswald owned a rifle and kept it stored within in the Paine garage. But it was missing from the blanket in the Paine garage, and that rifle with the serial number of C2766 was recovered from the Depository shortly after the assassination.

You need to do more than just attempt to poke holes in the existing case against Oswald, you need to do a better job than the existing case does to explain the evidence with fewer holes in your theory than the historical explanation. This you have yet to attempt. I'd love to hear your theory about how all that evidence came to be in the state it is in. More than likely, it will amount to nothing more than assumptions that everything pointing to Oswald is faked, faked, faked, with no evidence to prove any of it.


Another problem with the connection between Oswald and the Carcano is that nobody at Oswald's post office reported giving him a hefty package such as the kind in which a rifle would be shipped (Summers 59; Meagher 50). In fact, none of those postal workers reported ever giving Oswald any kind of a package.

Oswald was shipped the rifle March 20, 1963. The assassination happened in November 22, 1963. Your argument here presumes clerks at a busy metropolitan post office would have some reason to remember a nondescript transaction from eight months prior. You have yet to establish this failure to recall one transaction is anything exceptional. When do you intend to start?


Oddly, the FBI apparently made no effort to establish that Oswald picked up the rifle from the post office, or that he had ever received a package of any kind there.

While the tracking of individual packages is the norm today by every shipping service, such was not the case in 1963. There was no individualized tracking of packages in 1963 that is routine today. There was no way to establish what you're faulting the FBI for failing to establish, as there was no individualized tracking of packages.

We know Oswald picked up the package because Oswald's prints were on the rifle! Photographs were discovered taken by Oswald's own camera (to the exclusion of all other cameras in the world) showing him holding the rifle! His own wife admitted he owned a rifle! The rifle was discovered at his place of work shortly after the assassination after he was seen with a long package on the morning of the assassination!

Given the above evidence, your asking for additional evidence that Oswald received the package containing the rifle appears to be disingenuous. What more would one need than photographs of him holding the rifle and his prints on the rifle and the rifle being recovered from his place of work to determine he received it and his wife admitting he owned a rifle that was determined to be missing from its normal hiding place?


Furthermore, postal regulations required that only those persons named on the post office box's registration form could receive items of mail from the box, yet there is no evidence that Oswald listed the name of Hidell on the form (Smith 290-291).

The portion of the form where Oswald would indicate who would be allowed to receive mail at the PO Box was discarded in accordance with PO regulations once the PO box was closed. And the PO Box was closed by Oswald once he moved to New Orleans after his April 10th assassination attempt on General Edwin Walker.

As noted, the photographs and fingerprints of Oswald connecting him with the rifle do an excellent job of closing that link you're pretending to be rigorously searching for.


In fact, in a report dated 3 June 1964, the FBI stated, "Our investigation has revealed that Oswald did not indicate on his application that others, including an 'A. Hidell,' would receive mail through the box in question" (Meagher 49, emphasis added).

This argument from Meagher assumes the portion of the form indicating whom Oswald listed to receive mail at his PO box was intact on the closed box, but PO regulations indicate that portion should be discarded when the box is closed. The evidence is that the FBI saw the form in its present state, and nowhere does it note that Hidell is allowed to receive mail at that PO Box (because the portion of the form where that should be noted was discarded upon the box being closed).
https://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh17/html/WH_Vol17_0353a.htm

Moreover, you (and all fellow critics, including Meagher) ignore that Oswald opened another PO Box upon his move to New Orleans, and that PO Box listed Hidell as entitled to receive mail at Oswald's new PO box. That PO Box is here:
https://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh17/html/WH_Vol17_0362a.htm

Compare the PO Box 30061 documentation to the PO Box 2915 documentation.


There is no question that the amount of handwriting on the money order, envelope, and order form could have been faked.

Your claims about what could have been done is not tantamount to evidence it was done. You have presented no evidence of forgery, only an allegation based upon the faulty and unproven assumption that Oswald was at work, ergo (you erroneously conclude) the form must be a forgery.


The famous "Oswald" note to "Mr. Hunt," signed by Lee Harvey Oswald, is a case in point, according to lone-gunman theorists themselves. WC defenders now claim the note was faked by the KGB. Yet, three renowned handwriting experts examined the note and concluded it was written by Oswald.

Gee, it's curious you don't name these three renowned handwriting experts nor cite a source for your claim.


The HSCA's handwriting experts could not decide if the handwriting on the note was Oswald's, but their doubts centered on the signature.

For a couple of reasons: Although we know Oswald as "Lee Harvey Oswald" and that's the way he's known in the history books, that person didn't sign his name that way, it was mostly just "Lee Oswald" or "L. H. Oswald" on documents asking for a signature. Moreover, "Harvey" is misspelled. It's hard to believe Oswald didn't know how to spell his own middle name.


