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Continuation Part Nine: Amanda Knox/Raffaele Sollecito

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Vibio said:
Good reasonable observations.
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With one (possible) exception.

Unless one is proceeding from the presumption that extradition is a given - then RS making it clear that Knox is involved would have an effect.

ps I am not familiar with and am not interested in the twitter etc back chat.
The press conf and further moves in that regard are the substantial issue here.
 
platonov said:
stilicho - Really ?

This is a perfect example of the weakness of the standard PGP argument

We skeptics are busy here thoroughly examining [for the 437th time] a vital topic --
The 'forensic' minutiae concerning the murder victims genitalia/crotch area etc and what do you post.

A topical (as regards the english language media) reference to what appears to the latest salvo from the Sollecito family.

This is a skeptics thread - we don't need any reference to current topics, thank you very much.

Now, have we discussed vaginal contusions recently ?
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I think we should climb thru the window, leave crap in the toilet, do a one foot boogie down the hall while cleaning up the blood.

Rinse, repeat endlessly.
 
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Samson said:
It's come down to bear bating. Mad Max 4 just made, Acbytesla, did the Madmax movies come to USA?
Mad max 3 had the classic concept, two men go in, one comes out (alive).
There is a grotesque pleasure announced by Stilicho and his friends, at this manufactured communication breakdown.
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I head they were restarting the series, but I hated the original moves so I haven't paid that much attention. I don't get the interest in these movies at all.. So I'm not sure what bear baiting means..
 
platonov said:
With one (possible) exception.

Unless one is proceeding from the presumption that extradition is a given - then RS making it clear that Knox is involved would have an effect.

ps I am not familiar with and am not interested in the twitter etc back chat.
The press conf and further moves in that regard are the substantial issue here.
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But he's not really doing that. More like he's walking down the middle of the road. Dangerous thing to do.
 
Vibio said:
The FUNNIEST thing: below is a link to one of the supposed original police documents about the issue.

Note the font:

http://www.perugiamurderfile.org/download/file.php?id=10284&mode=view

An official document from "The Questura of Perugia" written in the font "comic sans"?

ROTFLMAO

And note the chicken scratch signatures:

http://www.perugiamurderfile.org/download/file.php?id=10285&mode=view

This is obviously a fake.


---
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Well, the document does look clownish, and now that the children are faking documents it's certainly feasible that this thing is a fake.

Assuming for a minute that it's real, though, one thing that interests me is the date: January 19, 2008. What else was happening around this time? Well, in the previous week, the lab completed the secret re-run resulting in the "incriminating" bra clasp profile. See here: http://murderofmeredithkercher.com/batch-5-bra-clasp-contamination-undocumented-re-run-tampering/

The references and attributions to KNOX, Amanda Marie certainly seem gratuitous and forced, and raise suspicion about what exactly these cops would have been up to.
 
general versus specific answers with respect to the stain

Vibio said:
I then quoted Vinci from the link provided by another poster. This is what he (Vinci) wrote:

"it is not possible to date when the stains were left."

However the poster Strozzi makes his claim that yes in fact the stain can be dated:
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Vibio,

My answer was both general and specific. In general, neither DNA nor presumptive/confirmatory tests for blood can be dated, and it is likely that this is what Professor Vinci meant. It is a lesson that Massei seemed not to understand, based on his discussion of mixed DNA. However, as many of us noted, this stain can be dated. Guede's shoe treads are there, and I quoted a passage directly from Vinci's report, showing Vinci's conclusions with respect to the type of shoe. It seems that Vinci dates the stain by means of the treads. In addition, if the stain has Rudy's DNA, the the fact that he had not been to the cottage before effectively dates the state, as several of us, including me, also pointed out. Several of us have tried to assuage your self-acknowledged ignorance of the stain (and it would seem, of forensics in general). The lessons do not seem to have worked.
 
acbytesla said:
I head they were restarting the series, but I hated the original moves so I haven't paid that much attention. I don't get the interest in these movies at all.. So I'm not sure what bear baiting means..
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Interestingly they promote the new movie as being dialogue free, and I totally understand that this will not do it for you, a dedicated conversationalist.
Bear baiting from wiki

Bear-baiting was popular in England until the nineteenth century. From the sixteenth century, many bears were maintained for baiting. In its best-known form, arenas for this purpose were called bear-gardens, consisting of a circular high fenced area, the "pit", and raised seating for spectators. A post would be set in the ground towards the edge of the pit and the bear chained to it, either by the leg or neck. A number of well-trained hunting dogs, usually Old English Bulldog, would then be set on it, being replaced as they got tired or were wounded or killed.

