Cop Protects and Serves an Innocent 17 Year Old Into a Coma

[ponderingturtle]

So it wasn't the taser.

And people claimed I killed that guy, really it was the trains fault. I just pushed him a little.

 

[Beerina]

I am done with cops using excessive force and violating the law.

And I don't care what their unions say.

Every one of them should have video on them 100% of the time while on duty, and disabling that should be a felony.

Yes but...I want to know if these incidents are on an increase or decrease. That's how you measure progress, or lack of it.

For example, murders are half of what they were when I was a kid. Gun laws have little to do with it, in spite of the hot air on both sides.

 

[geni]

Does this thing happen more in the US than in other western democracies?

Well america contains more people than any other western democracy.

Getting dirrect statistics is difficult. For example the UK currently appears to be averaging around 20 deaths in police custody per year (due to the low numbers there are pretty large error bars on that figure. in the decade up to 2009 it was 30 a year). However that doesn't include cases where people haven't been formaly arrested. Deaths during pursuit is 10-20 and shootings less than 10.

Total number of deaths in custody (which includes prisions) is around 500 per year although that contains a higher percentage of women than would be expected.

I dopn't know the US figures.

 

[shuttlt]

Uncontrolled standing falls are dangerous. Hell look at those people who died from less noticeable impacts like Liam Nessons wife or Billy May.

I think the early reports said that Billy Mays died from a head injury, but it turned out that it was heart disease.

 

[Tony]

this is true, but I'm not sure I want my life accessible on-line every-time I come within view of a cop. I agree it's a good thing to keep cops honest, but do you really want to effectively turn every cop in to a free-roaming surveillance camera accessible by everyone?

How much of your life would be online when you come into view of cops though? Unless you have close contact with the police daily, I struggle to see how much of your life would actually be online through such a source.

 

[shuttlt]

Well america contains more people than any other western democracy.

Getting dirrect statistics is difficult. For example the UK currently appears to be averaging around 20 deaths in police custody per year (due to the low numbers there are pretty large error bars on that figure. in the decade up to 2009 it was 30 a year). However that doesn't include cases where people haven't been formaly arrested. Deaths during pursuit is 10-20 and shootings less than 10.

Total number of deaths in custody (which includes prisions) is around 500 per year although that contains a higher percentage of women than would be expected.

I dopn't know the US figures.

Looks like just under 2000 deaths in a three year period while arresting people (not quite the same as your stats). 55% of which were
http://www.bjs.gov/index.cfm?ty=pbdetail&iid=379

The US population is about 5 times bigger than the UK population. So you'd expect about 400 people in the UK to die over three years.... so about 130.

They have a table of state by state figures here:
http://www.bjs.gov/content/dcrp/dcst.pdf

From that same link "Local jail deaths, 2000-2006" it looks like there are about 1000 deaths in local jails per year, so that would map to an expectation of 200 in the UK.

Unless my rather approximate maths, or the figures are wrong... the US numbers are around an order of magnitude higher that the UK once you allow for the population difference.

 

[Charlie Wilkes]

Does this thing happen more in the US than in other western democracies?

It certainly seems to, but both the US media and the soon to be former JREF both report heavily on this sort of thing so my perception may be miles off.

It seems to happen all over the world. Here's a recent story from Canada...

http://www.torontosun.com/2014/09/05/quebec-city-cops-pinned-dying-cyclist-to-ground-witnesses-say

The average cop on the beat has a high school education and not much intelligence, and the job is a magnet for people who like to throw their weight around.

 

[geni]

How much of your life would be online when you come into view of cops though? Unless you have close contact with the police daily, I struggle to see how much of your life would actually be online through such a source.

The problem is more that the bits of your life that do involve contact with the police are more likely to be those which you wish to keep private.

 

[geni]

It seems to happen all over the world. Here's a recent story from Canada...

http://www.torontosun.com/2014/09/05/quebec-city-cops-pinned-dying-cyclist-to-ground-witnesses-say

Canda has about 70K police officers. One case doesn't mean very much. This is a problem you have to approach statisticaly.

The average cop on the beat has a high school education and not much intelligence,

Varies but in any case that doesn't make them bad people. In fact someone who will follow say PACE codes to the letter would in many was make a better front line officer than someone who would get imaginative.