They said the text of the note was in handwriting that appeared to be Oswald's.

Who is 'they' and where did they say this? Give me a actual citation, not just an untraceable assertion.


So if the "Mr. Hunt" note could have been faked, then the money order, order form, and envelope certainly could have been faked as well.

But you're comparing apples to oranges. It's your claim that some forgeries can be so good that they can't be discovered, but to support this you are apparently citing the HSCA experts who concluded the "Dear Mr. Hunt" letter (which only surfaced a decade later during the Watergate hearings when E.Howard Hunt was named and was sent anonymously to a conspiracy theorist) was a forgery!


Most conspiracy theorists see the mail-order murder weapon and the "Hidell" ID card as evidence of a frame-up.

They would have to, to theorize a conspiracy, wouldn't they?


They note the sheer stupidity of it all. In the Texas of 1963 Oswald could have bought a rifle across the counter with few if any questions asked. He could have done so and risked only a future debatable identification by some gun shop worker.

Contrast your claim above about the 'debatable ID by some gun shop worker' with your disingenuous insistence that postal clerks couldn't remember giving the package to Oswald. If the over-the-counter sale identification would be "debatable", wouldn't any ID of Oswald by a postal clerk be debatable as well? So why the double standard when you wish to argue for another purchase method. Moreover, the postal clerk wouldn't have any knowledge of what was shipped to Oswald from Kleins Sporting Goods (it could be a fishing rod or camping equipment, for example). The sales clerk could not only ID Oswald (if he remembered him) but attest Oswald was sold a rifle.

Moreover, you don't know if the store would have a policy of obtaining the customer's name and address and ask for ID (if for no other reason than to keep in touch with their customers). The store purchase would therefore leave business records that would establish where Oswald purchased the rifle, which conspiracy theorists would then conjecture could be forgeries.


Instead, we are told, Oswald ordered the murder weapon by using the alias "A. Hidell," gave his own post office box number, committed his handwriting to paper, and then went out to assassinate the President of the United States with this same "Hidell"-purchased rifle and while carrying a "Hidell" ID card in his wallet!

You are conflating two different actions here, leading your readers astray. Perhaps that's deliberate.

Oswald purchased the rifle in March of 1963 to assassinate General Walker a month later (April 10th, 1963), not President Kennedy in November 1963. At the time of the rifle purchase the Presidential trip hadn't been decided upon, the route was unknown, and Oswald wasn't working at the Depository.

He couldn't purchase the rifle over the counter and expect the sales clerk would forget about him in a month's time (if the clerk even had a reason to connect that particular sale to the Walker attempt, which is doubtful).

An argument can be made it's better to purchase the weapon via mail order. His goal in the Walker shooting was to remain undiscovered after the assassination of Walker (and indeed, he wasn't connected to that shooting until he killed JFK).

He had no such expectation of remaining undiscovered after the assassination of the President. For one thing, having smuggled the rifle into the Depository that morning, he couldn't expect to leave the building carrying the rifle - he had to leave it in the building. He knew the rifle could be - and of course was - eventually traced to him.

Until that point, the Hidell ID serves an entirely different short-term purpose that CTs everywhere fail to mention -- if the police are looking for Oswald as "a person of interest", given only his absence from the Depository -- the Hidell ID serves to establish he's not Oswald and perhaps leads to him remaining free.


Many WC critics doubt that Oswald was carrying the "Hidell" ID card at the time of his arrest.

Doubts are not evidence.


They point to the fact that the Dallas police said nothing about the fake ID card until the FBI later announced that the alleged murder weapon had been ordered by an "A. Hidell."

At which point Oswald was dead and there could be no trial. It was commonplace back then (and still is) to withhold evidence from the media to ensure that if someone comes forward to make a confession, not everything about the case that the person is confessing to has already appeared in the media.

Before the era of discovery, where the prosecution must release all their evidence to the defense, it was also commonplace to keep some evidence secret to use during the trial to destroy an alibi that the accused might have concocted that explains the evidence known to his defense, but fails to explain the evidence gathered that is not known to them.


Critics also note that neither the phony identification nor the use of an alias is mentioned in the transcripts of the radio traffic between the arresting officers and the police station (Groden and Livingstone 183-184; Lane 133-136). One of the officers who brought Oswald to the police station, Paul Bentley, said he established Oswald's identify by going through his belongings, and there was no suggestion that Bentley had to decide whether his suspect was named Oswald or Hidell. Said Bentley, "On the way to City Hall I removed the suspect's wallet and obtained his name" (Groden and Livingstone 184).

