UK - December 2019 General Election

[Information Analyst]

I think that some of the Corbyn fan club members here are already blaming everybody but Corbyn for the debacle is a sign you might be right.

Who has done that? All I see are a couple of people pointing out that they have heard ex-Labour voters claim their defections were for what are clearly ridiculous reasons. Lots of people had misgivings about Corbyn, but the level of press and social media smears are off the scale, particularly in comparison to the essentially free ride Johnson has got.

 

[Information Analyst]

That one seat is a Conservative gain from Labour in Blythe, which is a heartland Labour constituency that nobody could forsee ever returning anyone other than the Labour candidate. That Con gain is without doubt a bellwether for the election outcome as a whole.

Interesting to note that the turn-out there was down 1,631. The Labour Co-Op candidate got a whopping 7,042 less than the previous Labour MP; the Tories only gained 1,585 whilst Brexit Ltd grabbed 3,394. The LDs and Greens only gained a couple of hundred more each. Considering the previous Labour MP had been in since 1987, him standing down was probably a big factor, as well.

 

[Aidoneus]

Corbyn announced that he "will not lead the party in any future general election campaign."

Colour me surprised.

He has such significant support amongst Labour members and the Trade Unions that it honestly wouldn’t surprise me if he ends up running in the leadership race.

And he’d probably win, too.

 

[Lothian]

As a good socialist I've always been determined not to buy private health insurance, I even turned it down when it was offered free by my employer. It's now the first thing on my shopping list for the new year. I no longer feel the slightest inclination to consider the welfare of my fellow citizens. **** em. They've chosen to make this bed, they can bloody well lie in it.

I think it is important to realise that the Tories vote share this time increased by 1% from the last hung parliament and the large majority of people in the country voted for other parties. Don't let the parliamentary system give a misleading view of public support

 

[Information Analyst]

Does this count as a redo of the initial Brexit referendum? Seems like it settles the issue that a revote would have the same outcome.

Not really.

The Tories and Brexit Ltd. have 45.6% of votes.

The parties that are at least backing a second referendum have well over 50%.

 

[a_unique_person]

Let the blame game begin.

Ken Livingstone finds an old, reliable target: the Jews.



Can racism, sexism or Putin be far behind?

"The Jewish vote wasn't very helpful," Mr Livingstone said
"Jeremy should have tackled that issue far earlier than he did.
"It looks like the end for Jeremy, which is disappointing for me since I'm a close ally. I'm sure he'll have to resign tomorrow."

He appears to be saying Corben should have addressed the issue of anti-semitism in the Labour Party more directly since the response was a lot of Jewish people being urged to vote Tory.

 

[Darat]

He appears to be saying Corben should have addressed the issue of anti-semitism in the Labour Party more directly since the response was a lot of Jewish people being urged to vote Tory.

I doubt there are any constituencies that it made a significance impact.

 

[toto]

Not really.

The Tories and Brexit Ltd. have 45.6% of votes.

The parties that are at least backing a second referendum have well over 50%.[/QUOTE

I do not think you can necessarily count the votes of those voting Labour in the election as uniformly voting remain in any hypothetical 2nd referendum. I think it is very reasonable to conjecture that a 2nd referendum fought fiercely and simply by Boris Johnson et al would have resulted in another win for Leave. I also think an election trumps an advisory referendum (albeit one in which it was made explicit that the result WOULD be respected.) I say this as someone who voted remain.

 

[ceptimus]

Which of the defector MPs are likely to be re-elected? These are MPs who are either standing for a different party this time around, or are standing as independents.

Here's a list of the ones I can think of. I think all of these are standing somewhere, but I've not checked. There are probably others that I've forgotten:

David Gauke, Dominic Grieve, Sarah Wollaston, Sam Gyimah, Anna Soubry, Philip Lee, Chuka Umunna, Ann Milton, Luciana Berger, Angela Smith, Antoinette Sandbach, Frank Field, Mike Gapes, Chris Leslie, Gavin Shuker, Chris WIlliamson

I'd like all of these people to lose their well-paid jobs for turning their backs on the people that voted for them. If they'd called a by election when they abandoned their parties that would be different - but none of them did that.

I'm pleased to report that every one of these turncoats has been rejected by their electorate and thrown out of their jobs.

It will be great not to have to listen to MPs lecturing us that we are too stupid to know what we're voting for. I'll be particularly glad to hear much less from Soubry and Grieve from now on.

It should also serve as a warning to MPs not to leave the parties they were elected to serve. I expect that there will always be some privileged elitist arrogant MPs who think they know better than their voters. It would be nice if the government passed a new law to force a by election whenever a turncoat leaves or is permanently thrown out of their party, but I won't hold my breath waiting for that to happen.

