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Heeeeeeere's Obamacare!

The $2,500 figure is an estimate of how much extra the average family pays per year for insurance and medical care due to cost shifting. This figure does represent savings that could be passed on to consumers as cost shifting is reduced. But even when fully implemented, the ACA will not entirely eliminate cost shifting. And medical providers are likely to pocket some of the savings as increased profits.

Obama was wrong to imply all of this would be passed on to consumers. But the number is real.

ETA: The ACA may be too complex to explain to the average American. The voter's eyes glaze over when politicians explain things in detail. But when things are simplified, opponents respond by yelling "liar, liar". The $2,500 figure is one example. Keep your plan, keep your doctor is another.
 
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Looking at Eddie's county on Healthcare.gov, he did have only two insurance carriers to chose from and the prices look high compared to some other areas of the country. Part of this is a problem of rural areas. In a large city, insurers have a choice of providers and some ability to bargin. In a rural area, there is seldom much competition.

The other issue is the politics of Georgia. The state legislature has been busy throwing spanners in the gears to make Obamacare fail. This may have kept some carriers from participating. Those that did would set premiums high in anticipation of having low participation rates and a customer base dominated by those who already had medical problems.

ETA: Happy birthday Eddie!
 
Kestrel said:
The $2,500 figure is an estimate of how much extra the average family pays per year for insurance and medical care due to cost shifting. This figure does represent savings that could be passed on to consumers as cost shifting is reduced. But even when fully implemented, the ACA will not entirely eliminate cost shifting. And medical providers are likely to pocket some of the savings as increased profits.
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That figure for the amount of cost-shifting before Obamacare sounds way too high, unless you're counting the cost-shifting from Medicaid and Medicare to private insurance, which Obamacare exacerbates. Please provide a reference to support your claim. This link indicates that the $2500 figure included a wildly optimistic estimate of savings from the move to electronic recordkeeping and disease prevention.

And of course the previous cost of uncompensated care, which was previously borne by those with private insurance, is now being borne by taxpayers. That's not actually savings. It's just dumping the costs on a different segment of the population.
 
sunmaster14 said:
That figure for the amount of cost-shifting before Obamacare sounds way too high, unless you're counting the cost-shifting from Medicaid and Medicare to private insurance, which Obamacare exacerbates. Please provide a reference to support your claim. This link indicates that the $2500 figure included a wildly optimistic estimate of savings from the move to electronic recordkeeping and disease prevention.

And of course the previous cost of uncompensated care, which was previously borne by those with private insurance, is now being borne by taxpayers. That's not actually savings. It's just dumping the costs on a different segment of the population.
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The Factcheck.org article commented on what Obama said, not the original study that was the source of the $2,500 figure. Unfortunately, the noise from political postings makes it almost impossible to find that study. But I will provide a link if I manage to find it.

Yes, some of the burden has been shifted from those who need medical care to taxpayers making more than $250k a year. It see this as a good thing.
 
My lovely state of Florida, who is always trying to be #1 at the worst of things, has succeeded at losing out on the most money by declining the ACA's expansion of Medicaid.

A joint report from the Robert Wood Johnson Foundation and the Urban Institute projects that, over the next 10 years, the state will leave $66.1 billion in Medicaid funding on the table by not approving the expansion included in the Affordable Care Act to cover individuals with income up to 138 percent of the federal poverty level.

That will mean more than 1 million uninsured state residents will not qualify for health care coverage, the report said.
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The town I live in has one of the country's top hospitals (Shands) that employs people all over the state.

Over the next decade, Florida’s hospitals will miss out on $22.6 billion in federal reimbursements, the report projected.
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http://www.gainesville.com/article/...-most-for-not-expanding-Medicaid-studies-show
 
Another wrinkle.

We've been told on this site repeatedly how horrible our prior low coat, high deductible plan was, and to realize that the higher premiums Karen is facing are at least accompanied by better coverage.

Our prior AETNA plan covered prescription drugs. So does her new, more expensive "bronze" plan". But when she called around yesterday because she's running low on one drug, she found that our new plan does not cover the drug she's taking (already generic). What was a $20 copay refill would now be in excess of $200 for the same drug.

We were introduced to one way of saving on that, via online coupons. We'll try that, and can also call her doctor to see if there's an alternative drug which is covered.