Did you ever notice that when you misplace something, it's always in the last place you look?

Always!

That's because once you find what you were looking for, you stop looking!

Did it ever occur to you that perhaps Bentley stopped looking for ID when he discovered that first piece of ID? And that the other piece wasn't discovered until a more detailed inspection of his wallet once Oswald was brought back to police headquarters?


Additionally, not one of the arresting officers mentioned finding or seeing the Hidell ID card in their reports to the police chief two weeks after the assassination (Meagher 186).

Maybe because the Hidell ID card wasn't discovered until after a more detailed inspection of his wallet once he was booked, so of course the arresting officers wouldn't know about it.

The first detailed inspection of his wallet by the FBI was on 11/23/63, as far as I know. This memo mentions the contents, mentions the fake Hidell ID, and notes Oswald was confronted with the fake ID, and notes Oswald declined to explain it. This was on 11/23/1963, one day after his arrest. The fake ID was recovered from Oswald's wallet. Live with it:

https://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wr/html/WCReport_0319b.htm

Hank
 
Last edited:
A claim by Summers is not the equivalent of a proof. Oswald neither punched in or out, attendance was on the honor system at the Texas School Book Depository. Summers cannot establish Oswald was at work, at best he can assume it, or claim Oswald was supposedly at work.

This is typical Conspiracy Theory Inflation, where one CT makes a claim based on unproven and/or hidden assumptions, and another CT cites the claim as a given, ignoring the unproven/hidden assumptions.

Moreover, there is no doubt about Oswald's use of the Alek Hidell alias, that has been established beyond doubt. There is nothing 'alleged' about it. He put the name on one of his PO Boxes (#30061), as a person entitled to receive mail there: https://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh17/html/WH_Vol17_0362a.htm

For another example, he used it on handbills he distributed in New Orleans with a return address of his PO Box #30061, like this one (on right): https://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh26/html/WH_Vol26_0242b.htm

The use of the word 'alleged' by you is specious. It is established beyond any reasonable doubt he used that alias elsewhere (other than the purchase of the rifle).




Based on the evidence and not the hidden assumption by Summers, Oswald bought the money order.




This doesn't seem all that difficult to figure out, once we understand the hidden assumption in your citation of Summers claim. The handwriting on the money order appears to be Oswald's because Oswald did buy it and it is therefore Oswald's handwriting.




You're now reduced to assuming what you must prove -- that the money order and the paper trail are forgeries. The money order is the original. There was nothing nefarious in the destruction of the original order form and envelope. Kleins Sporting Goods routinely had their paper documents reduced to microfilm and the originals discarded, as a space-saving gesture. Today, mail orders or phoned-in orders would be retained as electronic information in a computer database. Nothing nefarious about that either. And of course, if someone orders something via the internet, the business record would be entirely electronic. Nothing nefarious there either.

You're also ignoring the other evidence that indicates Oswald received the weapon. It includes, but is not limited to, the business records of Kleins Sporting Goods showing the rifle with the serial number C2766 was shipped to Oswald's PO box, Oswald's fingerprints on the C2766 rifle shipped by Kleins to Oswald's PO Box as a result of the order, photographs of Oswald taken with Oswald's own camera by Oswald's own wife holding that C2766 rifle shipped by Kleins to Oswald's PO Box as a result of the order, and Oswald's wife's own admission on the afternoon of the assassination that Oswald owned a rifle and kept it stored within in the Paine garage. But it was missing from the blanket in the Paine garage, and that rifle with the serial number of C2766 was recovered from the Depository shortly after the assassination.

You need to do more than just attempt to poke holes in the existing case against Oswald, you need to do a better job than the existing case does to explain the evidence with fewer holes in your theory than the historical explanation. This you have yet to attempt. I'd love to hear your theory about how all that evidence came to be in the state it is in. More than likely, it will amount to nothing more than assumptions that everything pointing to Oswald is faked, faked, faked, with no evidence to prove any of it.




Oswald was shipped the rifle March 20, 1963. The assassination happened in November 22, 1963. Your argument here presumes clerks at a busy metropolitan post office would have some reason to remember a nondescript transaction from eight months prior. You have yet to establish this failure to recall one transaction is anything exceptional. When do you intend to start?




While the tracking of individual packages is the norm today by every shipping service, such was not the case in 1963. There was no individualized tracking of packages in 1963 that is routine today. There was no way to establish what you're faulting the FBI for failing to establish, as there was no individualized tracking of packages.

We know Oswald picked up the package because Oswald's prints were on the rifle! Photographs were discovered taken by Oswald's own camera (to the exclusion of all other cameras in the world) showing him holding the rifle! His own wife admitted he owned a rifle! The rifle was discovered at his place of work shortly after the assassination after he was seen with a long package on the morning of the assassination!