 

[ceptimus]

Not really.

The Tories and Brexit Ltd. have 45.6% of votes.

The parties that are at least backing a second referendum have well over 50%.[/QUOTE

I do not think you can necessarily count the votes of those voting Labour in the election as uniformly voting remain in any hypothetical 2nd referendum

That's true of the SNP too. There's a significant minority of SNP voters who support the SNP for other reasons, but still want Brexit.

In fairness, I'm sure there are also a significant minority of Tory voters that were remain supporters. And even the smaller parties must have some voters who have the opposite view on Brexit to the majority of their party supporters.

Attempting to put every voter in a leave or remain box merely by seeing which party they voted for, is an exercise in futility.

 

[lionking]

He has such significant support amongst Labour members and the Trade Unions that it honestly wouldn’t surprise me if he ends up running in the leadership race.

And he’d probably win, too.

If you are right, and you may be, Labour will be dead for a generation.

 

[Darat]

I'm pleased to report that every one of these turncoats has been rejected by their electorate and thrown out of their jobs.

It will be great not to have to listen to MPs lecturing us that we are too stupid to know what we're voting for. I'll be particularly glad to hear much less from Soubry and Grieve from now on.

It should also serve as a warning to MPs not to leave the parties they were elected to serve. I expect that there will always be some privileged elitist arrogant MPs who think they know better than their voters. It would be nice if the government passed a new law to force a by election whenever a turncoat leaves or is permanently thrown out of their party, but I won't hold my breath waiting for that to happen.

No they haven't, just to name 2 Johnson and Mogg have got back in.

 

[ceptimus]

No they haven't, just to name 2 Johnson and Mogg have got back in.

As you know, neither of them stood in opposition to their own party. So your point is completely off-topic and irrelevant. But feel free to keep posting irrelevant remain-supporting memes - that what most of the posters in this thread like to do.

These are MPs who are either standing for a different party this time around, or are standing as independents.

 

[The Don]

If you are right, and you may be, Labour will be dead for a generation.

IMO unless the Conservative Party splits for some reason, they'll be in power for the rest of my life (I'm 52). In this I'm assuming that there'll be Scottish independence.

 

[Squeegee Beckenheim]

That's true of the SNP too. There's a significant minority of SNP voters who support the SNP for other reasons, but still want Brexit.

In fairness, I'm sure there are also a significant minority of Tory voters that were remain supporters. And even the smaller parties must have some voters who have the opposite view on Brexit to the majority of their party supporters.

Attempting to put every voter in a leave or remain box merely by seeing which party they voted for, is an exercise in futility.

This is the conumdrum. The election result is being presented as a clear mandate for Brexit (just as the local elections were), yet when it's pointed out that a majority of people voted for non-Brexit parties then the vote can't be considered in any way indicative of people's stance on Brexit.

 

[3point14]

This is the conumdrum. The election result is being presented as a clear mandate for Brexit (just as the local elections were), yet when it's pointed out that a majority of people voted for non-Brexit parties then the vote can't be considered in any way indicative of people's stance on Brexit.

But it's not an issue now, is it?

Regardless of 'the will of the people' or other such bollocks, the liar in chief and his handlers have all the parliamentary votes to do just as they please now.

 

[Darat]

As you know, neither of them stood in opposition to their own party. So your point is completely off-topic and irrelevant. But feel free to keep posting irrelevant remain-supporting memes - that what most of the posters in this thread like to do.

Yes they did, they voted against leaving the EU numerous times.

 

[Darat]

But it's not an issue now, is it?



Regardless of 'the will of the people' or other such bollocks, the liar in chief and his handlers have all the parliamentary votes to do just as they please now.

Yep

 

[Information Analyst]

Labour was losing votes to the Brexit Party.

No, Labour lost votes to Brexit Ltd., and Conservatives on the one hand, and the Lib-Dems, SNP, Plaid Cymru, Greens, etc. on the other. There's a lot of evidence that the first grouping was outnumbered by the second.

 

[Vixen]

I think that some of the Corbyn fan club members here are already blaming everybody but Corbyn for the debacle is a sign you might be right.

You obviously do not understand how deep the smearing campaign went. In one article yesterday in the DM there was a report supposedly about how the election was going and at the end of it there was tagged on a picture of Corbyn laying a wreath decades ago at some 'terrorist's' monument followed by a list of all his 'marxist' activities. (As an aside Gove was saying this morning, 'Jews are now safe'.)

Then they photo-shopped a picture of Diane Abbott supposedly showing her wearing two left-foot shoes in what was clearly dog-whistle racism in their determination to stereotype her as a *******, with the underlying message, would you trust this demented bag to be in charge of security?