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Bigfoot Follies: part deux

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Gilbert Syndrome said:
I agree, and I expanded on this in the "Roger Patterson Belief" thread. While the BLAARG angle is good for explaining some of what goes on, it's a bit of a case of tarring it all with the same brush, it's too easy and convenient an explanation, imo.
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I wish folks would stop with this. I know of no one who claims the whole of bigfoolery is a lie.
 
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Gilbert Syndrome said:
When did I say you did? It's merely that the BLAARG crap gets bandied about literally all the time, lol. You know it does so why bother acting like it doesn't?
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It gets bandied about because it's a reasonable hypothesis to explain some of the sociology behind the bigfoot phenomenon. The problem is that truth and bigfootery go together like logic and bigfootery. I don't think there's any way to determine how much the hypothesis explains because, first, no one much cares, and more importantly, no one much cares.
 
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Resume said:
It gets bandied about because it's a reasonable hypothesis to explain some of the sociology behind the bigfoot phenomenon. The problem is that truth and bigfootery go together like logic and bigfootery.
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And I've never denied that, I effectively have said the same thing on this thread and the "Roger Patterson Belief" thread. My issue is that it's used far too often, and ABP is at least one guy who uses it more often than not, and if I'm not mistaken, seems to think that at least 98% of it is BLAARGing, which I'd disagree with. We already know that enough people in the world believe in far stranger things than Bigfoot, Meldrum included for his Mormonism.
 
I've never really been a fan of the idea of BLAARGING as a big thing in bigfoot land.

I think most footers are simply in it for the benefits to them, whatever they might be, and they fear the loss of those benefits.

I think role-playing is definitely in there somewhere, though.

It's hard to believe ChrisBFRPKY is not role-playing, given his claims and stories, for example.
 
LTC8K6 said:
I think role-playing is definitely in there somewhere, though.

It's hard to believe ChrisBFRPKY is not role-playing, given his claims and stories, for example.
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I agree there, and with guys like NL and OS. Not sure to what extent OS is role-playing, but there's a definite element of it in his behaviour. NL crossed the line into role-playing for sure with the G&P tale, imo.
 
LTC8K6 said:
I've never really been a fan of the idea of BLAARGING as a big thing in bigfoot land.

I think most footers are simply in it for the benefits to them, whatever they might be, and they fear the loss of those benefits.

I think role-playing is definitely in there somewhere, though.
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If I remember correctly, I floated the idea that bigfootery was a kind of LARPing, and the LARPers weren't fond of the association. From there the BLAARG hypothesis arose.

It's hard to believe ChrisBFRPKY is not role-playing, given his claims and stories, for example.
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Well, there's other terms we could use, but they violate the TOS; I'd bet Chris is role-playing, but also may believe. I think many proponents fall into this category.
 
Resume said:
I'd bet Chris is role-playing, but also may believe. I think many proponents fall into this category.
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This was my hypothesis of Roger Patterson's outlook, and it's part of the reason that the "Roger Patterson's Belief in Bigfoot" thread was created.

I don't doubt that Roger held some weird form of reverence for the Bigfoot legend, and in some part, he likely believed it. I don't think you need to be a BLAARG'er to play a hoax. I think you can be a believer and a hoaxer, most definitely. You can even be a con-man and a believer to certain extents. Roger clearly had some weird ideals, and much like Gimlin, likely forgave himself for his sins merely by justifying his wrongs in his own head.
 
I think a lot of us want to believe 'footers are playing games: the other explanation is just too sad.
 
I think part of the reason I have difficulty accepting that there may be very many bigfoot true believers is a failure of mine caused by, perhaps, a too self-centered world view. My incredulity at certain things is so strong that it transfers on to others making it almost impossible for me to accept that anyone could truly believe certain things. Particularly when it requires effort to maintain some of these beliefs. Bigfooters have to actually ignore evidence to maintain their belief. To me, at that point, it is not belief anymore but is a willful denial of reality.

I am fascinated by absurd shared belief systems. I love watching documentaries about Scientology, for example. I am just baffled as to how these people can truly believe. It puzzles me so much that I simply deny that they truly believe. That anyone could truly believe. I think they just pretend so they can belong to something bigger. Something worthwhile in their eyes. I also think most modern Christians are mostly going through the motions as a sort of "what if" afterlife policy.

All of that plus bigfoot enthusiasts, most of them, don't really act like they believe. Or at least, they don't do what I would do if I knew for an absolute fact there were 10 foot apes lurking nearby. Again, maybe I impose too much of my own ideas of expected behavior on to others.
 
