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General Holocaust denial discussion Part III

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MRC_Hans said:
Uhm, allow me to remind you of the burden of proof rule:

The party who challenges the accepted paradigm has the burden of proof.

If you want to claim the the holocaust did NOT happen, you must either falsify the existing evidence or provide new evidence supporting your claim. All the rest of us need to do is wait till you do so (and not hold our breath).

Hans
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Good point....how about showing how it works.
According to this site below...ZB worked great for clothing not for people and thats where all the confusion came.
People were mixing the fumigation process up with the propaganda and lies that the Germans were "gassing" people with the ZB.
Technically speaking the way the rooms that they say were gas chambers weren't set up for killing people. Killing lice yes people no.
So for me to prove it didn't happen is pretty easy because through science and technology we see it can't be done the way the camps were set up.
But you HoloHuxsters can believe the moon is made of cheese also and there is not much I can say because I was never on the moon to check it out.

http://nazigassings.com/zyklondelousing.html

I'm sure some of you skeptoids know the truth but refuse to accept it.
Or I hate to say have some cognitive issues you're dealing with.

JR
 
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A small blurb of info: "German archbishop, Cardinal Faulhaber of Munich ... informed the Americans that during the Allied air raids on Munich in September 1944, 30,000 people were killed. The archbishop requested the authorities at the time to cremate the bodies of the victims in the crematorium at Dachau. But he was told that, unfortunately, this plan could not be carried out; the crematorium, having only one furnace, was not able to cope with the bodies of the air raid victims. Clearly, therefore, it could not have coped with the 238,000 Jewish bodies which were allegedly cremated there."
 
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DianeKayKing said:
A small blurb of info: "German archbishop, Cardinal Faulhaber of Munich ... informed the Americans that during the Allied air raids on Munich in September 1944, 30,000 people were killed. The archbishop requested the authorities at the time to cremate the bodies of the victims in the crematorium at Dachau. But he was told that, unfortunately, this plan could not be carried out; the crematorium, having only one furnace, was not able to cope with the bodies of the air raid victims. Clearly, therefore, it could not have coped with the 238,000 Jewish bodies which were allegedly cremated there."
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Having been to Dachau, I know this is utter rubbish.
 
DianeKayKing said:
A small blurb of info: "German archbishop, Cardinal Faulhaber of Munich ... informed the Americans that during the Allied air raids on Munich in September 1944, 30,000 people were killed. The archbishop requested the authorities at the time to cremate the bodies of the victims in the crematorium at Dachau. But he was told that, unfortunately, this plan could not be carried out; the crematorium, having only one furnace, was not able to cope with the bodies of the air raid victims. Clearly, therefore, it could not have coped with the 238,000 Jewish bodies which were allegedly cremated there."
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No serious scholar has ever claimed that 238,000 Jewish bodies had been cremated at Dachau concentration camp. In fact I have never read such statement.
 
threadworm said:
We do have them, you're just too lazy to find them.
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Actually, too lazy to click on the links we've provided. His method is to ask for photographs, when shown photographs to pretend he wasn't or to say they don't show enough bodies or every site or whatever, and then simply to revert back to asking for photos as though we'd not been through this before.

His obsession with photographs of the crime scenes is really odd; I guess it is so that he can always say, without explaining why, that there should be more photographs than those that exist.
 
MRC_Hans said:
Uhm, allow me to remind you of the burden of proof rule:

The party who challenges the accepted paradigm has the burden of proof.
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Indeed. And the explicit goal of "revisionism" is to challenge and revise the basic historical conclusions drawn by historians and other scholars working in the field. Yet deniers seem barely familiar with the recent scholarship they claim needs revision - and, in Jim's case, not even conversant with high-school level history of the period, let alone recent scholarly interpretations. Jim is unable to state correctly any of that which he purports to challenge - and then, as you put it so well, he refuses to produce or explain evidence that challenges works we cite, link to, or base our thinking on.
 
DianeKayKing said:
A small blurb of info: "German archbishop, Cardinal Faulhaber of Munich ... informed the Americans that during the Allied air raids on Munich in September 1944, 30,000 people were killed. The archbishop requested the authorities at the time to cremate the bodies of the victims in the crematorium at Dachau. But he was told that, unfortunately, this plan could not be carried out; the crematorium, having only one furnace, was not able to cope with the bodies of the air raid victims. Clearly, therefore, it could not have coped with the 238,000 Jewish bodies which were allegedly cremated there."
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The claims in the quoted material don't make sense. It would help readers (two have already complained, and I now I am doing so) deal with such discrepancies if you had provided a source for what you quoted - not doing so is quite discourteous.