I hope no one from the dark side imagines their participation in this sport.
 
tsig said:
I think we should climb thru the window, leave crap in the toilet, do a one foot boogie down the hall while cleaning up the blood.

Rinse, repeat endlessly.
Click to expand...

If you want to make a show, don't leave out the Bumbling Lying Squad and the Comedy Forensics team, who left the entire courtroom laughing with their video of the Bra Clasp skit.

Personally I'd like to hear Mig's exaggerate on the budget cuts that happened only for the hours of the infamous Tea Party with screaming included.

A compromised crime scene, lying police, and Rudy Guede who fooled them all.
 
Vibio said:
Assuage?

Nice try at twisting things around (what else is new?) but no Bub, the conversation about "can the stain have been dated as to when it was left" was simple, clear and precise. The conversation however, was not understood by you., claiming as you did that I was asking about DNA.
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But Vibio, Why by default applaud the generally civilised protocols of this forum by savaging PMF, then still obfuscate around the probable semen stain of probably Rudy Guede

Resident and literate Italians (though you are a british expat surely) will be always loved.
 
Samson: go over my posts about the semen stain. What would you like to know? What have I written that was not clear to you?
 
NancyS said:
So do you think the stain can be dated Vibio? Do you think Meredith is the kind of girl to put her semen encrusted pillow straight in the wash - or is she the sort of girl who likes to sleep on semen encrusted pillows for days on end? If you really think she is the kind of girl that is happy to sleep for days in bed linen covered in sexual fluids, is it really reasonable for the prosecution to suggest that household slovenliness was a cause of tension between Amanda and Meredith?

Although surely it should be common sense to anyone with a brain that neither DNA or semen stains can be dated - and that neither should be used to convict people that had legitimate contact (or legitimate sexual contact) with the victim and the crime scene. Finding the semen of the man Meredith was having sex with is not suspicious - just as finding the DNA of Amanda in the house she lived, is not suspicious. The semen and DNA is only useful if you are trying to find evidence of someone who had no legitimate contact/sexual contact with the victim and no legitimate reason to be in the house where the crime took place.
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There have been multiple cases where somebody was exonerated because a semen stain was tested years after the crime it came up as somebody else.
Maybe the woman was a bad cleaner in those cases as well. Somehow most judges don't accept that as an argument.
 
How about a date?

Having a look at this photo,
I can see the 2 probable seminal fluid stains on the edge of Miss Kercher's pillow case.
picture.php


But the freshly made shoe-imprint stains that Rudy Guede left after stepping in another,
unfound probable semen stain, which he then transferred onto the middle of the pillowcase photo above,
is not visible to my eye. Can you see it?

Here it is again, seen under different lighting:
picture.php


This dates that semen stain that Rudy stepped in elsewhere and placed here
as being sometime after 9:00pm on the night of 1 November, 2007.
It's a simple fact.

Look at the photo below,
Rudy DID NOT step in these 2 probable semen stains on the edge of the pillow, right?
There are no Nike shoe imprint rings in these 2 stains, connected by a thin trail of what? Seminal fluid?
picture.php


We can not date the probable semen stains on the edge of the pillowcase unless they too are from the same person as the 1 that Guede left by shoeprint, which he stepped in somewhere else other that the edge of Meredith's pillow...
Right?
 
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Greetings all,
I'm going to change the subject abit,
follow and help me out if you will, ok?
I've been looking at Crime Scene photos for the last 1/2 hour of my life,
trying to understand what Rudy Guede, and maybe someone else did that night.

Miss Kercher was wearing her bra when she was brutally stabbed in the neck,
there are blood drops on it, right?
picture.php



But what about her pants and her underwear?
Was blood ever found on these 2 items?
picture.php

I seem to recall reading that there was no bloody fingerprints
found on the button/zipper of her blue jeans, right?

So were they removed 1st before she was stabbed?
If so, by whom?
 
Continuing onward from my post above,
I'm wondering more about what happened inside Meredith's bedroom,
and I seem to recall she was kinda neat, for she seemed to complain about Amanda's bathroom habits,
right?

Amanda's,
picture.php


Filomena's,
picture.php


and Laura's beds
picture.php

were made when these photos were shot after Meredith was found murdered.

