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Moderated Trump announces new concentration camps

Trebuchet said:
And you can't blame it all on Trump. ICE and CBP have been permeated with racism for a long time. Trump has just empowered them to be more open about it.
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Probably they're not being any more open about it than before. It's just that Trump has prompted the media to actually report on it.

I can point you to evidence of the same conditions during the Obama administration. But somehow that didn't made the news the way it does now.
 
Cainkane1 said:
No, the "asylum seekers" are criminals crossing the border illegally translates into criminality. Their children are victims not of American laws and policies but of their parents or whoever brought them here in the first place.
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You don't understand how the US immigration system works, nor how international law works. The people under discussion are asylum seekers. Many of them are children.

You should be ashamed of yourself.
 
Cainkane1 said:
Unless you define a prison as a concentration camp what we are seeing with the illegal immigrants is not a traditional cons=centration camp but a place to hold the criminals crossing the border into America illegally.
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But that's not even true. They are the children of people who seek to come live in the US. And the conditions are not comparable to a real prison.

It's incredible how far some here will go to justify this sort of treatment for children.
 
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Ziggurat said:
Literally no one thinks that.



And I'm quite well aware that this won't really change anything. Certainly posters here who uncritically believed AOC haven't given the matter a second thought.



But even though I'm in the minority here, I do think the truth still matters, and the difference between being forced to drink out of a toilet and choosing to do so because you aren't aware that other drinking options are actually readily available is a pretty damned big difference. Apparently fake but accurate is still the prevailing standard.
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It ends up being the same thing in my world I.e. someone drinking from a toilet and that shouldn't be happening for any reason.
 
applecorped said:
How many illegal aliens were gassed to death at the Detention Center today?
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Probably the same number the germans gassed in their concentration camps that held people for "protective custody". I think you were probably getting confused between concentration and extermination camps.
 
Darat said:
Probably the same number the germans gassed in their concentration camps that held people for "protective custody". I think you were probably getting confused between concentration and extermination camps.
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He wasn't confused himself. He tried to make others confused.
 
Craig4 said:
Nice strawman. Maybe learn the difference between concentration camps and death camps there sparky.
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Like I said, he knows. He's trying to fringe-reset the discussion in order to confuse people. It's a tactic used by the extreme right to control the conversation.
 
Cainkane1 said:
The children are in separate probably better facilities for their own good. These children are as often as not with an adult that is not a relative who possibly planned to sell them to perverts for sex. They are more likely than adults to have a disease which they can treat at the facility. If these children are indeed separated from their parents it is only a temporary situation.
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Don't forget leprosy, smallpox, gagged women, arab terrorists, and giant calf muscles.
 
Darat said:
It ends up being the same thing in my world I.e. someone drinking from a toilet and that shouldn't be happening for any reason.
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The fact that neither thing should happen doesn't suffice to make them the same. There are still obviously different degrees of badness, and there are still obviously different causes for different bad things. That latter point is especially important if you want to actually do anything about it, rather than just bitch.
 
Ziggurat said:
The fact that neither thing should happen doesn't suffice to make them the same. There are still obviously different degrees of badness, and there are still obviously different causes for different bad things. That latter point is especially important if you want to actually do anything about it, rather than just bitch.
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Well, it's rather cute that you choose to focus only on the drinking from toilet bowls whent there's plenty of other bad stuff going in these concentrationdetention centres.

It's like your house is on fire and the firefighters are discussing whether the cause is electrical or something else. It shouldn't matter at this point in time, first priority should be to douse the flames. Then you can worry about the cause.
 
Amazer said:
Well, it's rather cute that you choose to focus only on the drinking from toilet bowls
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That's the topic on which I had something new to contribute. I have no new information or insights into other issues beyond what others have already posted. Why would I post if I have nothing new to add? Why would you want me to post?
 
Here's a PDF link to OIG report on the Rio Grande section of the border.

There are photos and descriptions of the conditions and overcrowding. One portion notes that adult males were held in "standing room only" conditions for a week. They are becoming so desperate to get out of the overcrowded rooms that they have predictably started to sabotage the toilets so that they can be moved out of the room during maintenance.
 
Ziggurat said:
That's the topic on which I had something new to contribute. I have no new information or insights into other issues beyond what others have already posted. Why would I post if I have nothing new to add? Why would you want me to post?
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I suspect that my reason for wanting you to post are most likely not important to you but I'll give it a shot anyhow.

I would like to regain my respect for American conservatives. I used to admire them for their stance on the role of government, personal responsibility and taxation and government spending. Since 2003 that level of respect and admiration has taken a severe beating with their stance on torture, extradition, , lip service to their stated principles, treatment of Obama and now the apparent apathy and even support of the abuse/ill-treatment of people(and in particular children) that are in the custody of the government.

So yes, I want you to post... I want to see that you aren't blindly supportive of what's going on. I'd like to see that you aren't suffering from apathy when it comes to issues like these.
 
Amazer said:
So yes, I want you to post...
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You want me to post what, exactly? That I think detention center conditions are bad? That I don't like that they're bad? That I want them to be improved? Sure, that's all true. And I said as much before.

But what else do I need to say in order for you to not reflexively condemn me? What else should I be obligated to say?
 
Ziggurat said:
You want me to post what, exactly? That I think detention center conditions are bad? That I don't like that they're bad? That I want them to be improved? Sure, that's all true. And I said as much before.

But what else do I need to say in order for you to not reflexively condemn me? What else should I be obligated to say?
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I guess that I let my frustration with conservatives in general flow into my post to you. For that I sincerely apologize.
 
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