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About the nawackies, they are allegedly heavily armed, their claimed goal is to obtain the body of one of those alleged monkeys, they have been allegedly seeing and hunting them for about ten years and in the end what did they get (stories don't count)? nothing, nada, zero... not even a little piece of a suicidal hoaxer. Funny that.:rolleyes:
 
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William Parcher said:
Isn't it only Colyer who is armed? Does anyone here know about who has a gun at Area X?
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http://thislandpress.com/2016/01/22/the-horror-in-the-ouachita-mountains/
This is a good read.
The closest Paul Bowman ever came to killing Bigfoot was in 2011: “I was kicking around camp around two, three in the afternoon when there was a rock impact from the west, a large one—he couldn’t have been far—so I get suited up and grab my camo and rifle and go out. Bob Strain stood guard. Daryl Colyer set off down the path where he’d wounded Bigfoot earlier that year. I thought I’d put the sneak on him and go around by the creek. I look south and see movement about 75–80 yards away, something walking fast through the foliage at a 45-degree angle. I wonder who it is: This is treacherous ground and this guy is gliding over it. There was a break in foliage where two trees had grown apart and the sun was beaming through the canopy, so I wait to see who it was—and here’s my ‘oh ****’ moment—I see him, him; he was backlit by the sun, he had a pointy, conical head that was haloed with reddish fur, and his face and chest were leathery gray like a lady’s handbag, and his movement was fluid almost like he’s bibbity-bopping about on the slippery ground. He’s big too. Built lean and mean. He dips out of sight for a second. My immediate thought was this is Daryl. ‘Bob!’ I said, ‘who’s out there?’ Then my brain starts clicking, that wasn’t Daryl, Daryl doesn’t look like what I saw. I hoist my rifle up and point to where I think he’s going to emerge and I see the head again and take the shot.”

The bullet nicked a branch and deflected upwards and the one they call Beelzebub loped off into the woods and got away.
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Good hunting/gin safety protocol too.
 
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I think it is probably a waste of effort to spend much time debating whether these people actually believe the things they say they do, since there is no method I know of to ever come to any definitive conclusion on the matter. Ultimately, if we're going to participate and hold up our end of the footer/skeptic dance, the successive claims have to be examined the same either way.

If a participating skeptic is fully convinced that the 'footers don't believe their own claims, then the only conclusion to make is that 'footers are entertaining themselves at the expense of the skeptics who expend the energy refuting them. So to continue to participate is to knowingly contribute to their amusement at his own expense. The skeptic loses even if he wins.

I think, another more interesting avenue to explore with these folks, is that there might be something to be inferred about Bigfooters in how they idolize and are enchanted by men with either prestigious or extremely masculine titles, traits or careers.

I believe that in the bigfoot world, the "PhD" or "Special Forces Operator" represents an idolized, unobtainable ideal. And that this is exhibitive of a sort of submissive, self-defeating personality type. Whereas in the skeptic world we don't give very much value to titles alone but instead examine specific claims.

I think this plays out in the NAWAC, where everyday members are under the spell of a certain "former military" spokesman/leader and certain "Wildlife Biologist" spokesman/leader, whose professional-level claims cannot be scrutinized by average, everyday NAWACers since they inherently lack the fortitude/expertise to come to their own conclusions, and would rather have their conclusions dictated to them. It's a very cultish clique, IMO.
 
William Parcher said:
Isn't it only Colyer who is armed? Does anyone here know about who has a gun at Area X?
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https://www.reddit.com/r/bigfoot/comments/2bpc2h/ask_the_nawac/
This might be a dumb question, and I'm sure that you have enough experienced hunters in your group to work it out, but what caliber rifle have you determined sufficient to drop a bigfoot? Knowing that these animals are supposed to be incredibly large and powerful, often compared to a large bear like a grizzly, I assume you would want a gun that is also capable of taking other dangerous game. Something like a .357H&H or .338 maybe?

Besides the overwatch (which is an excellent idea), do you arm yourselves when you're on the ground and out walking around just in case you bump into one?
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bipto said:
Many of us carry .45-70s with 350 grain magnum rounds from Buffalo Bore. A number carry 12 gauge shot guns with rifled slugs and a few carry .30-06s and 308s loaded with Barnes TTSX 180 grain. Nearly all of us are carrying sidearms. Either .45s or .40 S&W.
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Pterodactyl said:
I think it is probably a waste of effort to spend much time debating whether these people actually believe the things they say they do, since there is no method I know of to ever come to any definitive conclusion on the matter. Ultimately, if we're going to participate and hold up our end of the footer/skeptic dance, the successive claims have to be examined the same either way.

If a participating skeptic is fully convinced that the 'footers don't believe their own claims, then the only conclusion to make is that 'footers are entertaining themselves at the expense of the skeptics who expend the energy refuting them. So to continue to participate is to knowingly contribute to their amusement at his own expense. The skeptic loses even if he wins.

I think, another more interesting avenue to explore with these folks, is that there might be something to be inferred about Bigfooters in how they idolize and are enchanted by men with either prestigious or extremely masculine titles, traits or careers.

I believe that in the bigfoot world, the "PhD" or "Special Forces Operator" represents an idolized, unobtainable ideal. And that this is exhibitive of a sort of submissive, self-defeating personality type. Whereas in the skeptic world we don't give very much value to titles alone but instead examine specific claims.

I think this plays out in the NAWAC, where everyday members are under the spell of a certain "former military" spokesman/leader and certain "Wildlife Biologist" spokesman/leader, whose professional-level claims cannot be scrutinized by average, everyday NAWACers since they inherently lack the fortitude/expertise to come to their own conclusions, and would rather have their conclusions dictated to them. It's a very cultish clique, IMO.
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I think it's important to point out when a proponent is telling a story, and explain why.

Bigfootery is indeed cultish.
 
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