The problem is (I am going on memory as I am traveling and without access to books on Dachau) that somewhere around 200,000 prisoners passed through Dachau - and these included "Poles, Russians, Ukrainians, French, Yugoslavs, Czechs, Germans, Austrians, Hungarians, Italians, Jews, Homosexuals, Jehovah’s Witnesses, Communists, Gypsies" according to Wikipedia. Even at war's end, political prisoners made up the large majority of prisoners. In other words, Jews were not the majority - and nowhere near 238,000 Jews perished at Dachau. The camp's total death toll has been estimated in the 30,000+ range. IIRC there were early, high estimates of the number of deaths at Dachau - right after liberation. But recent studies would not, to the best of my recollection, support the claim that "238,000 Jewish bodies" were cremated at Dachau or anything like it (leaving aside the faulty logic used by the author you quote), but, please, a link to your source so that I can try to figure out where this 238,000 figure comes from . . .
 
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LemmyCaution said:
The claims in the quoted material don't make sense. It would help readers (two have already complained, and I now I am doing so) deal with such discrepancies if you had provided a source for what you quoted - not doing so is quite discourteous.

The problem is (I am going on memory as I am traveling and without access to books on Dachau) that somewhere around 200,000 prisoners passed through Dachau - and these included "Poles, Russians, Ukrainians, French, Yugoslavs, Czechs, Germans, Austrians, Hungarians, Italians, Jews, Homosexuals, Jehovah’s Witnesses, Communists, Gypsies" according to Wikipedia. Even at war's end, political prisoners made up the large majority of prisoners. In other words, Jews were not the majority - and nowhere near 238,000 Jews perished at Dachau. The camp's total death toll has been estimated in the 30,000+ range. IIRC there were early, high estimates of the number of deaths at Dachau - right after liberation. But recent studies would not, to the best of my recollection, support the claim that "238,000 Jewish bodies" were cremated at Dachau or anything like it (leaving aside the faulty logic used by the author you quote), but, please, a link to your source so that I can try to figure out where this 238,000 figure comes from . . .
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238,000 from here not that it matters to you..
https://furtherglory.wordpress.com/2015/04/14/how-many-prisoners-were-murdered-at-dachau/

JR
 
JimRizoli said:
About those MASS graves....how many people are you talking here and pictures please.
I have a problem believing in such nonsense without pictures....
Is there a reason why we DON'T have any pictures?
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I feel the need, once again, to remind our confused newcomer that a Polish investigative commission found a gigantic amount of human remains at Treblinka in 1945, that similar finds were made at Belzec and Chemno by similar commissions, and that Polish paramilitary and police forces found additional remains when responding to robbery diggers. I also cannot empathize enough that a Polish archaeologist, Andreaz Kola, found 33 mass graves at Belzec in the late 1990's and early 2000's.
 
Degeneve said:
No serious scholar has ever claimed that 238,000 Jewish bodies had been cremated at Dachau concentration camp. In fact I have never read such statement.
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My point.

At Dachau, maybe 30K, many of them in cruel human experiments.

The 238K figure comes from the feverish thoughts (if such they can be so described) of deniers.

The horror of that camp is more accurately described by the activities of one Dr. Rascher, whose "work" at Dachau continues to this day to inform aircraft design.

That is just a little sick, but data is data. We might not like how it was despicably gathered, but it is valid data.

The method of gathering that data, well, that is a different thing. There is no end to which I would not go to make such a person suffer that would consider using human guinea pigs up to, and beyond, death.

And right there is the difference. In the allied sphere, it was voluntary to submit to testing for anything. In Nazy Germany, it was instructed, no choice allowed.
 
HDenier said:
If you will notice the cowardly way our post are showing edits and supposed rules violations. Of course others slanderous name calling is ignored. This shows that this list has lost the debate about the holohax, and now are looking for "technicalities " of rule violations that obviously aren't going to stop. This is how it is done...It happened in another group that was run by bigots and haters, that got all exposed thank God...
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Your expulsion from SSF occurred due to your spewing of violent and racist rhetoric, your getting clobbered and mauled in all debates, and your writing abusive emails to the moderator. It was justified, and if your conduct here is any indication you and your brother are headed for a similar fate once again. Please note that I have received edits as well.
 
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JimRizoli said:
And exactly what did you see in Dachau?

A fake "gas" chamber? WOW....that is pretty incriminating! LOL



JR

CCFIILE.COM
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Not that you'll follow the link, read it or actually learn, but Dachau never had a gas chamber, nor has anyone claimed it had.
 
JimRizoli said:
238,000 from here not that it matters to you..
https://furtherglory.wordpress.com/2015/04/14/how-many-prisoners-were-murdered-at-dachau/

JR
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First, what you linked to is not the source which DianeKayKing used and which I asked about.

Second, that blog says that the 238,000 number was an early, retracted claim and that about 206,000 prisoners were ever registered at Dachau, and that "According to a report made by the International Tracing Service at Arolson, Germany in 1977, there were 31,951 deaths at the main Dachau camp during the 12 years that the camp was in existence." It does not confirm that 238,000 Jewish bodies, as Diane King claimed, were cremated at Dachau - quite the contrary.

Third, can you not summarize the sources that you yourself use accurately?
 
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