Given the above evidence, your asking for additional evidence that Oswald received the package containing the rifle appears to be disingenuous. What more would one need than photographs of him holding the rifle and his prints on the rifle and the rifle being recovered from his place of work to determine he received it and his wife admitting he owned a rifle that was determined to be missing from its normal hiding place?




The portion of the form where Oswald would indicate who would be allowed to receive mail at the PO Box was discarded in accordance with PO regulations once the PO box was closed. And the PO Box was closed by Oswald once he moved to New Orleans after his April 10th assassination attempt on General Edwin Walker.

As noted, the photographs and fingerprints of Oswald connecting him with the rifle do an excellent job of closing that link you're pretending to be rigorously searching for.




This argument from Meagher assumes the portion of the form indicating whom Oswald listed to receive mail at his PO box was intact on the closed box, but PO regulations indicate that portion should be discarded when the box is closed. The evidence is that the FBI saw the form in its present state, and nowhere does it note that Hidell is allowed to receive mail at that PO Box (because the portion of the form where that should be noted was discarded upon the box being closed).
https://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh17/html/WH_Vol17_0353a.htm

Moreover, you (and all fellow critics, including Meagher) ignore that Oswald opened another PO Box upon his move to New Orleans, and that PO Box listed Hidell as entitled to receive mail at Oswald's new PO box. That PO Box is here:
https://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh17/html/WH_Vol17_0362a.htm

Compare the PO Box 30061 documentation to the PO Box 2915 documentation.




Your claims about what could have been done is not tantamount to evidence it was done. You have presented no evidence of forgery, only an allegation based upon the faulty and unproven assumption that Oswald was at work, ergo (you erroneously conclude) the form must be a forgery.




Gee, it's curious you don't name these three renowned handwriting experts nor cite a source for your claim.




For a couple of reasons: Although we know Oswald as "Lee Harvey Oswald" and that's the way he's known in the history books, that person didn't sign his name that way, it was mostly just "Lee Oswald" or "L. H. Oswald" on documents asking for a signature. Moreover, "Harvey" is misspelled. It's hard to believe Oswald didn't know how to spell his own middle name.




Who is 'they' and where did they say this? Give me a actual citation, not just an untraceable assertion.




But you're comparing apples to oranges. It's your claim that some forgeries can be so good that they can't be discovered, but to support this you are apparently citing the HSCA experts who concluded the "Dear Mr. Hunt" letter (which only surfaced a decade later during the Watergate hearings when E.Howard Hunt was named and was sent anonymously to a conspiracy theorist) was a forgery!




They would have to, to theorize a conspiracy, wouldn't they?




Contrast your claim above about the 'debatable ID by some gun shop worker' with your disingenuous insistence that postal clerks couldn't remember giving the package to Oswald. If the over-the-counter sale identification would be "debatable", wouldn't any ID of Oswald by a postal clerk be debatable as well? So why the double standard when you wish to argue for another purchase method. Moreover, the postal clerk wouldn't have any knowledge of what was shipped to Oswald from Kleins Sporting Goods (it could be a fishing rod or camping equipment, for example). The sales clerk could not only ID Oswald (if he remembered him) but attest Oswald was sold a rifle.

Moreover, you don't know if the store would have a policy of obtaining the customer's name and address and ask for ID (if for no other reason than to keep in touch with their customers). The store purchase would therefore leave business records that would establish where Oswald purchased the rifle, which conspiracy theorists would then conjecture could be forgeries.




You are conflating two different actions here, leading your readers astray. Perhaps that's deliberate.

Oswald purchased the rifle in March of 1963 to assassinate General Walker a month later (April 10th, 1963), not President Kennedy in November 1963. At the time of the rifle purchase the Presidential trip hadn't been decided upon, the route was unknown, and Oswald wasn't working at the Depository.

He couldn't purchase the rifle over the counter and expect the sales clerk would forget about him in a month's time (if the clerk even had a reason to connect that particular sale to the Walker attempt, which is doubtful).

An argument can be made it's better to purchase the weapon via mail order. His goal in the Walker shooting was to remain undiscovered after the assassination of Walker (and indeed, he wasn't connected to that shooting until he killed JFK).

He had no such expectation of remaining undiscovered after the assassination of the President. For one thing, having smuggled the rifle into the Depository that morning, he couldn't expect to leave the building carrying the rifle - he had to leave it in the building. He knew the rifle could be - and of course was - eventually traced to him.

Until that point, the Hidell ID serves an entirely different short-term purpose that CTs everywhere fail to mention -- if the police are looking for Oswald as "a person of interest", given only his absence from the Depository -- the Hidell ID serves to establish he's not Oswald and perhaps leads to him remaining free.




