Elizabeth Warren Ancestry Thread

[jimbob]

I love it how you're getting all picky and tentative now about what is racist, after this whopper of a post.

Whataboutism? Is that all you've got? Pffft!

It isn't even whataboutism. True whataboutism boils down to "I'm not going to defend this on its own merits, but claim you support something else bad"



Your post (spoilered below) was listing statements where Trump was disparaging of Blacks or Hispanics, and was *obviously* to anyone who was not being deliberately obtuse - adding context to Trumps remarks.

Recalling Mr. Trump's speeches I heard nothing that would indicate that he's a racist.

Err, what? Really?

In the June 2015 speech announcing his presidency, Trump spent much of the time targeting Mexico and the southern border. He said Mexico was "bringing their worst people" to the U.S. who were "bringing drugs, they’re bringing crime, they’re rapists."

"They’re sending us not the right people," he said. "The U.S. has become a dumping ground for everyone else’s problems."

"Lebron (sic) James was just interviewed by the dumbest man on television, Don Lemon," Trump tweeted. "He made Lebron (sic) look smart, which isn’t easy to do. I like Mike!" (In case you didn't know, Le Bron James is black)

"Congresswoman Maxine Waters, an extraordinarily low IQ person, has become, together with Nancy Pelosi, the Face of the Democrat Party," (In case you didn't know, Maxine Walters is black)

"We have people coming into the country, or trying to come in — and we’re stopping a lot of them — but we’re taking people out of the country. You wouldn’t believe how bad these people are. These aren’t people. These are animals. And we’re taking them out of the country at a level and at a rate that’s never happened before." (he's talking about Mexicans again)

"I have had horrible rulings, I have been treated unfairly by this judge," said in June 2016 during his campaign for president. "Now this judge is of Mexican heritage, I'm building a wall."

"Why are we having all these people from ******** countries come here?" (now he's talking about the Middle East)​

And you don't think any of this is racist?

And of course, there is plenty of other information stretching back decades which also supports your post - Mumbles (for example) has mentioned them.

Sir Drinks a Lot was attacking you for asking The Big Dog to put forward their own reasoning. You had given yours.

 

[Belz...]

That is the single most wrong thing I have seen, well, ever?

That explains the feeling that I had that you didn't re-read your posts before submitting them.

 

[Belz...]

Yes. Because there is only one possible common meaning for any common term.

Speaking of reading posts, you might want to read the one you replied to. Nowhere in it do I imply or suggest that there is only one meaning. It's entirely compatible with a word having several meanings. In fact, since everybody knows that words have several meanings, why the hell did you ever anwser that? Did you think it would lead to a more productive discussion? Or was it just a put down? Was providing the link not enough?

Let me help you: I have never understood any of the meanings of "minority" to relate to "power".

 

[Belz...]

If you say so.

Far as I'm concerned, the meaning of the word "minority" is clear, whether or not the word "group" follows. But there's no reason to quibble over mere semantics.

Though it's interesting to note that, according to this, minorities are perpetually disadvantaged by definition. It certainly opens up things to, let's say, creative interpretations.

 

[Upchurch]

Women get be a minority even though there are more of them because of macro aggression check your privilege shut your mouth.

That being said "minority" is used enough to mean "disenfranchised group" that I don't really need to split that hair.

This is US politics. Despite being roughly half the population, women make up a third of the Supreme Court, maybe a fifth of the legislative branch, and have never been President or even Vice President. Yes, they are considered a minority in US politics.

This is common usage of the term.

 

[P.J. Denyer]

Yeah, for me too: pure curiosity. I think it’s cool that my 11th great-grandfather was born in London and was one of the earliest settlers of Virginia. There is still land there that bears the family name -a subdivision now but built on his land. There are historical markers with his name on it. Cool stuff, for sure, but it says nothing about me at all. It’s not like I can march over to Virginia and lay claim to that land. I also don’t think the fact that my second great-grandmother is on the Dawes rolls (a fact I just discovered after this thread gave me an excuse to trace down my own family lore) makes me an honorary Creek or anything. I just love history and ancestral connections make history more personal.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Is that the world renowned 'Plot 388'?

 

[P.J. Denyer]

Democrats should be busy re-branding every Republican concept with a poisonous word. Think of the brilliance of re-branding "Obama" into an actual bad word, where "Obama Care" becomes an insult? The fact they were able to do that is amazing.

Instead Dems shoot themselves in the foot and then pretend that the resulting dance is performance art.

Sorry for the cynicism.

Here in the UK we had the foresight to get ahead of that particular curve by about seventy years or more-:

Urban Dictionary

 

[Vixen]

Nope. That goes to to her senatorial rival in 2012 who decided to dredge up a decades old claim in order to disparage her. According to Politifact:







You, however, have disparaged Warren over a silly decades old and totally unimportant ticking of a box that gave her no special advantages. You've claimed she has lied about her parents' elopement, her paternal grandparents' bigotry, claimed she was Andrew Jackson's descendant and, when proved wrong, you jumped on another ancestor's actions as if somehow that's relevant and disparaged her every way you can.