Again, just single data points. But it does seem like one convoluted, broken and arbitrary system has been replaced with another convoluted, broken and arbitrary system. For us, so far, even with the increased rates Obamacare has hardly been a panacea, albeit for us just 3 weeks in.
 
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Off topic, but I just got this in the mail today from the provider of my Medicare supplemental insurance:

15106090330_dfdd235ea7.jpg


Routine colonoscopy, no polyps or anything special.

I don't know if this shows a system that's broken, or just bizarrely structured.

Doctor bills over $8,000, but has contracted to take more like $700.

When all is said and done, my out-of-pocket is around $150.

Its just too weird for someone not fully inculcated in the system.
 
Fast Eddie B said:
Off topic, but I just got this in the mail today from the provider of my Medicare supplemental insurance:

15106090330_dfdd235ea7.jpg


Routine colonoscopy, no polyps or anything special.

I don't know if this shows a system that's broken, or just bizarrely structured.

Doctor bills over $8,000, but has contracted to take more like $700.

When all is said and done, my out-of-pocket is around $150.

Its just too weird for someone not fully inculcated in the system.
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That is weird, colonoscopys normally cost around $2000.

My out of pocket is $0, so I don' actualy care.
 
When I priced my stomach surgery and the surgery to remove the mass on my leg, both were priced in the tens of thousands. Stomach surgery was, IIRC, about 30,000.

That was before I had insurance. The bills I got, the ones that the insurance paid, were a fraction of the cost because the Insurance company had a contract with the surgeons.
 
Unabogie said:
Ok, we've put up with stories for pages and pages. But this is just beyond the pale. Now you're just screwing with us.

:D
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I assume it was a Russian or German name "Anglicized" at Ellis Island or elsewhere*. I'll ask him next time I see him!

I may also ask him about the rationale of billing such a high amount in the first place.

*As was my family name.
 
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And a sprain cost me almost 500 dollars.... I sprained the ankle back in July and had it checked since my trip was coming up and didn't want to be walking on the Slieve Leagues with an injury I wasn't fully assessed on... At last word they're supposed to contact my insurance so I can figure out what I owe to them, but for some reason or another the urgent care center said I didn't have insurance. I'm waiting to see when I get home this weekend if that's been sorted or not, or if it's still pending.

The fall was bad enough that although it happened about two months ago, the tendons in my ankle are still sore as a <insert favorite word here>. Nothing broken based on the x rays, just the tendons all around the whole joint got jarred (foot turned at a right angle and is sore/irritated when flexed still)... the sticker shock makes me wonder if I should even bother getting something like this checked if god forbid it happens again.

I'll report back if/when there are updates

As an aside I got to do all of my walking along the cliffs for my vacation... what had me concerned was if I needed to be worried about something that'd make it easily reinjured. It seems taking things cautiously did the trick of not aggravating it too much.
 
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Reading discussions about ACA insurace on social media sites, I find it stunning how many Anericans don't understand basic insurance terms. People are being told that the Out of Pocket maximum is the maximum the insurance company will pay. Few seem to understand the difference between the individual deductible and the family deductible. Policies that waive the deductible for the first three doctor visits are described as only allowing three doctor visits.
 
Kestrel said:
Reading discussions about ACA insurace on social media sites, I find it stunning how many Americans don't understand basic insurance terms. People are being told that the Out of Pocket maximum is the maximum the insurance company will pay. <etc... snip>.
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What bothers me is, most aren't misunderstanding due to their own miscomprehension. These misinterpretations are being deliberately disseminated.

Another interesting emergence is the way people cling to and defend the factually incorrect explanations, and dismiss or reject the actual facts.

It makes it impossible to even discuss the ACA on many message boards. Few agreed-upon facts, no willingness from many parties to consider primary sources, it goes straight to poo-flinging. :(
 
RedPillNeo said:
What bothers me is, most aren't misunderstanding due to their own miscomprehension. These misinterpretations are being deliberately disseminated.

Another interesting emergence is the way people cling to and defend the factually incorrect explanations, and dismiss or reject the actual facts.

It makes it impossible to even discuss the ACA on many message boards. Few agreed-upon facts, no willingness from many parties to consider primary sources, it goes straight to poo-flinging. :(
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It is a bit frustrating to see a link from Heathcare.gov dismissed as propaganda by people who accept Breitbart as gospel.
 
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