Doubts are not evidence.




At which point Oswald was dead and there could be no trial. It was commonplace back then (and still is) to withhold evidence from the media to ensure that if someone comes forward to make a confession, not everything about the case that the person is confessing to has already appeared in the media.

Before the era of discovery, where the prosecution must release all their evidence to the defense, it was also commonplace to keep some evidence secret to use during the trial to destroy an alibi that the accused might have concocted that explains the evidence known to his defense, but fails to explain the evidence gathered that is not known to them.




Did you ever notice that when you misplace something, it's always in the last place you look?

Always!

That's because once you find what you were looking for, you stop looking!

Did it ever occur to you that perhaps Bentley stopped looking for ID when he discovered that first piece of ID? And that the other piece wasn't discovered until a more detailed inspection of his wallet once Oswald was brought back to police headquarters?




Maybe because the Hidell ID card wasn't discovered until after a more detailed inspection of his wallet once he was booked, so of course the arresting officers wouldn't know about it.

The first detailed inspection of his wallet by the FBI was on 11/23/63, as far as I know. This memo mentions the contents, mentions the fake Hidell ID, and notes Oswald was confronted with the fake ID, and notes Oswald declined to explain it. This was on 11/23/1963, one day after his arrest. The fake ID was recovered from Oswald's wallet. Live with it:

https://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wr/html/WCReport_0319b.htm

Hank

That was very interesting. However I think you are engaged in a hopeless task CTer's will always find ways to deny evidence etc. Think up excuses etc., for the lack of evidence for their fantasies.

I always am amused by the way CTer's will assume a conspiracy. In other words they will assume what needs to be proved. And they will assume forgery and then think that the mere possibility of forgery is proof of some kind even if there is no evidence of forgery. And of course they will embrace "evidence" that "proves" their contentions without seriously questioning it, even if the circumstances of it appearing are dubious.

The Hunt letter appeared more than 10 years after JFK assassination, from an anonymous source. So we don't know were it came from etc. If the letter was "evidence" of Lee doing it alone you can be sure CTer's would seriously question it. Nope instead they by and large embrace it. The letter is dubious for reasons given about certain peculiarities in it that don't fit Lee.

There are many examples of this. Like the virtually automatic acceptance of the "magic bullet" nonsense. They created a mythological placement for JFK and Connelly, which is easily shown to be wrong, and then talk about this evidence showing the absurdity of the "magic bullet".

I also find particularly amusing stuff about the shots being impossible or unusually difficult. All hogwash. Lee was a Marksman in the army. The shots were not that difficult. This nonsense about the shots being impossible or very, very difficult is presented has evidence Lee didn't do - hence conspiracy!

What I also find amusing is the notion that if there was a conspiracy it was a high level one involving super powerful individuals and institutions., who of course can cover up everything. Well a conspiracy can involve just one other person.

I am also amused by the notion so many CTer's have that because something is possible that is some how evidence for it.

CTer's also sometimes argue that a lone nut job killing JFK is implausible. Do I really have to list the nobodies who have, and sometimes tried, and sometimes succeeded in killing US presidents to show that the lone gunman thing is extremely plausible.

It is just so frustrating.
 
---snip---
I also find particularly amusing stuff about the shots being impossible or unusually difficult. All hogwash. Lee was a Marksman in the army. The shots were not that difficult. This nonsense about the shots being impossible or very, very difficult is presented has evidence Lee didn't do - hence conspiracy!

---snip---

Small quibble here. Oswald was rated "Sharpshooter" in the Marine Corps, rather than the Army.
Marine Sharpshooter is their second of three grades, qualification being done at 500 yards. The Marines consider their marksmanship standards higher than the Army (I'll let the members of those services argue that out). The point being, the shooting was well within Oswald's demonstrated capability.
I've been to the Sixth Floor Museum. The shot is easily within my skills, and I'm only a USAF qualified Expert Marksman (which the Army and Marines only consider proof that I won't shoot myself in the foot nine times out of ten).
 
That was very interesting. However I think you are engaged in a hopeless task CTer's will always find ways to deny evidence etc. Think up excuses etc., for the lack of evidence for their fantasies.

I don't write the responses for the CTs whose minds are made up, but for the lurkers who might wander in here wondering whether there was a conspiracy or not.

I harbor no illusions that I can convert any conspiracy theorist who posts here, especially not one like Mike Griffith (AKA bobtaftfan), who has a long history of being a CT and even has his own website with a section devoted to his own articles on the assassination. Did you notice he only cites from conspiracy authors and appears to have done no independent research to validate their claims?

