Another story this morning is that Jeremy Corbyn would consider women-only rail carriages.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-34059249
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-34059249
-
Security incident: ISF was recently accessed by intruders. Please change your password, and change it anywhere else you used it. Read more
Jeremy Corbyn might actually win?
- Thread starter Giz
- Start date
Interesting. And perhaps women getting cat-called can be prevented by putting them in burqas or not leaving going out in public without a chaperone.
What a surprise - if you read what was actually said and published it is far cry from the headlines.
Rat
Not bored. Never bored.,
Quite so. He has announced that he wants to women safer on transport and elsewhere, moots several possibilities, says that some women have raised the idea of women-only carriages, and indicates that he would be willing to consult on whether this would be a good and welcome idea. This is then presented as his idea, and one that he intends as policy. Presumably when people suggest ideas to him, he should condemn them out of hand.
baron
Unregistered
- Joined
- Dec 8, 2006
- Messages
- 8,627
Yes, for ideas that are clearly absurd, insulting and retrograde that's exactly what he should do. A strong, confident leader - someone secure in their principles - will not respond, "Hey, let's throw it out there," for any old toss that someone whispers in their ear. Perhaps next he'll 'consider' blacks-only carriages to combat the problem of racism on public transport, it's such a progressive idea I doubt it's been tried anywhere before...
There was a leftist feminist addressing this issue on the BBC earlier, and it's probably the only time I've been in complete agreement with such a person.
I read that: "[Junior] rail minister Claire Perry suggested introducing women-only carriages was an idea worth considering in September last year."
Meanwhile, if Corbyn had dismissed the idea out-of-hand as "absurd, insulting and retrograde" he would, of course, have been slaughtered for being insensitive to the dangers run by women on public transport.
Rat
Not bored. Never bored.,
It's not an idea that I support, and I do feel that it's insulting and retrograde, but if several women had asked me about it, I would at least consider consulting on the matter if for no other reason than to find out why they thought it a good idea.
trustbutverify
Penultimate Amazing
- Joined
- May 5, 2007
- Messages
- 10,544
I don't think it's that crazy of an idea.
Rat
Not bored. Never bored.,
I don't think it a crazy idea, which is why I would be willing to hear someone explain to me why they think it a good idea. But I do think of it as a bad idea.
baron
Unregistered
- Joined
- Dec 8, 2006
- Messages
- 8,627
The feminist on the BBC made the pertinent point that this proposition is very reminiscent of Islamic fundamentalists. If women are being abused then instead of addressing the problem simply remove the women from the equation. Sorted, because then, if a woman refuses to get on the women-only carriage and is abused, it must be her own fault, right? I guess these are the sort of ideas one gets through consorting with Islamic extremists.
Rat
Not bored. Never bored.,
I think that's going rather too far. There is a gym that is open only to women within a couple of hundred yards of my house. There are other sorts of businesses that are open only to women. I don't like that this is the case, but if the trains are a business (which, to my regret, they are), and if some women would feel safer in a women-only carriage, it is at least worth a consultation, if for no other purpose than to establish why it's an inherently bad idea.
And again, this wasn't a policy that he proposed. It was something that he related that had been put to him as part of a larger point. To bring Islamic fundamentalism into it is at least in bad taste, if not simply irrelevant.
baron
Unregistered
- Joined
- Dec 8, 2006
- Messages
- 8,627
This isn't a business decision based on convenience or utility, Corbyn isn't trying to maximise profits for the rail industry (as if!), it's a policy option, ostensibly as some sort of solution to criminality. If a woman chooses not to go to a women-only gym then that choice comes with no negative connotations. It's not a social issue or a criminal one. Women-only gyms aren't places that women go to avoid being abused, they're places they go to exercise without feeling self-conscious.
I know he didn't propose it but to countenance it is just as bad. I've no objection to him saying he's discussed it and doesn't agree with it, but that's not what he said.
And I think it's very relevant to bring up Islamic practice because many Islamic cultures actively practice this very same principle - the segregation of women from men to allegedly prevent the former from being abused by the latter. And if a woman refuses to be segregated, what's the conclusion? Well, she gets what she deserves. We're talking about criminality here but all this loony idea achieves is confining the potential victims whilst the perpetrators go free; kind of an about-face approach to justice IMO.
This political correctness is to me a real worry, we need to be able examine all ideas not knee jerk a "no" because something doesn't fit in with our ideals.
Actually it isn't. If it was akin to that it would be suggesting women not be allowed on public transport. This idea is to deal with an apparently serious problem that actually exists. Is it an ideal solution of course not but for me the test would be will it work whilst we try to tackle the problems in other ways?
I'm open to it being discussed and if it can be shown to work then why would I oppose it?
No. A private business may not discriminate on grounds of gender, ethnicity etc in the provision of goods or services, even if doing so would be profitable. Is that not reasonable?
Rat
Not bored. Never bored.,
As I've already said, there is a gym near me that is open only to women.