Donald Trump is a joke but he does have a gift for stand-up comedy and bullseye insult. He scored bullseye with 'Pocohontas' (and also, 'Rocketman' for Kim). That is seriously funny when you consider Warren's ludicrous claims.

 

[Vixen]

Hmm...neither is true. But no one here has said Warren is an Indian. No one. I don't know why you think otherwise.

You can't really, after her DNA test came back.

 

[TheL8Elvis]

...
ETA I have studied the topic of polio extensively and I am not going to argue with five-second 'google warriors', so this is my last word.

********

 

[River]

This is US politics. Despite being roughly half the population, women make up a third of the Supreme Court, maybe a fifth of the legislative branch, and have never been President or even Vice President. Yes, they are considered a minority in US politics.

This is common usage of the term.

Hey guys and gals, did you hear that? Everyone in the US is a minority, except straight white males.

 

[TragicMonkey]

Can we please stop with all these partisan poliolemics?

 

[Travis]

This is precisely the type of next level nonsense that the Native American authors that I have repeatedly cited expected when she pulled her grossly ignorant stunt. They said that the results would be exploited by people like this to dictate to the Native Americans who is a member of their community/tribes.

It did not take long for us to get there in this thread.

Tribal authorities get to just hand wave away science? If they don't believe in it it isn't true?


That is the truly ignorant decision here.

 

[The Big Dog]

Tribal authorities get to just hand wave away science? If they don't believe in it it isn't true?

That is the truly ignorant decision here.

That is not, of course, what they are doing, and the truly ignorant decision is for a white person to dictate to Native Americans about their culture, you dig?

 

[BrooklynBaby]

Hmm...neither is true. But no one here has said Warren is an Indian. No one. I don't know why you think otherwise.

So, many Democrats aren't saying Fauxcahontas is an Indian, they are just saying she is not, not an Indian? This seems a bit pedantic to me. They're certainly saying something in this interminable thread to defend her claim of being a "woman of color" at Harvard, but one who recently presented a DNA test that proved she wasn't. I mean, this is over, as over as Amanda Knox's case should have been when they found Rudy Guede's DNA all over the crime scene and even inside the body. Yet, on we go....

BTW, a few conservative sites think Fauxcahontas' great great great grandfather actually rounded up Cherokees for the Trail of Tears. It seems possible, but the last actual connection to him is wobbly, so it's not something I would say has been shown to be true. Even if it was to be true, none of us has any control over what our ancestors did, so it's irrelevant, but the irony would certainly be strong.

 

[jimbob]

So, many Democrats aren't saying Fauxcahontas is an Indian, they are just saying she is not, not an Indian? This seems a bit pedantic to me. They're certainly saying something in this interminable thread to defend her claim of being a "woman of color" at Harvard, but one who recently presented a DNA test that proved she wasn't. I mean, this is over, as over as Amanda Knox's case should have been when they found Rudy Guede's DNA all over the crime scene and even inside the body. Yet, on we go....

BTW, a few conservative sites think Fauxcahontas' great great great grandfather actually rounded up Cherokees for the Trail of Tears. It seems possible, but the last actual connection to him is wobbly, so it's not something I would say has been shown to be true. Even if it was to be true, none of us has any control over what our ancestors did, so it's irrelevant, but the irony would certainly be strong.

No, they are saying that Elizabeth Warren reported on a family story that her maternal grandparents had part Native American ancestry - dating back to her great- great- great- grandmother.

That is consistent with her DNA test results

If it was a con, she was playing a long game and was very inept at using it to her benefit.

It seems likely that her family stories are correct.

 

[JoeMorgue]

For ***** sake people just grow up and use people's names.

 

[Craig4]

For ***** sake people just grow up and use people's names.

If you can come up with a better way to dehumanize someone, I'm open to suggestions.

 

[River]

Tribal authorities get to just hand wave away science? If they don't believe in it it isn't true?


That is the truly ignorant decision here.

Yeah, damn those tribes for being able to decide who is a part of them and who isn't. Shame on them for having required lineage, or specific amounts of DNA to prove that. She felt she was NA. That should've been enough along with less than one percent (about as much NA as most people born in this country) If you cannot grasp how this would be offending to members of the NA community, it's time to do some soul searching on the issue.

 

[d4m10n]

Yeah, damn those tribes for being able to decide who is a part of them and who isn't. Shame on them for having required lineage, or specific amounts of DNA to prove that.

Are you aware of any Oklahoma tribes for which DNA testing is considered a relevant criterion?