I understand I'd be trying to hold back the Red Sea to try to convince Griffith that Oswald did it. He won't even debate here. He is a drive-by poster ... he'll typically post something and then wait a few months and post something else. But he won't engage and won't try to actually debate the case.

Because his evidence of conspiracy amounts to nothing more than assumptions of conspiracy and mis-interpretations and misunderstandings of the evidence.

Hank
 
Wow, "Faulty Evidence"...I love ironically named articles.

The logic in that piece spiraled so fast it rear-ended itself.

Forget the fact that a lot people saw Oswald with the Carcano, forget his finger prints ARE STILL ON THE RIFLE TODAY, forget that JFK wasn't planning to visit Dallas when he ordered the weapon, forget that Oswald left Dallas after using the Carcano to shoot at General Walker and the only reason he returned to Dallas was because Marina left him to return there,forget that Oswald went to Mexico City to get a visa to Cuba and there was a 50/50 chance he might have received one, forget that Oswald was the only TSBD employee to leave after the shooting, forget that Oswald shot officer JD Tippit, and forget that Oswald attempted to shoot a second Dallas police officer with the same gun. Forget all that.

Oswald didn't a job at the TSBD until October 15. JFK's trip to Texas isn't confirmed until November 4, his visit to the Trademart isn't announced until November 8, the motorcade isn't announced until November 16, and parade route isn't published until November 21 - the day before the assassination.

In what world do you "Frame" a guy for killing a target that isn't planning to be in the city where your patsy lives? Why would you "Frame" a guy who then moves to New Orleans after you buy your set-up rifle? If Oswald didn't know he was being set up, why does he flee the city after someone tries to kill Walker? What if your patsy gets a job somewhere other than the TSBD and it's far from the parade route? What if the Cuban embassy told Oswald they'd love to have him move to Havana on the spot? Why buy a 6.5x52mm caliber rifle instead of a .306 which was and is universal for hunting rifles?

This line of conspiracy theory is so weak it dies in child birth.
 
Small quibble here. Oswald was rated "Sharpshooter" in the Marine Corps, rather than the Army.
Marine Sharpshooter is their second of three grades, qualification being done at 500 yards. The Marines consider their marksmanship standards higher than the Army (I'll let the members of those services argue that out). The point being, the shooting was well within Oswald's demonstrated capability.
I've been to the Sixth Floor Museum. The shot is easily within my skills, and I'm only a USAF qualified Expert Marksman (which the Army and Marines only consider proof that I won't shoot myself in the foot nine times out of ten).

Oswald trained at 200, 300, and 500 yards in the Marines. The longest shot in the assassination was determined to be 88 yards - one SIXTH the longest distance he was trained at.

Here's a page from his Marine Corps score book:
https://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh16/html/WH_Vol16_0344a.htm

He scored 48 of a possible 50 at 200 yards, rapid fire (right side of page).

Yeah, he could make those shots. And in fact, the ballistic evidence confirms he did. The rifle recovered was his. The three shells recovered from the sniper's nest window were fired from his weapon to the exclusion of all other weapons in the world. The two large fragments recovered from the limo (most likely remnants from the head shot that killed JFK) were fired from his weapon to the exclusion of all other weapons in the world. The nearly whole bullet recovered at Parkland Hospital after falling off Connally's stretcher was fired from his weapon to the exclusion of all other weapons in the world.

As one Warren Commission lawyer summed it up: "The best evidence Oswald could make the shots is the fact he did [make the shots]."

There is NO ballistic evidence pointing to another shooter. All the evidence points to Oswald's weapon. And there is no evidence anyone but Oswald knew he brought his weapon to the Depository that day, so the list of possible shooters is narrowed down to one - Oswald.

A good article: https://www.washingtonpost.com/loca...a5e7fa-48a7-11e3-bf0c-cebf37c6f484_story.html

Hank
 
Last edited:
To begin with, Oswald was at work when he is said to have purchased the money order (Summers 213). So who bought the money order? If Oswald didn't buy it, why does the handwriting on it seem to be his?

If Oswald had the ability to duck out of work for a few minutes to run a personal errand, your entire premise falls apart.
 
A claim by Summers is not the equivalent of a proof. Oswald neither punched in or out, attendance was on the honor system at the Texas School Book Depository. Summers cannot establish Oswald was at work, at best he can assume it, or claim Oswald was supposedly at work.

This is typical Conspiracy Theory Inflation, where one CT makes a claim based on unproven and/or hidden assumptions, and another CT cites the claim as a given, ignoring the unproven/hidden assumptions.