 

[Tony]

The problem is more that the bits of your life that do involve contact with the police are more likely to be those which you wish to keep private.

With police body cameras and dash cameras, those interactions are already being recorded. So I still don't see a problem. I admit that I haven't thought about this angle much so I am probably missing something, but under what citizen/police interaction scenario (excluding things like someone's ass showing during a drunkin traffic stop) would citizen privacy be a concern to the point where it would supersede issues about police transparency and accountability?

 

[geni]

With police body cameras and dash cameras, those interactions are already being recorded. So I still don't see a problem. I admit that I haven't thought about this angle much so I am probably missing something, but under what citizen/police interaction scenario (excluding things like someone's ass showing during a drunkin traffic stop) would citizen privacy be a concern?

The police visit say Huntingdon Life Sciences as part of an investigation into death threats. That results in a lovely video of the people who work there.

Police visit a strip club as part of an investigation into money money laundering. No one in that senario wants their image on the web.

Police respond to a sexual abuse case. Lot of stuff there people wish to keep private.

 

[Spindrift]

The average cop on the beat has a high school education and not much intelligence, and the job is a magnet for people who like to throw their weight around.

According to this survey 88% have at least a 2 year college degree. 48% have a 4 year degree. That's a lot higher than the general population.

http://www.fbi.gov/stats-services/p...ay/higher-education-and-local-law-enforcement

 

[Ziggurat]

I don't think cops or elected officials are entitled to privacy.

But the citizens they end up filming are.

I'm all for transparency, and think cops should wear cameras anytime they're on patrol (though your idea of them having no right to privacy even in the bathroom is nonsense). And the film that they take should be easy to obtain by the people who are filmed any time there's a "contact". But if ALL the film is always made public, that's not OK either, because that invades the privacy rights of average citizens who may have done nothing wrong.

 

[Spindrift]

But the citizens they end up filming are.

I'm all for transparency, and think cops should wear cameras anytime they're on patrol (though your idea of them having no right to privacy even in the bathroom is nonsense). And the film that they take should be easy to obtain by the people who are filmed any time there's a "contact". But if ALL the film is always made public, that's not OK either, because that invades the privacy rights of average citizens who may have done nothing wrong.

There is no way ALL film should always made public. Cops spend a lot of time with victims and witnesses during investigations not just criminals.

 

[The Norseman]

I am done with cops using excessive force and violating the law.

And I don't care what their unions say.

Every one of them should have video on them 100% of the time while on duty, and disabling that should be a felony.

I think it should be a statutory offense as well, so that mens rea doesn't enter into it.

 

[I Ratant]

...
The US population is about 5 times bigger than the UK population. So you'd expect about 400 people in the UK to die over three years.... so about 130.

...

.
Underachievers... try harder!

 

[The Norseman]

Canda has about 70K police officers. One case doesn't mean very much. This is a problem you have to approach statisticaly.

The US has, IIRC, around a million police officers. I'm kinda a math dummy so I'll have to wait until someone is kind enough to crunch some numbers for us.

 

[The Norseman]

Police visit a strip club as part of an investigation into money money laundering.

Shouldn't that be "money money laundering laundering"? Gotta get that money twice as clean!

 

[Max_mang]

Does anyone know exactly what the rules are when you are pulled over? I remember years ago in my town there was someone impersonating a cop, pulling women over and raping/robbing them. There was an article in the local newspaper from the police chief stating that you never had to to get out of your car or roll down a window. You could press your ID up against the closed window for them to see it. You could also request that they call for a backup officer for validation, or you could call 911 on your cell phone to request another officer.

Despite that, I've seen several articles where police allegedly took physical action against someone who wouldn't open their door or roll down a window. I saw a video on a COPS-type show where a woman was on a cell phone during a standard traffic stop and the officer tased her. The show actually played it off as 'getting what she deserved'. Granted she was annoying, but is that really criminal?

About 2 years ago I was pulled over for making an illegal right on red at 4am in a deserted intersection. The officer got on a loudspeaker and instructed me to get out of my car and approach the police car.

If we do have rights to our own safety when pulled over, do the police really observe/respect them?

 

[Polaris]

The US has, IIRC, around a million police officers. I'm kinda a math dummy so I'll have to wait until someone is kind enough to crunch some numbers for us.

1 in 330 Americans is a cop? I think you might be misremembering.