UK - December 2019 General Election

[Giz]

Honestly, I don't think manifestos came into it. Four years of lies about Brexit and the public perception of Corbyn have brought us here.

The first stage is grief

But the following stages should involve accepting that there were serious problems with Corbyn

 

[Ethan Thane Athen]

Honestly, I don't think manifestos came into it. Four years of lies about Brexit and the public perception of Corbyn have brought us here.

Agreed. Heard a 'lifelong labour voter' in the pub last week spouting about how he never thought he'd vote Tory but he was going to because Labour were ignoring the fact 'we won Brexit and Corbyn was a commie'. This is in an area where we're a net beneficiary from Europe and definitely won't be a beneficiary from a Tory Govt...

 

[P.J. Denyer]

The first stage is grief

But the following stages should involve accepting that there were serious problems with Corbyn

I never said there weren't.

 

[P.J. Denyer]

Agreed. Heard a 'lifelong labour voter' in the pub last week spouting about how he never thought he'd vote Tory but he was going to because Labour were ignoring the fact 'we won Brexit and Corbyn was a commie'. This is in an area where we're a net beneficiary from Europe and definitely won't be a beneficiary from a Tory Govt...

There was one on LBC yesterday saying that he was lifelong Labour but would vote Boris so there wouldn't be Billy Bragg on the radio all the time.

 

[dudalb]

If Labor keeps Corbyn on as leader after this debacle they are truly brain dead.
I also think the UK needs to adapt fixed terms for Parliament so if the people get really mad they don't have to wait five years to make changes in Parliament.

 

[dudalb]

Agreed. Heard a 'lifelong labour voter' in the pub last week spouting about how he never thought he'd vote Tory but he was going to because Labour were ignoring the fact 'we won Brexit and Corbyn was a commie'. This is in an area where we're a net beneficiary from Europe and definitely won't be a beneficiary from a Tory Govt...

Let's blame everybody but Labor for Labor's defeat.

 

[dudalb]

I am getting concerned that both the UK and the US are going to have a disaster happen before they relies how bad this sharp turn to the right is. They have not suffered enough yet ,sadly.
I think the US will recover quicker then UK because we can change Congress much quicker then the UK can. THey are stuck with long term Parliaments.

 

[dudalb]

Problem with Corbyn is he was flawed enough so that even if the Tory press lied about him, the lies were believable.

 

[P.J. Denyer]

If Labor keeps Corbyn on as leader after this debacle they are truly brain dead.
I also think the UK needs to adapt fixed terms for Parliament so if the people get really mad they don't have to wait five years to make changes in Parliament.

The Conservatives plan to scrap the Fixed Term Parliament Act that they themselves introduced and have had two early elections and precisely zero full terms under.

ETA: But I agree Corbyn needs to go.

 

[dudalb]

That would be great. The U.K. needs an electable Labour Party... but I’m not sure Corbyn or his fan club will listen to reason. Moderate Labour might need to start a new club.

I think that some of the Corbyn fan club members here are already blaming everybody but Corbyn for the debacle is a sign you might be right.

 

[dudalb]

Oh I know! Cameron only granted referendums that he thought his side would comfortably win.
But the genie’s not going back in the bottle any time soon. If support for independence becomes overwhelming then things will get ugly.

Maybe the SNP should start writing a document beginning "In the Course Of Human Events"....

 

[a_unique_person]

Labour is ahead 4 to 1.

 

[dudalb]

The Conservatives plan to scrap the Fixed Term Parliament Act that they themselves introduced and have had two early elections and precisely zero full terms under.

ETA: But I agree Corbyn needs to go.

It's a good thing in the US Fixed Terms are written into the Constiution, and are almost impossible for politicians to goof around with.
In fact they can't unless they can get two thirds of both houses of Congress to agree, and then Two Thirds of the states to ratify.

 

[dudalb]

Labour is ahead 4 to 1.

If this is a joke, it ain't funny,

 

[Andy_Ross]

Agreed. Heard a 'lifelong labour voter' in the pub last week spouting about how he never thought he'd vote Tory but he was going to because Labour were ignoring the fact 'we won Brexit and Corbyn was a commie'. This is in an area where we're a net beneficiary from Europe and definitely won't be a beneficiary from a Tory Govt...

Heard exactly the same things tonight.

Nearly had a fight with the landlord and most of the regulars in one pub
.

 

[P.J. Denyer]

It's a good thing in the US Fixed Terms are written into the Constiution, and are almost impossible to change.

Yes, I thought a proper fixed term to avoid cherry picking an election date was a damned good idea. The way it's worked out shows how badly it was written.

 

[dudalb]

Indeed, critical national infrastructure should not be left to the market....

But who decides what is critical national infrastructure....
And forgive me if I get the feeling you don't like the market very much anyway.

 

[dudalb]

Yes, I thought a proper fixed term to avoid cherry picking an election date was a damned good idea. The way it's worked out shows how badly it was written.

Real problem is it's too easy to change in the UK.
I don't want to get into a debate here, but having a written constitution has it advantages.

 

[dudalb]

Probably very happy in Moscow over this.

 

[P.J. Denyer]

Real problem is it's too easy to change in the UK.
I don't want to get into a debate here, but having a written constitution has it advantages.

Ours is written, just not in one place. Being hard or easy to change both have their advantages and disadvantages. In this case I'd argue that writing in it's own loophole was the problem.