Moreover, there is no doubt about Oswald's use of the Alek Hidell alias, that has been established beyond doubt. There is nothing 'alleged' about it. He put the name on one of his PO Boxes (#30061), as a person entitled to receive mail there: https://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh17/html/WH_Vol17_0362a.htm

For another example, he used it on handbills he distributed in New Orleans with a return address of his PO Box #30061, like this one (on right): https://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh26/html/WH_Vol26_0242b.htm

The use of the word 'alleged' by you is specious. It is established beyond any reasonable doubt he used that alias elsewhere (other than the purchase of the rifle).




Based on the evidence and not the hidden assumption by Summers, Oswald bought the money order.




This doesn't seem all that difficult to figure out, once we understand the hidden assumption in your citation of Summers claim. The handwriting on the money order appears to be Oswald's because Oswald did buy it and it is therefore Oswald's handwriting.




You're now reduced to assuming what you must prove -- that the money order and the paper trail are forgeries. The money order is the original. There was nothing nefarious in the destruction of the original order form and envelope. Kleins Sporting Goods routinely had their paper documents reduced to microfilm and the originals discarded, as a space-saving gesture. Today, mail orders or phoned-in orders would be retained as electronic information in a computer database. Nothing nefarious about that either. And of course, if someone orders something via the internet, the business record would be entirely electronic. Nothing nefarious there either.

You're also ignoring the other evidence that indicates Oswald received the weapon. It includes, but is not limited to, the business records of Kleins Sporting Goods showing the rifle with the serial number C2766 was shipped to Oswald's PO box, Oswald's fingerprints on the C2766 rifle shipped by Kleins to Oswald's PO Box as a result of the order, photographs of Oswald taken with Oswald's own camera by Oswald's own wife holding that C2766 rifle shipped by Kleins to Oswald's PO Box as a result of the order, and Oswald's wife's own admission on the afternoon of the assassination that Oswald owned a rifle and kept it stored within in the Paine garage. But it was missing from the blanket in the Paine garage, and that rifle with the serial number of C2766 was recovered from the Depository shortly after the assassination.

You need to do more than just attempt to poke holes in the existing case against Oswald, you need to do a better job than the existing case does to explain the evidence with fewer holes in your theory than the historical explanation. This you have yet to attempt. I'd love to hear your theory about how all that evidence came to be in the state it is in. More than likely, it will amount to nothing more than assumptions that everything pointing to Oswald is faked, faked, faked, with no evidence to prove any of it.




Oswald was shipped the rifle March 20, 1963. The assassination happened in November 22, 1963. Your argument here presumes clerks at a busy metropolitan post office would have some reason to remember a nondescript transaction from eight months prior. You have yet to establish this failure to recall one transaction is anything exceptional. When do you intend to start?




While the tracking of individual packages is the norm today by every shipping service, such was not the case in 1963. There was no individualized tracking of packages in 1963 that is routine today. There was no way to establish what you're faulting the FBI for failing to establish, as there was no individualized tracking of packages.

We know Oswald picked up the package because Oswald's prints were on the rifle! Photographs were discovered taken by Oswald's own camera (to the exclusion of all other cameras in the world) showing him holding the rifle! His own wife admitted he owned a rifle! The rifle was discovered at his place of work shortly after the assassination after he was seen with a long package on the morning of the assassination!

Given the above evidence, your asking for additional evidence that Oswald received the package containing the rifle appears to be disingenuous. What more would one need than photographs of him holding the rifle and his prints on the rifle and the rifle being recovered from his place of work to determine he received it and his wife admitting he owned a rifle that was determined to be missing from its normal hiding place?




The portion of the form where Oswald would indicate who would be allowed to receive mail at the PO Box was discarded in accordance with PO regulations once the PO box was closed. And the PO Box was closed by Oswald once he moved to New Orleans after his April 10th assassination attempt on General Edwin Walker.

As noted, the photographs and fingerprints of Oswald connecting him with the rifle do an excellent job of closing that link you're pretending to be rigorously searching for.




This argument from Meagher assumes the portion of the form indicating whom Oswald listed to receive mail at his PO box was intact on the closed box, but PO regulations indicate that portion should be discarded when the box is closed. The evidence is that the FBI saw the form in its present state, and nowhere does it note that Hidell is allowed to receive mail at that PO Box (because the portion of the form where that should be noted was discarded upon the box being closed).
https://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh17/html/WH_Vol17_0353a.htm

Moreover, you (and all fellow critics, including Meagher) ignore that Oswald opened another PO Box upon his move to New Orleans, and that PO Box listed Hidell as entitled to receive mail at Oswald's new PO box. That PO Box is here:
https://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh17/html/WH_Vol17_0362a.htm

Compare the PO Box 30061 documentation to the PO Box 2915 documentation.