I assume that Meredith, being a tiddy kinda gal,
had hers made also before her murder happened.


Questions:
After stabbing Meredith with her t-shirt up, exposing her bra to blood droplets, Guede is still holding a bloody knife in his hand, right? Were Meredith's pants and underwear still on? When were they taken off? There does not seem to be much blood, if any on them, like on her bloody bra. Wouldn't Rudy's hand be bloody?

When does Rudy grab Meredith's quilt,
err duvet if you wanna call it that, and cover her?
picture.php

As he holds the bloody knife?

Rudy put the knife down at some point.
There doesn't seem to be any bloody knife imprints on the duvet that he covered her with,
but there is a bloody knife imprint on her bedsheet, near her purse.
picture.php

And I'm perplexed by this. He lifted up the duvet, laid the knife on the bedsheet and then took the duvet off her bed and covered her? Surely the duvet was not all bunched up like Stefanos' bedspread downstairs was. I just can't see Rudy, covered in blood, shaking the crumpled duvet open to then place it carefully over Meredith.

And when did Rudy, if it's his seminal fluid, ejaculate on the edge of the pillowcase and elsewhere, which he stepped in? Before he stabbed Meredith in her throat, got blood all over himself, cleaned himself up in Meredith's bathroom, covered her with the duvet and then laid the knife down on her bedsheet? Man, for some reason I can visualize someone else there with Guede, could he have blonde hair?
 
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When I look at the photograph in my previous post above of the duvet covering Meredith,
I wonder where are the edges of it that should lie near the bed?

It looks like, to my sunburnt surfer eyes,
that the edge of the duvet is actually lying underneath Meredith
and possibly underneath her presumed seminal-fluid-stained pillow too.

How did Guede do this with a bloody knife in his hand?
Did he lift up the duvet, place the bloody knife on the bed sheet,
pull the duvet down a bit onto the floor, place Meredith's probable semen stained pillow underneath Meredith as he rolled her onto the pillow as she lay dying on her left side, clutching that blonde hair found in her dying grasp, and then covered her? Is that why Rudy left all those bloody Nike shoeprints, and that 1 probable Nike semen encrusted shoe-ring imprint on her pillow? And was this when Guede-o left the blood smeared finger marks on the wall above Meredith's bed?
picture.php

Or are those wall marks from Meredith herself? Or someone else?
Odd how they were not ID'ed by ILE Forensic scientists.

Arrrgh,
IMHO, seeing all of Meredith Kercher's blood on her bedroom floor
is very, very sad.
:mad:


PS-Sorry for all the pix,
BUT they do tell the true story waaaay better than words do, right?
 
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Telegraph
11:01AM GMT 07 Nov 2007

She makes no mention of Sollecito in her profile.

She is however chided by her aunt - who is unnamed on MySpace- for having a picture of an apparently naked man called Federico on her page.

Her aunt warned her: "Do not get naked with strange Italian men!!” Knox replied that Federico was just a friend.
Click to expand...


Anyway, Federico does not appear in Amanda's partner list in her diary (HIV false positive case).
 
RWVBWL said:
When I look at the photograph in my previous post above of the duvet covering Meredith,
I wonder where are the edges of it near the bed?

It looks like, to my sunburnt surfer eyes,
that the edge of the duvet is actually lying underneath Meredith
and possibly underneath her presumed seminal-fluid-stained pillow too.

How did Guede do this with a bloody knife in his hand?
Did he lift up the duvet, place the bloody knife on the bed sheet,
pull the duvet down a bit onto the floor, place Meredith's probable semen stained pillow underneath Meredith as he rolled her onto the pillow as she lay dying on her left side, clutching that blonde hair found in her dying grasp, and then covered her? Is that why Rudy left all those bloody Nike shoeprints, and that 1 probable Nike semen shoe-ring imprint on her pillow? And when Guede-o left the blood smeared finger marks on the wall above Meredith's bed? Or are those wall marks from Meredith herself? Or someone else?
Click to expand...
The way I see it, she was lying on her left side after the assault, right by the wardrobe. He took the duvet off the bed and laid it on as much of the floor as was accessible. Then he rolled her over on her back, on top of it. That's how come her right arm and right leg look the way they do. At some juncture, he also undressed her, and tried to mop up blood on the part of the floor he could not cover with the duvet. And he did all this because he wanted to sexually assault her but was put off by all the blood.
 
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