Cont: Brexit: Now What? Part 5

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Captain_Swoop said:
Tweet from Frankie Boyle that seems to have some merit.

@frankieboyle

Because of the Empire, we developed an elite class addicted to enormous returns on investment , only possible through constant growth. As this becomes impossible, Brexit happens so profits can be delivered through cannibalising previously protected resources, including people.
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I don't get it.
 
Captain_Swoop said:
Look at who is most keen to see Brexit happen.
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I still don't really see the argument. I mean, my assumption was that most parliamentarians and most parties simply didn't want to see Brexit happen at all, but they put it to a vote to shut up some right-wing Tories whose main reason for being pro-Brexit was some kind of flag-wagging nationalism, not for business or even robber-baron reasons.

And the votes for Brexit hardly came from "the elite". They came, in large part, from working class areas where the EU was perceived to have led to a lot of wage deflation and competition for jobs, and Brexit was also supported by the far more anti-capitalist left-wing of the party.

So, really, I cannot see where Frankie is coming from. It sounds like some kind of attempt to put conspiratorial, almost swivel-eyed simplifications on a complex problem, "I bet it's the elites trying to do something really horrible to people because of the elites' evil motives!"
 
angrysoba said:
I don't get it.
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Markets are saturated so there are no new customers to sell to, so the only way to raise profits is to lower costs, and that means making a bonfire of workers rights and environmental protections. It's a race to the bottom with unpleasant long terms consequences, but when business is focused on the next quarter and bosses are only worried about their next bonus it makes a sort of sense.

The theory is tt was these people who so eagerly funded the Leave campaign and helped push the voters towards Brexit.
 
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angrysoba said:
I still don't really see the argument. I mean, my assumption was that most parliamentarians and most parties simply didn't want to see Brexit happen at all, but they put it to a vote to shut up some right-wing Tories whose main reason for being pro-Brexit was some kind of flag-wagging nationalism, not for business or even robber-baron reasons.

And the votes for Brexit hardly came from "the elite". They came, in large part, from working class areas where the EU was perceived to have led to a lot of wage deflation and competition for jobs, and Brexit was also supported by the far more anti-capitalist left-wing of the party.

So, really, I cannot see where Frankie is coming from. It sounds like some kind of attempt to put conspiratorial, almost swivel-eyed simplifications on a complex problem, "I bet it's the elites trying to do something really horrible to people because of the elites' evil motives!"
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I think its referring to the Farages, Rees Moggs, aaron Banks and the likes. The instigators.
 
And advising their clients to shift money out of the UK. Not to forget that the NHS will be up for sale in any new trade deals.
 
jimbob said:
Several of whom are voting with their wallets* against Brexit being beneficial to the UK.

*And/Or getting EU passports.
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Not only that but the resulting chaos also allows US interests to move in hence the sleazing between Trump and Farage.

The NHS for example will be privatised on the back of not having staff or funding to maintain the service - enter US healthcare providers.
 
Archie Gemmill Goal said:
Not only that but the resulting chaos also allows US interests to move in hence the sleazing between Trump and Farage.

The NHS for example will be privatised on the back of not having staff or funding to maintain the service - enter US healthcare providers.
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https://www.theguardian.com/politic...-radical-plan-for-us-uk-brexit-trade-deal-nhs

Guardian said:
Groups linked to Trump and Fox want foreign competition in NHS and regulations bonfire
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Captain_Swoop said:
Look at who is most keen to see Brexit happen.
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Ok...
LR-by-demographics-768x720.jpg

source: https://lordashcroftpolls.com/2016/06/how-the-united-kingdom-voted-and-why/
(labels: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NRS_social_grade )
 
By the graph above: So you turn 45 in the UK and your brain rots. Wonder what the age is in the US. Thirty?

At any rate, hard Brexit is coming. I only hope that it does the right kind of damage and not in too much excess, such that future sanity prevails on both sides of the Channel.
 
ceptimus said:
Calling all those leave voters morons, racists, or some other derogatory term just doesn't wash - there are simply too many of them for that to be a reasonable explanation.
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Yep just like with the Nazi party. You can't just right them off as racists and such, they couldn't have gotten such support with that as their basis.
 
Hlafordlaes said:
By the graph above: So you turn 45 in the UK and your brain rots. Wonder what the age is in the US. Thirty?

At any rate, hard Brexit is coming. I only hope that it does the right kind of damage and not in too much excess, such that future sanity prevails on both sides of the Channel.
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Actually in terms of the biggest drop it looks like the rot sets in about 24. :)

Wonder what the correlation is with reading print newspapers?
 
Jack by the hedge said:
People voted to leave because the level of immigration was too high for too long and there's a threshold above which people get the gut feeling that their high street doesn't feel like home any more and they don't like it. You can dismiss that as racism but... oh, wait, that's exactly what happened, and it did the opposite of helping.
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In the US that is also called either racism of being against progress. It depends on if it is the result of gentrification or immigration.

And of course there is nothing racist about being uncomfortable around too many brown people.
 
ponderingturtle said:
In the US that is also called either racism of being against progress. It depends on if it is the result of gentrification or immigration.

And of course there is nothing racist about being uncomfortable around too many brown people.
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It was perhaps more a case of being uncomfortable around people speaking Polish. The brown people were encamped around Calais, trying to cross the channel.

But it turns out if you tell people they're racists and against progress their takeaway message is that "racists" means whatever they feel about the changes will be ignored and "progress" means you intend the future to be more of these changes they don't like. Who would have thought it?

That makes it a bad time to ask them to vote on what they think of the show so far.
 
Jack by the hedge said:
It was perhaps more a case of being uncomfortable around people speaking Polish. The brown people were encamped around Calais, trying to cross the channel.
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In my experience of those who are uncomfortable around brown people, many seemed to feel that the encampment around Calais was in some sense the EU's fault.

Dave
 
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