Your claims about what could have been done is not tantamount to evidence it was done. You have presented no evidence of forgery, only an allegation based upon the faulty and unproven assumption that Oswald was at work, ergo (you erroneously conclude) the form must be a forgery.




Gee, it's curious you don't name these three renowned handwriting experts nor cite a source for your claim.




For a couple of reasons: Although we know Oswald as "Lee Harvey Oswald" and that's the way he's known in the history books, that person didn't sign his name that way, it was mostly just "Lee Oswald" or "L. H. Oswald" on documents asking for a signature. Moreover, "Harvey" is misspelled. It's hard to believe Oswald didn't know how to spell his own middle name.




Who is 'they' and where did they say this? Give me a actual citation, not just an untraceable assertion.




But you're comparing apples to oranges. It's your claim that some forgeries can be so good that they can't be discovered, but to support this you are apparently citing the HSCA experts who concluded the "Dear Mr. Hunt" letter (which only surfaced a decade later during the Watergate hearings when E.Howard Hunt was named and was sent anonymously to a conspiracy theorist) was a forgery!




They would have to, to theorize a conspiracy, wouldn't they?




Contrast your claim above about the 'debatable ID by some gun shop worker' with your disingenuous insistence that postal clerks couldn't remember giving the package to Oswald. If the over-the-counter sale identification would be "debatable", wouldn't any ID of Oswald by a postal clerk be debatable as well? So why the double standard when you wish to argue for another purchase method. Moreover, the postal clerk wouldn't have any knowledge of what was shipped to Oswald from Kleins Sporting Goods (it could be a fishing rod or camping equipment, for example). The sales clerk could not only ID Oswald (if he remembered him) but attest Oswald was sold a rifle.

Moreover, you don't know if the store would have a policy of obtaining the customer's name and address and ask for ID (if for no other reason than to keep in touch with their customers). The store purchase would therefore leave business records that would establish where Oswald purchased the rifle, which conspiracy theorists would then conjecture could be forgeries.




You are conflating two different actions here, leading your readers astray. Perhaps that's deliberate.

Oswald purchased the rifle in March of 1963 to assassinate General Walker a month later (April 10th, 1963), not President Kennedy in November 1963. At the time of the rifle purchase the Presidential trip hadn't been decided upon, the route was unknown, and Oswald wasn't working at the Depository.

He couldn't purchase the rifle over the counter and expect the sales clerk would forget about him in a month's time (if the clerk even had a reason to connect that particular sale to the Walker attempt, which is doubtful).

An argument can be made it's better to purchase the weapon via mail order. His goal in the Walker shooting was to remain undiscovered after the assassination of Walker (and indeed, he wasn't connected to that shooting until he killed JFK).

He had no such expectation of remaining undiscovered after the assassination of the President. For one thing, having smuggled the rifle into the Depository that morning, he couldn't expect to leave the building carrying the rifle - he had to leave it in the building. He knew the rifle could be - and of course was - eventually traced to him.

Until that point, the Hidell ID serves an entirely different short-term purpose that CTs everywhere fail to mention -- if the police are looking for Oswald as "a person of interest", given only his absence from the Depository -- the Hidell ID serves to establish he's not Oswald and perhaps leads to him remaining free.




Doubts are not evidence.




At which point Oswald was dead and there could be no trial. It was commonplace back then (and still is) to withhold evidence from the media to ensure that if someone comes forward to make a confession, not everything about the case that the person is confessing to has already appeared in the media.

Before the era of discovery, where the prosecution must release all their evidence to the defense, it was also commonplace to keep some evidence secret to use during the trial to destroy an alibi that the accused might have concocted that explains the evidence known to his defense, but fails to explain the evidence gathered that is not known to them.




Did you ever notice that when you misplace something, it's always in the last place you look?

Always!

That's because once you find what you were looking for, you stop looking!

Did it ever occur to you that perhaps Bentley stopped looking for ID when he discovered that first piece of ID? And that the other piece wasn't discovered until a more detailed inspection of his wallet once Oswald was brought back to police headquarters?




Maybe because the Hidell ID card wasn't discovered until after a more detailed inspection of his wallet once he was booked, so of course the arresting officers wouldn't know about it.

The first detailed inspection of his wallet by the FBI was on 11/23/63, as far as I know. This memo mentions the contents, mentions the fake Hidell ID, and notes Oswald was confronted with the fake ID, and notes Oswald declined to explain it. This was on 11/23/1963, one day after his arrest. The fake ID was recovered from Oswald's wallet. Live with it:

https://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wr/html/WCReport_0319b.htm

Hank

Nice dissection, Hank.:thumbsup:
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Back
Top Bottom